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{{WikiProject Computing |class=C |importance=Low |software=y |software-importance=Mid}}▼
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{{WikiProject Android |importance=High}}
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{{old AfD multi
|date1 = July 25 2011 |result1 = '''redirect to [[JetBrains]]''' |page1 = Kotlin (programming language)
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{{tmbox
|image = [[Image:Ambox warning orange.svg|{{#ifeq:|yes|30px|50px}}]]
|text = {{strong|A warning about certain sources}}: Blog articles and tutorials often copy text from Wikipedia to introduce the programming language they're writing about. While the claims they repeat are generally not contentious, these sources should nevertheless be avoided to reduce the [[citogenesis]] or [[WP:CIRCULAR|circular reporting]] risk to Wikipedia. Watch for similar wordings, maybe interspersed with text copied from different sources, and avoid these sources to prevent a [[Wikipedia:List of citogenesis incidents|citogenesis incident]].
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==Draft articles related to this topic==
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== Edit Request ==
{{
I am working at JetBrains and I have a conflict of interest with this article. I would like to request for editing regarding incorrect information.
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{{border |[[File:Crystal_Clear_app_help_index.svg|20px]]{{nbsp|2}}'''Clarification requested'''{{nbsp|2}}|display=table |width=1px |style=double |style2=dotted |color=black |lh=1}}
* It is not known what is meant by the word ''primarily''. When making distinctions about sponsorhips that are somehow divided amongst different entities, a specific metric should be used for clarity. For example, if Company A provides half of the creative material and three-quarters of the funding, then those portions should be described as 50% and 75%, respectively.
* With regards to the Foundation's purpose, that is already evident through the use of the phrase {{tq|Kotlin is sponsored by JetBrains and Google through the Kotlin Foundation.}} If the sponsorship of Kotlin is administered ''through'' the Kotlin Foundation, then it is ''already'' implied that the purpose of that foundation is to protect, promote, and advance the development of Kotlin — for such is the logic of
* When ready to proceed with the requested clarifications mentioned above, kindly change the '''{{tlx|request edit}}''' template's answer parameter to read from '''{{para|ans|yes}}''' to '''{{para|ans|no}}'''. Thank you!<br>
Regards, <span style="font-size:75%;border:2px solid red;border-radius:50px;font-color:#008">[[User:Spintendo|<span style="color:#008;"> <b>Spintendo</b> </span>]]</span> 17:16, 26 November 2019 (UTC)
::Thank you for your comment!
::1. I agree on the fact that the term “primarily” is vague. Referring to the sentence mentioned at Kotlin website<ref>[https://kotlinlang.org/foundation/kotlin-foundation.html “Kotlin Foundation”]</ref>, it makes more sense to write without “primarily”.
::2. Regarding the sponsorship, it is different from what you've understood in general. Please visit the website of Kotlin and see very bottom of the page.<ref>[https://kotlinlang.org/foundation/kotlin-foundation.html “Kotlin Foundation”]</ref> As it is stated “Sponsored and developed by JetBrains", the sponsorship of Kotlin is not through the Kotlin Foundation, only by JetBrains. The Kotlin Foundation is for protecting, promoting and advancing the development of Kotlin, but here it doesn’t imply any sponsorship.--[[User:JB2020M|JB2020M]] ([[User talk:JB2020M|talk]]) 15:53, 11 December 2019 (UTC)
{{Reftalk}}
The reviewing editor cannot review suggestions for addition to the article which are not placed on the talk page. Please propose the desired verbatim text here for review. If that clarification involves enhanced explanations, then those should be added to the proposed text (within reason) for the simple fact that readers may not be able to "visit the website of Kotlin and see very bottom of the page" in order to attain that understanding. Regards, <span style="font-size:75%;border:2px solid red;border-radius:50px;font-color:#008">[[User:Spintendo|<span style="color:#008;"> <b>Spintendo</b> </span>]]</span> 23:02, 11 December 2019 (UTC)
:: Thanks for the advice. Here is my suggestion.
::*Current text: “Kotlin is sponsored by JetBrains and Google through the Kotlin Foundation.”
::*Suggestion to replace the current text: Kotlin is sponsored and developed by JetBrains openly on GitHub.<ref>[https://kotlinlang.org/foundation/kotlin-foundation.html “Kotlin Foundation”]</ref> The Kotlin Foundation, which was created by JetBrains and Google, serves to protect, promote, and advance the development of Kotlin.<ref>[https://kotlinlang.org/foundation/kotlin-foundation.html “Kotlin Foundation”]</ref>[[User:JB2020M|JB2020M]] ([[User talk:JB2020M|talk]]) 15:54, 12 December 2019 (UTC)
{{Reftalk}}
:Thank you for your clarification. Please elaborate on what it is, about the word ''sponsorship'', which implies that protection, promotion, or advancement does not take place, so much so that those additional words need to be placed within the article for understanding to take place regarding this relationship. Regards, <span style="font-size:75%;border:2px solid red;border-radius:50px;font-color:#008">[[User:Spintendo|<span style="color:#008;"> <b>Spintendo</b> </span>]]</span> 17:00, 12 December 2019 (UTC)
::Hi, here is more explanation about the word 'sponsorship'. The sponsorship of Kotlin refers to the cost of development of the language and the payment of the team developing it. This is implemented by JetBrains. The Foundation does not do this. The foundation merely acts to protect the trademark. [[User:JB2020M|JB2020M]] ([[User talk:JB2020M|talk]]) 09:08, 16 December 2019 (UTC)
:::Thank you for the clarification. Now all that is needed is for you to fashion a claim statement which includes all of those facts, which I can then add to the article. Please note that the particulars which you've just mentioned should be integrated into the new proposed statement. Those elements were not included in your original proposal{{efn|Only the word ''sponsorship'' was used, which in differing contexts may mean many different things to many different people, and not always having to do with the topic of money.}} — specifically, the question of who pays for what. This is an important element which constitutes the meat of your edit request, so it needs to be included. The reference you've provided with the request need not be changed, as it confirms what you've just stated. When ready with the revised claim statement, kindly change the '''{{tlx|request edit}}''' template's answer parameter to read from '''{{para|ans|yes}}''' to '''{{para|ans|no}}'''. Thank you!<br>
:::Regards, <span style="font-size:75%;border:2px solid red;border-radius:50px;font-color:#008">[[User:Spintendo|<span style="color:#008;"> <b>Spintendo</b> </span>]]</span> 11:23, 16 December 2019 (UTC)
{{notelist-talk}}
:::: Thank you for your help and explanation.
::::*Current text: “Kotlin is sponsored by JetBrains and Google through the Kotlin Foundation.”
::::*Suggestion to replace the current text: Kotlin is sponsored and developed by JetBrains openly on GitHub. The sponsorship of Kotlin refers to the cost of development of the language and the payment of the team developing it. The Kotlin Foundation, which was created by JetBrains and Google, serves to protect, promote, and advance the development of Kotlin. The Foundation is not involved in the sponsorship of Kortlin, but acts to protect the trademark. <ref>[https://kotlinlang.org/foundation/kotlin-foundation.html “Kotlin Foundation”]</ref>[[User:JB2020M|JB2020M]] ([[User talk:JB2020M|talk]]) 13:51, 16 December 2019 (UTC)
{{Reftalk}}
===Reply 16-DEC-2019===
{{border |[[File:Emojione1_2705.svg|20px]]{{nbsp|2}}'''Edit request implemented'''{{nbsp|2}}|display=table |width=1px |style=solid |style2= |color=black |lh=1}} <span style="font-size:75%;border:2px solid red;border-radius:50px;font-color:#008">[[User:Spintendo|<span style="color:#008;"> <b>Spintendo</b> </span>]]</span> 20:33, 16 December 2019 (UTC)
== Data Class ==
The section on data classes contains false information. A data class can contain a body, properties not defined in the primary constructor, as well as functions. It is not like a struct in C. The data class adds `hashCode`, `equals`, `toString`, `componentx` functions automatically and I believe that is the main purpose. [[User:0xDeadbeef|0xDeadbeef]] ([[User talk:0xDeadbeef|talk]]) 13:31, 18 October 2020 (UTC)
:I didn't mention `componentx` functions, but I did clarify that the key motivation for `data class` is auto-generating `equals`, `hashCode`, and `toString`. [[User:Lolinder|Lolinder]] ([[User talk:Lolinder|talk]]) 22:26, 6 December 2020 (UTC)
== Swift influence?? ==
I don't often edit, so I wanted some feedback on this proposed change:
I'd like to remove the assertion that Kotlin was influenced by Swift - the timelines don't really line up (which is not definitive evidence against), and the site referenced in the original edit (http://nilhcem.com/swift-is-like-kotlin/ from https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?oldid=939832300) does not provide any evidence nor a statement/assertion that the similarities are a result of one language's influence on the other. Given that Kotlin first appeared before Swift, and both languages have common ancestors in the C family of languages, it doesn't seem like this assertion has much backing (in the same way that if two siblings had similar aesthetic features, you'd likely attribute it to their common parents rather than saying that the younger sibling influenced the appearance of the older sibling).
I've also done some searching trying to find the Kotlin team listing Swift as an influence, and have found influences, but not containing Swift.
Is this sufficient to undo that good-faith edit?
[[User:Ploppity|Ploppity]] ([[User talk:Ploppity|talk]]) 04:40, 6 June 2021 (UTC)
:Not sure. At a surface level, the two languages use similar elements, and they also look similar (of course, under the hood, things work very differently, especially regarding APIs). They definitely ''appear'' to have influenced each other, although in Kotlin's case, [[Scala]] seems to be the more clear/dominant influence. Maybe wait a while so other editors can check this as well... [[User:TucanHolmes|<span style="background-color: #eff6ff; color: #0645ad; padding: 2px 3px;">TucanHolmes</span>]] ([[User talk:TucanHolmes|talk]]) 12:39, 6 June 2021 (UTC)
:I would say that is certainly sufficient to undo the edit. You noted that the listed source for the assertion doesn't actually support the assertion; you then looked for other sources that would validate it and didn't find any. You did the due diligence. If someone finds such a source in the future the claim can then be readded, but it is currently just an unsourced claim and it doesn't need to be there. [[User:Ploppity]]'s noting that "at a surface level, the two languages use similar elements, and they also look similar" etc is, respectfully, in effect "original research" for the purposes of [[WP:NOR]] and such observations are not valid support for an otherwise unsourced claim.
== Edit request - update mascot pictures ==
The new redesigned mascot was announced this year.
https://blog.jetbrains.com/kotlin/2023/04/the-kotlin-mascot-returns/ [[Special:Contributions/109.245.202.213|109.245.202.213]] ([[User talk:109.245.202.213|talk]]) 12:00, 1 October 2023 (UTC)
== I'm missing a pro/cons section ==
I'm not a regular Wikipedia editor, so I don't know what the right terminology would be: Reception? Review? Benefits and Drawbacks? [[User:Snorkop|Snorkop]] ([[User talk:Snorkop|talk]]) 08:46, 13 April 2024 (UTC)
:We can't do a pro/con-section on our own, that would be [[WP:OR|original research]]. We need reliable sources, at least several of them, to create something like that. Wikipedia is an encyclopedia, not a tech review blog, and unless there are specific and notable criticisms of Kotlin, no such section will be necessary.
:We do have comparison pages, e.g. [[Comparison of C and Pascal]], [[Comparison of C Sharp and Java|Comparison of C# and Java]] or [[Compatibility of C and C++]], but these are plagued with issues, mainly those that I have mentioned above, and we need enough material (a large enough body of reliable sources) to create them. They need to be useful to the reader, and they need to exist for a reason, i.e. the topic, the underlying comparison, needs to be notable enough to warrant its own article. [[User:TucanHolmes|<span style="background-color: #eff6ff; color: #0645ad; padding: 2px 3px;">TucanHolmes</span>]] ([[User talk:TucanHolmes|talk]]) 14:33, 14 April 2024 (UTC)
== On data classes ==
{{ping|MrOllie}} I disagree with the {{Diff2|1218897978|recent removal}} of some information about data classes from the article. Data classes are a core part of Kotlin's feature set, and have been inspired other languages, including Java with its records – so, definitely very notable. While I agree that Wikipedia is [[WP:NOTHOW|not an instruction manual]], I don't think that this justifies a near-complete removal, even with a low-quality source. In my opinion, a better course of action would have been to condense the explanation and tag the source as "[better source needed]" (copy editing, basically). [[User:TucanHolmes|<span style="background-color: #eff6ff; color: #0645ad; padding: 2px 3px;">TucanHolmes</span>]] ([[User talk:TucanHolmes|talk]]) 16:58, 14 April 2024 (UTC)
== Adoption sections ==
Seems like the last section in adoption should mention Android? Most of the sources are about Android. We could also remove these lists and just summarize (companies like X Y Z use it and have noted that ...) [[User:Heartleafphilodendron|heartleafphilodendron]] ([[User talk:Heartleafphilodendron|talk]]) 20:31, 26 March 2025 (UTC)
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