Talk:Digital signal processing: Difference between revisions

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== NavFIR boxvs creationIIR ==

The distinction between FIR and IIR is not recursion. for example, y[n] = y[n-1] + x[n] - x[n-k] is not an IIR filter as it could be rewritten as the sum of the last k samples. The actual distinction is based on the number of non-zero outputs for a non-zero input.

I created a nav box for DSP: {{tl|DSP}}. Knock yourself out... [[User:Cburnett|Cburnett]] 04:11, 2 December 2006 (UTC)

And also, the ideal lowpass "sinc" filter is an IIR filter, though it is commonly written using only inputs samples.

==External Links, Movable Feast==

I've cleared the external links because they are unnecessary, and serve to attract linkspam. Please add content to the article and cite references. [[User:Jehochman|Jehochman]] (^{[[User_talk:Jehochman|Talk]]}/_{[[Special:Contributions/Jehochman|Contrib]]}) 04:07, 11 December 2006 (UTC)

<span style="font-size: smaller;" class="autosigned">— Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/24.130.9.71|24.130.9.71]] ([[User talk:24.130.9.71|talk]]) 21:20, 9 September 2012 (UTC)</span><!-- Template:Unsigned IP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

==[[Least-squares spectral analysis]]==

This:In recentlyyour createdexample pagefilter, isthe tiedoutput upcan inbe conflict.nonzero forever Extrawith eyesno andinput. opinions wouldIt beis welcome;not seewhat theis RFCusually oncalled itsan talkFIR pagefilter, andnor otherwhat talkis sections;usually expertcalled contentstable. input wouldI alsoreverted beyour ofedit considerable value, butto the topic is a bit narrow soarticle; I don'tbelieve expectit tois find ancorrect expertas herestated. [[User:Dicklyon|Dicklyon]] 00([[User talk:Dicklyon|talk]]) 04:5212, 2310 OctoberSeptember 20072012 (UTC)

:There is a more important difference between y[n] = y[n-1] + x[n] - x[n-k] &nbsp;and&nbsp; y[n] = x[n] + x[n-1] + ... + x[n-k+1].

== Autocorrelation ___domain ==

:With floating-point arithmetic, the recursive implementation has arithmetic error accumulation (random-walk) as n increases. The FIR implementation does not.

:: --[[User:GlrxBob K|GlrxBob K]] ([[User talk:GlrxBob K|talk]]) 1913:1547, 2918 OctoberSeptember 20122016 (UTC)

== Intro reads like an app note, not a text book ==

I like to point your attention to the following issue. According to this page autocorrelation has its own ___domain. Can somebody please explain why this is stated as such? Because the output values are a function of time! <span style="font-size: smaller;" class="autosigned">— Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/195.241.238.88|195.241.238.88]] ([[User talk:195.241.238.88|talk]]) 20:02, 19 December 2011 (UTC)</span><!-- Template:Unsigned IP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

{{Archive top |result=No longer in article ~[[User:Kvng|Kvng]] ([[User talk:Kvng|talk]]) 16:33, 3 April 2020 (UTC)}}

:The goal of DSP is usually to measure, filter and/or compress continuous real-world analog signals. '''The first step is usually to convert the signal from an analog to a digital form, by sampling and then digitizing it using an analog-to-digital converter (ADC), which turns the analog signal into a stream of numbers. However, often, the required output signal is another analog output signal, which requires a digital-to-analog converter (DAC).''' Even if this process is more complex than analog processing and has a discrete value range, the application of computational power to digital signal processing allows for many advantages over analog processing in many applications, such as error detection and correction in transmission as well as data compression.

I think this paragraph shows evidence of making sense, but doesn't. This should stick to first princples (sampling and quantization), or discuss what could be described as "degrees of freedom over domains of operation" (the group of all applications).

:Why is the Autocorrelation ___domain flagged with "citation needed" when none of the other domains are? If autocorrelation, like the others, is its own link, then why should a citation be needed? [[User:Jmrowland|rowley]] ([[User talk:Jmrowland|talk]]) 20:44, 19 December 2011 (UTC)

As it is, it's been hacked to one odd class of applications. On a music CDROM it's called "ADA". My analog outputs are usually PWM. [[User:JohnPritchard|JohnPritchard]] ([[User talk:JohnPritchard|talk]]) 16:16, 2 January 2013 (UTC)

I think it may be fumble fingers (I've assumed that and edited the article accordingly), or it could be a confusion in menaing between ___domain as in field of analysis, and ___domain as in units on x axis. Same question would be asked of wavelets, the units are seconds and Hz in the plots I look at. [[User:Greglocock|Greglocock]] ([[User talk:Greglocock|talk]]) 06:24, 20 December 2011 (UTC)

{{Archive bottom}}

== FIRDon't vsTalk IIR- Write. ==

The distinction between FIR and IIR is not recursion. for example, y[n] = y[n-1] + x[n] - x[n-k] is not an IIR filter as it could be rewritten as the sum of the last k samples. The actual distinction is based on the number of non-zero outputs for a non-zero input.

And also, the ideal lowpass "sinc" filter is an IIR filter, though it is commonly written using only inputs samples.

<span style="font-size: smaller;" class="autosigned">— Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/24.130.9.71|24.130.9.71]] ([[User talk:24.130.9.71|talk]]) 21:20, 9 September 2012 (UTC)</span><!-- Template:Unsigned IP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

:In your example filter, the output can be nonzero forever with no input. It is not what is usually called an FIR filter, nor what is usually called stable. I reverted your edit to the article; I believe it is correct as stated. [[User:Dicklyon|Dicklyon]] ([[User talk:Dicklyon|talk]]) 04:12, 10 September 2012 (UTC)

This article has languished for too long. Complaining about things you dislike will not make it better. Start writing. I will begin on the lead - which sucks btw. [[User:Codwiki|Codwiki]] ([[User talk:Codwiki|talk]]) 16:19, 7 July 2015 (UTC)

== Further reading section is bloated ==

== Time and space domains ==

The further reading section should be trimmed down. Alternatively, some headings / s<ins>h</ins>ort comments should explain why the reference is significant. It should not be a bibliography of DSP texts. [[User:Glrx|Glrx]] ([[User talk:Glrx|talk]]) 16:26, 19 October 2012 (UTC) <small>changed "sort" to "short" [[User:Glrx|Glrx]] ([[User talk:Glrx|talk]]) 19:15, 29 October 2012 (UTC)</small>

It seems as though most of the content of [[Digital_signal_processing#Time_and_space_domains|this section]] is about [[Digital filter]], not [[Time ___domain]]. I think I could find a place for the material in [[Digital filter]] and then summarize [[Time ___domain]] in this section and also add something about space ___domain for digital imaging processing. I'm happy to do this [[WP:BOLD]]ly; not looking for permission. Mostly posting here as a reminder to myself. But, if anyone has any objections or suggestions, feel free to respond. ~[[User:Kvng|Kvng]] ([[User talk:Kvng|talk]]) 16:30, 13 February 2018 (UTC)

:I agree. [[Wikipedia:Further reading|Further reading]] is [[Wikipedia:Further reading#Limited|not a list of all books]] covering the subject. Books in further reading should be notable for their quality, reliability, etc and should be about the subject of the article. Some of the books that are listed, like "Orthogonal Transforms for Digital Signal Processing" and that new addition that keeps getting re-added, are really too specific to be listed on this page, which is about DSP in general. [[User:Radiodef|Radiodef]] ([[User talk:Radiodef|talk]]) 17:44, 27 October 2012 (UTC)

:{{done}} ~[[User:RadiodefKvng|RadiodefKvng]] ([[User talk:RadiodefKvng|talk]]) 1920:4739, 2724 OctoberAugust 20122020 (UTC)

:I've removed the following:

:*'''Bimal Krishna, K. Y. Lin, Hari C. Krishna: ''Computational Number Theory & Digital Signal Processing'', CRC Press, ISBN 0-8493-7177-5''' Not easily found for purchase, descriptions suggest the book mainly covers new theories devised by the authors.

:*'''Henrique S. Malvar: ''Signal Processing with Lapped Transforms'', Artech House Publishers, ISBN 0-89006-467-9''' Subject matter is pretty specific. Also fairly safe to assume book is dated (publication in 1992) with respect to the subject matter, descriptions suggest the book includes a fair amount of speculation, lapped transforms like the [[Discrete cosine transform|DCT]] are pretty ubiquitous now and I doubt the book is an accurate representation of the subject 20 years later.

:*'''Artur Krukowski, Izzet Kale: ''DSP System Design: Complexity Reduced Iir Filter Implementation for Practical Applications'', Kluwer Academic Publishers, ISBN 1-4020-7558-8''' Subject matter is highly specific.

== FIR filters have many advantages, but are computationally more demanding ==

:I've left these on the list for now, but they could also be removed:

:*'''Paul M. Embree, Damon Danieli: ''C++ Algorithms for Digital Signal Processing'', Prentice Hall, ISBN 0-13-179144-3''' Reviews of this book suggest it is geared more towards teaching the C++ and less towards explaining the DSP. Book is also primarily code examples in a single language, but the prevalence of C++ and breadth of the book's examples may still warrant it being on the list.

:*'''[[N. Ahmed]] and K.R. Rao (1975). Orthogonal Transforms for Digital Signal Processing. Springer-Verlag (Berlin – Heidelberg – New York), ISBN 3-540-06556-3''' Although the subject matter is somewhat restricted and the book's assumptions about computing may be outdated (publication in 1975), the author is apparently notable and respected.

{{u|M.perkins}} changed FIR to IIR and I had to look carefully to recognise this was wrong. I removed the whole sentence because the section is about Z-plane analysis, not computational efficiency and the sentence does not explain the advantages of an FIR filter. {{u|Dicklyon}} reverted to the original. I beleive these facts are already covered in [[Finite impulse response]] and [[Infinite impulse response]] and teasing them in this section is unnecessary and appears to be causing some confusion. ~[[User:Kvng|Kvng]] ([[User talk:Kvng|talk]]) 15:45, 26 March 2019 (UTC)

:Those were obvious ones to me, but there are also a lot of general DSP books on the list that could be sorted through and pared down. [[User:Radiodef|Radiodef]] ([[User talk:Radiodef|talk]]) 19:04, 27 October 2012 (UTC)

:OK with me if you take it out after considering the correction I reverted to. [[User:Dicklyon|Dicklyon]] ([[User talk:Dicklyon|talk]]) 02:42, 27 March 2019 (UTC)

::[https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Digital_signal_processing&type=revision&diff=890154422&oldid=889500724 Removed] ~[[User:Kvng|Kvng]] ([[User talk:Kvng|talk]]) 14:08, 30 March 2019 (UTC)

== Uncertainity ==

:Removed:

:*'''Kainam Thomas Wong [http://www.eie.polyu.edu.hk/~enktwong/]: Statistical Signal Processing lecture notes [http://ece.uwaterloo.ca/~ece603/] at the University of Waterloo, Canada.''' Lecture notes on a confined topic. Notes are handwritten and not in an obvious place, page appears intended for students of the class.

Sorry, Heisenberg wasn’t just talking about particles.. https://pages.hmc.edu/ruye/e161/lectures/fourier/node2.html#:~:text=in%20frequency%20domain%20provides%20complete,the%20signal%2C%20but%20never%20both. [[User:Greglocock|Greglocock]] ([[User talk:Greglocock|talk]]) 20:07, 26 July 2025 (UTC)

:[[User:Radiodef|Radiodef]] ([[User talk:Radiodef|talk]]) 19:47, 27 October 2012 (UTC)

:Thanks, I did not know this. ~[[User:Kvng|Kvng]] ([[User talk:Kvng|talk]]) 23:15, 26 July 2025 (UTC)

:: Yes, the section should focus on general texts. It may be OK to add some narrow/specific ones, but then there should be a short comment about why that text is useful. I recognize the Embree ref, but I don't recall its quality or breadth. Oppenheim is a classic (4.3 stars on Amazon). I'm not familiar with them, but Lyons (4.6 stars on Amazon) and Proakis are often cited; McClelland and Shaefer are names in the field. CRC Press often puts out huge encyclopedias about an area; the CRC for DSP might be good, but the radar/sonar/medical imaging might be too far afield. The Doug Smith / ARRL book has no reviews on Amazon.

:: I encourage editors to add comments for good entries and delete weak entries.

:: [[User:Glrx|Glrx]] ([[User talk:Glrx|talk]]) 19:15, 29 October 2012 (UTC)