Wikipedia:Graphics Lab/Images to improve/Archive/Jul 2008: Difference between revisions

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'''Article(s):''' Several

'''Request:''' Vectorise please. Thanks -- '''[[User:Mangwanani|<fontspan colorstyle="color:green;">Mangwanani</fontspan>]]''' ^{[[User talk:Mangwanani|<fontspan colorstyle="color:green;">(talk)</fontspan>]]} 18:36, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

'''Graphist opinion:'''

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::That's fine and all, but the current image is not a raster of the VI version; it looks like it's been replaced last month, without updating the license. So where'd the current one come from? [[User:MissMJ|MissMJ]] ([[User talk:MissMJ|talk]]) 22:23, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

:::Dunno, but if we get the Vector done then it won't matter... '''[[User:Mangwanani|<fontspan colorstyle="color:green;">Mangwanani</fontspan>]]''' ^{[[User talk:Mangwanani|<fontspan colorstyle="color:green;">(talk)</fontspan>]]} 16:58, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

:::Ask user [[User:Avala]] on Commons and revert the image before it's deleted (Unsurprizingly, someone marked the new version as NSD!)!. [[Special:Contributions/68.39.174.238|68.39.174.238]] ([[User talk:68.39.174.238|talk]]) 21:35, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

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The present New Zealand arms are a 1956 revision of the 1911 design. The crest was changed to the Crown of St. Edward, the quarterings were redrawn, and the supporters, instead of facing the front, now faced each other. The motto was changed to “New Zealand”.|http://www.teara.govt.nz/1966/C/CoatsOfArms/National/en}}

:Any takers? '''[[User:Mangwanani|<fontspan colorstyle="color:green;">Mangwanani</fontspan>]]''' ^{[[User talk:Mangwanani|<fontspan colorstyle="color:green;">(talk)</fontspan>]]} 16:15, 9 June 2008 (UTC)

Done. [[User:Sodacan|Sodacan]] ([[User talk:Sodacan|talk]]) 04:43, 28 March 2009 (UTC)

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'''Graphist opinion:''':

How about an SVG? I can give it a go when I'm on the right computer later... '''[[User:Mangwanani|<fontspan colorstyle="color:green;">Mangwanani</fontspan>]]''' ^{[[User talk:Mangwanani|<fontspan colorstyle="color:green;">(talk)</fontspan>]]} 12:20, 10 June 2008 (UTC)

:: I hate to be the one to bring it up, but the image is fair use so it shouldn't really be here... On the other hand I don't see that SVGifying it would do any harm. [[User:Time3000|Time3000]] ([[User talk:Time3000|talk]]) 14:29, 10 June 2008 (UTC)

::: What is the track record of fair use raster to svgs surviving? I would think it's clearly a violation of the terms of (fair) use, since you can scale it to any resolution you like. We had this discussion about the Interpol logo, and it didn't fly. [[User:Dhatfield|Dhatfield]] ([[User talk:Dhatfield|talk]]) 14:52, 10 June 2008 (UTC)

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}}

:::::As far as I'm aware you can have SVG free use. Such images do exist on the wiki...'''[[User:Mangwanani|<fontspan colorstyle="color:green;">Mangwanani</fontspan>]]''' ^{[[User talk:Mangwanani|<fontspan colorstyle="color:green;">(talk)</fontspan>]]} 15:23, 10 June 2008 (UTC)

::::::I'm guessing the second file should not be on commons. There is no free way (i.e. non derivative) of doing the monogram. /[[:User:Lokal Profil|Lokal]][[Special:Contributions/Lokal Profil|_]][[:User talk:Lokal Profil|Profil]] 17:54, 10 June 2008 (UTC)

:::::::If you are right, that it is forbidden to do a .SVG from a fair use .gif, the template above <nowiki>{{SVG|fairuse}}</nowiki> should be deleted, since it serves no purpose. [[User:Hektor|Hektor]] ([[User talk:Hektor|talk]]) 18:06, 10 June 2008 (UTC)

::::::::All I'm saying is that an svg (or png) designed from a fair use image remains copyrighted by the copyright holder of the fair use image. Whether the new image qualifies for fair use or not I don't know. /[[:User:Lokal Profil|Lokal]][[Special:Contributions/Lokal Profil|_]][[:User talk:Lokal Profil|Profil]] 18:25, 10 June 2008 (UTC)

:::::::::So it is allowed to do a .png out of it, upload it on English language wikipedia claiming fair use - since it is non scalable contrary to .svg - , not uploading it to Commons ? Can I ask for that here ? and what about a .svg ? [[User:Hektor|Hektor]] ([[User talk:Hektor|talk]]) 18:30, 10 June 2008 (UTC)

::::::::::Just had a thought, could this be recreated in SVG freely in the similar style a flag or COA can be? What I'm thinking is of calling this a flag as surely, its used in that style, similar to the [[:Image:Royal Standard of the United Kingdom.svg|Queen's standard]] '''[[User:Mangwanani|<fontspan colorstyle="color:green;">Mangwanani</fontspan>]]''' ^{[[User talk:Mangwanani|<fontspan colorstyle="color:green;">(talk)</fontspan>]]} 18:51, 10 June 2008 (UTC)

:::::::::::The differences between CoAs and this image is that CoAs are defined by a [[blazon]]. That means that a free version can be created from the blazon (not from an existing interpretation of it which is why [[:Image:Coat of Arms of Iceland.svg]] is in trouble). Simply recreating an image in svg does not delink the svg image from the copyright of the original, this is why images such as Coat of Arms of Johannesburg above are in trouble. /[[:User:Lokal Profil|Lokal]][[Special:Contributions/Lokal Profil|_]][[:User talk:Lokal Profil|Profil]] 12:29, 11 June 2008 (UTC)

:::::::::::: As I understand it the template <nowiki>{{SVG|fairuse}}</nowiki> is indeed a completely pointless contradiction. "...information that could be stored more efficiently and/or accurately in the SVG format". While arguably technically true, functionally nonsense. The fair use rationale stipulates that the image must be low-res. So even if you make a vector version you still have to ''render'' it in low res. The "efficiency" difference between a 30kB PNG and a 20kB SVG is negligible, and the rendering resources needed for SVG do away with that benefit. Accuracy is irrelevant, because you still have to ''deliver it to the viewer'' at low accuracy (ie. low res). Someone could download it themselves and view it in high res, but then ''they'd'' be in violation of fair use. No matter which way you slice or dice it that template is an invitation to waste your time. [[User:Dhatfield|Dhatfield]] ([[User talk:Dhatfield|talk]]) 18:17, 11 June 2008 (UTC)

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{{SVG-Trademark}}

:::::::::::::: That being said, I'd be most thankful if someone cares to produce a nice fair use .PNG of the standard of Prince Albert II. [[User:Hektor|Hektor]] ([[User talk:Hektor|talk]]) 18:27, 11 June 2008 (UTC)

:::::::::::::::Find a blazon and create the image springs to mind, bearing in mind the cliché "easier said than done". The Joburg raster was uploaded by Flagmanbruce who says he is the FOTW Southern Africa administrator (for want of a better word). '''[[User:Mangwanani|<fontspan colorstyle="color:green;">Mangwanani</fontspan>]]''' ^{[[User talk:Mangwanani|<fontspan colorstyle="color:green;">(talk)</fontspan>]]} 19:41, 11 June 2008 (UTC)

:But thats just the thing. Coat of arms (and coat of arms like flags) have a blasoning, logos and monograms normaly don't, thus making free versions of the impossible. The Joburg raster is the same as that [http://flagspot.net/flags/za-gt-jb.html#jb here] and is thus not an "original interpretation of the blason" but rather a copyrighted interpretation from 1997. The fact that Flagmanbruce has scanned it gives him no copyrightrelated rights. Thus since the new vector version are a derivative of these they are also copyrighted by whoever created the raster. In order to create a truly free image the new one would have to based only on heraldic rules and the text:

{{quotation|ARMS: Vert, a fret couped Or, the mascle voided Gules, between in chief and base respectively four shield thongs Argent; behind the shield a spine erect Or, plumed Sable.

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::Shoot, that needs translation into English. I couldn't draw anything from ''that'' description, that's for sure. [[User:MissMJ|MissMJ]] ([[User talk:MissMJ|talk]]) 22:38, 11 June 2008 (UTC)

Back to the Joburg Arms, it isn't entirely based on the raster. My trace obviously was but the rest of the work done by other users was an interpretation of the raster... '''[[User:Mangwanani|<fontspan colorstyle="color:green;">Mangwanani</fontspan>]]''' ^{[[User talk:Mangwanani|<fontspan colorstyle="color:green;">(talk)</fontspan>]]} 15:51, 12 June 2008 (UTC)

:I know it isn't entirely based on the raster (let's call it the "official interpretation") but both the trace and iterpretations of the "official interpretation" are processes which create works that are derivatives of the "official interpretation", and those covered by it's copyright. As an example if you watch all of the Star Wars movies and then draw a free hand sketch of the Millenium Falcon then that is stil a derivative of the copyrighted movies.

:What's needed in order to make the image free is basically that you completely forget about the "official interpretation" and do a new image based on the blazon only. As for the blazonings being written in code I wholehartedly agree, it's hard enough to understand them when they are written entierly in one language (swedish for the ones I've done) but the english ones always seem to contain about 50% french in them. There is a heraldic glossary somewhere on Wikipedia (lost the link) but to start I'd recommend asking one of the heraldicaly experienced editors to translate the description to plain english (e.g. [[:commons:User:SanchoPanzaXXI|SanchoPanzaXXI]]), after a while you'll start understanding the ''code''.

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<gallery class="center">

Image:DominionFlag of Newfoundlandthe RedDominion Ensignof Newfoundland.svg|Flag of the Dominion of Newfoundland

</gallery>

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::Now three out of the four triangles have been corrected, but the top one is still transparent. [[User:Hektor|Hektor]] ([[User talk:Hektor|talk]]) 07:35, 13 June 2008 (UTC)

:::Please note that image 2 is Fair Use so any derivative will be similarly copyrighted. /[[:User:Lokal Profil|Lokal]][[Special:Contributions/Lokal Profil|_]][[:User talk:Lokal Profil|Profil]] 11:55, 13 June 2008 (UTC)

::::In all fairness, an interpretation on a blazoning isn't going to be too different to that image as its pretty plain and simple. Not like a COA with intricate detials... '''[[User:Mangwanani|<fontspan colorstyle="color:green;">Mangwanani</fontspan>]]''' ^{[[User talk:Mangwanani|<fontspan colorstyle="color:green;">(talk)</fontspan>]]} 15:29, 13 June 2008 (UTC)

:::::True, but this can only be done if the flag (and the Coat of arms) is in fact based on a blason rather then just being a logos in the shapes of Flags and CoAs. Considering the nation in question it would surprise me if they were based on blasons. /[[:User:Lokal Profil|Lokal]][[Special:Contributions/Lokal Profil|_]][[:User talk:Lokal Profil|Profil]] 16:07, 13 June 2008 (UTC)

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'''Graphist opinion:''' There was already an SVG version in use, but it looked traced. Rather than overwrite it, I uploaded a new one converted from a unicode font with burmese characters in it — <b class="IPA">[[User talk:Ch1902|<span style="color:#800080">₪₪</span>]] [[User:Ch1902|<span style="color:#800080">ch1902</span>]] [[Special:Contributions/Ch1902|<span style="color:#800080">₪₪</span>]]</b> 10:56, 25 April 2008 (UTC)

:I also created one based on the jpg with Inkscape--[[User:Cradel| <fontspan colorstyle="color:gray;">'''''Cra'''''</fontspan>]][[User Talk:Cradel|<fontspan colorstyle="color:gray;">'''''del'''''</fontspan>]] 10:59, 25 April 2008 (UTC)

::I'd go with yours, that font did not scale up at all well! — <b class="IPA">[[User talk:Ch1902|<span style="color:#800080">₪₪</span>]] [[User:Ch1902|<span style="color:#800080">ch1902</span>]] [[Special:Contributions/Ch1902|<span style="color:#800080">₪₪</span>]]</b> 11:49, 25 April 2008 (UTC)

:'''Please overwrite what I have labeled #1''' with the much better #2, thanks! [[User:Kintetsubuffalo|Chris (クリス • フィッチ)]] ([[User talk:Kintetsubuffalo|talk]]) 13:57, 25 April 2008 (UTC)

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'''Article(s):''' [[w:tr:Gagavuzya]] (exemplary:http://tr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Resim:Gagavuzya_arms%C4%B1.png ), [[w:tr:Tibet]]

'''Request:''' Hello.I am Turkish Wikipedian.Turkish Wikipedia and other Wikipedias need colored and svg format [[:Image:Coat of arms of Gagauzia.svg]] and svg format [[:Image:Tibetarms.jpg]].Excuse me.I don't speak Engilish enough.Urgent, please! [[Kullanıcı:Lord Leatherface|<fontspan colorstyle="color:Red;">'''Signore Faccia di cuoio'''</fontspan>]] [[User Talk:Lord Leatherface|<fontspan colorstyle="color:red;">^'''ileti'''</fontspan>]] 19:42, 19 May 2008 (UTC)

::Isn't this the same request as [[Wikipedia:Graphic Lab/Images to improve#Coat of arms of Gagauzia|above]]? [[User:Mangwanani|Mangwanani]] ([[User talk:Mangwanani|talk]]) 18:06, 19 May 2008 (UTC)

:::Looks like it, except for the Tibet CoA part. /[[:User:Lokal Profil|Lokal]][[Special:Contributions/Lokal Profil|_]][[:User talk:Lokal Profil|Profil]] 19:02, 20 May 2008 (UTC)

:::Yes Mangwanani.I have exemple.This [http://tr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Resim:Gagavuzya_arms%C4%B1.png] is colored Gagauzia arms. Color [[Image:Coat of arms of Gagauzia.svg]] (example:[http://tr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Resim:Gagavuzya_arms%C4%B1.png])Please.[[User:Lord Leatherface|<fontspan colorstyle="color:Red;">'''Signore Faccia di cuoio'''</fontspan>]] [[User Talk:Lord Leatherface|<fontspan colorstyle="color:red;">^'''ileti'''</fontspan>]] 23:49, 20 May 2008 (UTC)

::::Before anyone can work on that svg, they need to know what the text in that COA is. The second word looks like YERS or YERI. It is ambiguous and it would help if the exact word and spelling was known. [[User:XcepticZP|XcepticZP]] ([[User talk:XcepticZP|talk]]) 23:55, 20 May 2008 (UTC)

:::::It's ''Gagauz Yeri''—see [[Gagauzia|the article]]. I'll gladly take this one now we have a color version to work from. Lord Leatherface, please remove the Turkish arms from your signature—images in signatures are [[Wikipedia:SIG#Images|not allowed in the English Wikipedia]] :) [[User:Fvasconcellos|Fvasconcellos]]<small>&nbsp;([[User talk:Fvasconcellos|t]]·[[Special:Contributions/Fvasconcellos|c]])</small> 00:07, 21 May 2008 (UTC)

::::::Would someone like me to colour and PNG the raster or is that a waste of resources if we're going straight to vector? [[User:Mangwanani|Mangwanani]] ([[User talk:Mangwanani|talk]]) 16:11, 21 May 2008 (UTC)

I don't speak English.I speak Turkish.Colored Gagauzia arms Please.[[Kullanıcı:Lord Leatherface|<fontspan colorstyle="color:Red;">'''Signore Faccia di cuoio'''</fontspan>]] [[User Talk:Lord Leatherface|<fontspan colorstyle="color:red;">^'''ileti'''</fontspan>]] 19:52, 23 May 2008 (UTC)

I found this image on the commons and it looks a bit different than the link Lord Leatherface gave :

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Image:Gerb gag.jpg

</gallery>

It is also the one used on the [http://incubator.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wp/gag gaugazian wikipedia] (its a test wiki)--[[User:Cradel| <fontspan colorstyle="color:gray;">'''C'''</fontspan>]][[User Talk:Cradel|<fontspan colorstyle="color:grey;">'''D'''</fontspan>]] 21:01, 23 May 2008 (UTC)

:Excellent, thank you. The shield is done—now for the rest :) [[User:Fvasconcellos|Fvasconcellos]]<small>&nbsp;([[User talk:Fvasconcellos|t]]·[[Special:Contributions/Fvasconcellos|c]])</small> 22:16, 23 May 2008 (UTC)

::OK, done. How's this? [[User:Fvasconcellos|Fvasconcellos]]<small>&nbsp;([[User talk:Fvasconcellos|t]]·[[Special:Contributions/Fvasconcellos|c]])</small> 14:31, 31 May 2008 (UTC)

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Well, I just combined the 2 SVG's. :)

Cheers!

[[User: auawise|<fontspan sizestyle="2.5"font-size:small; color=":blue;">&Lambda;ua&int;</fontspan>]][[User:auawise|<fontspan colorstyle="color:red;">Wi</fontspan>]][[User:auawise|<fontspan colorstyle="color:gray;">se</fontspan>]] ^{<small>([[User talk:Auawise|Operibus anteire]])</small>} 11:42, 7 July 2008 (UTC)

:Fixed the source info. Don't forget to link to the components that you use to make up the image. not doing so is in violation of the hat images license . /[[:User:Lokal Profil|Lokal]][[Special:Contributions/Lokal Profil|_]][[:User talk:Lokal Profil|Profil]] 16:27, 7 July 2008 (UTC)

::Well, thanks! Mark as done?

::Cheers mate!

::[[User: auawise|<fontspan sizestyle="2.5"font-size:small; color=":blue;">&Lambda;ua&int;</fontspan>]][[User:auawise|<fontspan colorstyle="color:red;">Wi</fontspan>]][[User:auawise|<fontspan colorstyle="color:gray;">se</fontspan>]] ^{<small>([[User talk:Auawise|Operibus anteire]])</small>} 17:21, 7 July 2008 (UTC)

== Text vector ==

{{resolved|1=[[Special:Contributions/68.39.174.238|68.39.174.238]] ([[User talk:68.39.174.238|talk]]) 02:06, 8 July 2008 (UTC)}}

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Was easy enough, I hope it's good. I think it does its job for the purposes of that article, but feel free to correct me. :)

Cheers!

[[User: auawise|<fontspan sizestyle="2.5"font-size:small; color=":blue;">&Lambda;ua&int;</fontspan>]][[User:auawise|<fontspan colorstyle="color:red;">Wi</fontspan>]][[User:auawise|<fontspan colorstyle="color:gray;">se</fontspan>]] ^{<small>([[User talk:Auawise|Operibus anteire]])</small>} 11:31, 7 July 2008 (UTC)

:Image refuses to display on MW... Did you trace it, or...? [[Special:Contributions/68.39.174.238|68.39.174.238]] ([[User talk:68.39.174.238|talk]]) 21:03, 7 July 2008 (UTC)

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<gallery class="center">

File:Battle of Flamborough Head map as of 23 September 1779.gif

File:Battle of Flamborough Head map as of 23 September 1779.svg|SVG

Image:Jpj-23sep1779-1200.svg|SVG

Image:Jpj-23sep1779-1200(2).svg‎|SVG, take 2.

Image:Jpj-23sep1779-1200(3).svg|SVG, take 3.

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'''Oppinion:'''

Here is my initial attempt at it...any suggestions? :)

[[User: auawise|<fontspan sizestyle="2.5"font-size:small; color=":blue;">&Lambda;ua&int;</fontspan>]][[User:auawise|<fontspan colorstyle="color:red;">Wi</fontspan>]][[User:auawise|<fontspan colorstyle="color:gray;">se</fontspan>]] ^{<small>([[User talk:Auawise|Operibus anteire]])</small>} 12:28, 7 July 2008 (UTC)

:There is this problem with transperancy in the background so if anyone can fix it...

:Cheers!

:[[User: auawise|<fontspan sizestyle="2.5"font-size:small; color=":blue;">&Lambda;ua&int;</fontspan>]][[User:auawise|<fontspan colorstyle="color:red;">Wi</fontspan>]][[User:auawise|<fontspan colorstyle="color:gray;">se</fontspan>]] ^{<small>([[User talk:Auawise|Operibus anteire]])</small>} 12:39, 7 July 2008 (UTC)

::I think this map will benefit from being turned 90 degrees counterclockwise and made bigger so that the labels aren't squished in. Lowercase labels will help too, IMO. [[User:MissMJ|MissMJ]] ([[User talk:MissMJ|talk]]) 19:37, 7 July 2008 (UTC)

:::Maybe something like that? [[User: auawise|<fontspan sizestyle="2.5"font-size:small; color=":blue;">&Lambda;ua&int;</fontspan>]][[User:auawise|<fontspan colorstyle="color:red;">Wi</fontspan>]][[User:auawise|<fontspan colorstyle="color:gray;">se</fontspan>]] ^{<small>([[User talk:Auawise|Operibus anteire]])</small>} 20:18, 7 July 2008 (UTC)

::::Yes, only I wonder if you could increase the size of the base map to as to avoid the appearance of all the text crowding it (Also it would allow writing "F.H." out) and secondly, the edges of the things like the North arrow would appear sharper and less "traced". Finally, I suspect the text should be "Jones' fleet" for the possessive. The idea of the turning it is probably a good one; if anyone later determines it would be better the original way, it should be easier to change an SVG than a GIF. Thanx, [[Special:Contributions/68.39.174.238|68.39.174.238]] ([[User talk:68.39.174.238|talk]]) 21:10, 7 July 2008 (UTC)

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<gallery class="center">

File:Battle of Flamborough Head map as of 23 September 1779.gif

File:Battle of Flamborough Head map as of 23 September 1779.svg|SVG

Image:Jpj-23sep1779-1200.svg|SVG

Image:Jpj-23sep1779-1200(2).svg‎|SVG, take 2.

Image:Jpj-23sep1779-1200(3).svg|SVG, take 3.

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'''Oppinion:'''

Here is my initial attempt at it...any suggestions? :)

[[User: auawise|<fontspan sizestyle="2.5"font-size:small; color=":blue;">&Lambda;ua&int;</fontspan>]][[User:auawise|<fontspan colorstyle="color:red;">Wi</fontspan>]][[User:auawise|<fontspan colorstyle="color:gray;">se</fontspan>]] ^{<small>([[User talk:Auawise|Operibus anteire]])</small>} 12:28, 7 July 2008 (UTC)

:There is this problem with transperancy in the background so if anyone can fix it...

:Cheers!

:[[User: auawise|<fontspan sizestyle="2.5"font-size:small; color=":blue;">&Lambda;ua&int;</fontspan>]][[User:auawise|<fontspan colorstyle="color:red;">Wi</fontspan>]][[User:auawise|<fontspan colorstyle="color:gray;">se</fontspan>]] ^{<small>([[User talk:Auawise|Operibus anteire]])</small>} 12:39, 7 July 2008 (UTC)

::I think this map will benefit from being turned 90 degrees counterclockwise and made bigger so that the labels aren't squished in. Lowercase labels will help too, IMO. [[User:MissMJ|MissMJ]] ([[User talk:MissMJ|talk]]) 19:37, 7 July 2008 (UTC)

:::Maybe something like that? [[User: auawise|<fontspan sizestyle="2.5"font-size:small; color=":blue;">&Lambda;ua&int;</fontspan>]][[User:auawise|<fontspan colorstyle="color:red;">Wi</fontspan>]][[User:auawise|<fontspan colorstyle="color:gray;">se</fontspan>]] ^{<small>([[User talk:Auawise|Operibus anteire]])</small>} 20:18, 7 July 2008 (UTC)

::::Yes, only I wonder if you could increase the size of the base map to as to avoid the appearance of all the text crowding it (Also it would allow writing "F.H." out) and secondly, the edges of the things like the North arrow would appear sharper and less "traced". Finally, I suspect the text should be "Jones' fleet" for the possessive. The idea of the turning it is probably a good one; if anyone later determines it would be better the original way, it should be easier to change an SVG than a GIF. Thanx, [[Special:Contributions/68.39.174.238|68.39.174.238]] ([[User talk:68.39.174.238|talk]]) 21:10, 7 July 2008 (UTC)

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* '''Note :''' some indications are in the SVG ; the file have 11 sections (you can copyedit just 2: each help is welcome) ; 3 are missing and will be add later.

I will not work on this tutorial this week allowing the volunter to work as much as he want.

[[User:Yug|Yug]] [[User talk:Yug|<small><fontspan style="color:green;">(talk)</fontspan></small>]] 17:48, 7 July 2008 (UTC)

'''Graphist opinion:'''<br .>