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''The following is complete; please copyediting or refine it, or help with other [[Wikipedia:WikiProject WikipediaWeekly/CurrentTranscriptions|current transcriptions]].''

==Episode 7==

==Episode 7==

''The following is complete; please copyediting or refine it.''

'''Tawker: '''This is Wikipedia Weekly, episode 7, for the week of November 27th, 2006.

'''Fuzheado: '''Welcome to another episode of wikipediaWikipedia weeklyWeekly. I'm your host, Andrew Lih, also known as [[User:Fuzheado]] on the English Wikipedia. Well, last week we got hooked onto the big panel using Skype, so this week we're going for even more with eight folks from around the world. So from Vancouver, canadaCanada, we have [[user:Tawker]],

'''Tawker: '''Hi there.

'''Fuzheado: '''From the Wikimedia Foundation homeland in floridaFlorida, we've got [[user:Danny|Danny]], aka dannyDanny woolWool.

'''Danny Wool: '''Hi.

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So this week we had three interesting milestones across the Wikipedias. On Wikipedia English we reached 1.5 million articles, at roughly the same time we had German, which reached 500,000 articles, and French which had 400,000 articles. MessedRocker, you know what the 1.5 millionth article is, don't you?

'''MessedRocker: '''Yes, the 1.5 millionth article is the [[Kanab Ambersnail]]. The article is about a type of endangered snail which lives in theethe grandGrand canyonCanyon, and it's a pretty good article so far. It's a few paragraphs, there's a nice reference section going in, some really vivid photographs. All in all it's a pretty good article so far. I' have a feeling that because of its popularity as being the one-point-five millionth article, it's going to get a lot more attention than normal. This could also be relevant to WikiSpecies, which is an attempt on making a directory of all the types of species of life in the world as we know it.

'''1ne: '''I have a question. Did [[Jordanhill railway station]], the one millionth article, did it get attention for being millionth article?

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'''Tawker: '''Yeah, I protected it and then I got about five complaints about how we shouldn't protect anything linked from the main page, even if it's a vandalmagnet.

'''Fuzheado: '''Well, we'll talk later about protection and how much protection there should be. But it was interesting, in another thing related to Wikipedia articles making it to the real worlworld.

'''Daveydweeb: '''when the article about Belgrade in Serbia made it to featured article, and supposedly the mayor of Belgrade mentioned this in his press conference, that Wikipedia selected Belgrade as a featured article. It's interesting how Wikipedia articles being selected for something or making a milestones has suddenly become this big thing to boast about in the real world.

'''Tawker: '''Apparently the one thing, I think it was Danny brought up, was that Wikipedia's article on podcasting was actually using in the United States Patent and Trademark office rejection of the word "Podcast" as a trademark.

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===Citizendium===

'''Fuzheado: '''Well, moving to other projects that we've been talking abouabout.

'''Tawker: '''Citizendium. Citizendium has been chugging along, has reached 300 users, and I believe several folks on this podcast are actually in the pilot program.

'''Daveydweeb: '''Yeah, Citizendium - the WIkipediaWikipedia alternative founded by Larry Sanger, with whom we spoke in our podcast special a few weeks ago - is reportedly, in his words, "chugging along". When we spoke with Larry, the website had just reached 80 live articles, ones that had been substantially changed from their Wikipedia counterparts, and 230 usernames, not all of which were active. Since then, Citizendium hhhas lowered the bar for new users and no longer demands that authors provide a link to their CV or resume in order to join. As a result, the site now boasts over 300 active usernames, including a number of our own panelists here at Wikipedia Weekly, and 300 live articles. In just a few weeks, they've grown substantially, and the rate of editing is increasing quite quickly.

I guess one of the reasons - apart from lowering the bar for new user applications - for this increasing growth is that Sanger recently created what he calls "Discipline Workgroups", which Wikipedians may know also as [[WP:PJ|WikiProjects]]. These groups are more formal than their Wikipedia equivalent, they have a really rigid structure common to all Workgroups, and just like the rest of Citizendium members of them are split between authors and editors. And as a result, Citizendium is starting to move in a more structured way towards producing and changing its own unique content.

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===User talk warnings===

'''Fuzheado: '''This is actually a perfect segwaysegue into our next segment, which is these messages that people get on their user pages and everything, or user warnings. They are kind of all over the map, we've got templates for all kinds of things to, "you're doing a great job," "you're doing a horrible job," "you're vandalising this," "you're doing that".. I know that, SushiGeek, you looked into this, right?

1; Yeah, I looked into this and.. so there's a thing going on where they're trying to lower the number of warning templates used when people vandalise or when people do something else.. I think it's a good idea, because you know it's so complex right now, and you've got so many different templates that you have to use and memorise.

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===Feedback===

'''Fuzheado: '''Okay, well we're going to whip through our two very brief feedback stories here. We had someooneesomeone who emaileedemailed us who likeedliked our ttalk about the universal wikimarkup, and says:

:"We are working on WikiCreole, a wikimarkup not to replace exisiting wikimarkup, but as an additional way for new visitors to edit a new wiki without having to learn that wiki-engine's native markup."

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So it's a kind of universal wikilanguage, and he invites people to visit [http://www.wikicreole.org www.wikicreole.org].

'''Kelly Martin: '''Yeah, this came in from Chuck Smith, who is one of the panel.. one of the members of the Wikicreole project, which is also being done by Christopher[http://www.wikicreole.org/wiki/ChristophSauer SauerChristoph (?)Sauer], Jana[http://www.wikicreole.org/wiki/JanneJalkanen JalcannonJana (?)Jalkanen] - I apologise if I've bastardised your name -

'''Fuzheado: '''-and [[Ward Cunningham]]-

'''Kelly Martin: '''-a name which we should all be familiar with, who came up with the whole wiki concept. The whole pattern repository that Ward Cunningham in the original Wiki, is full of neat stuff that people really need to read because, I mean, there's a lot of good stuff in there and in [[MeatballWiki | Meatball]], which is all dedicated... Meatball is totally dedicated to what we'd called meta-stuff, stuff about the whole community editing process, and there's a lot of really good stuff. And I find myself a lot of times at wits end with the Wikipedia community, and then I go read something at meatballMeatball that's says.. "oh! That explains why so-and-so did that! Now I understand, and I know how to approach them."

'''Fuzheado: '''Yeah, for all those folks out there, Meatball is like... I think it was the second ever wiki that was created. Maybe one of these shows we should get [http://www.usemod.com/cgi-bin/mb.pl?SunirShah Sunir Shaw (?)Shah], who is the creator of Meatball, on, and he'd be a fascinating guy to talk to on the podcast.

'''1ne: '''What I was going to say was, I kind of regard Meatball as, like, the Old Testament of the wiki. I know that's just me, but that's how I feel.

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'''1ne: '''Exactly!

'''Tawker: '''Super-super-super quick plug based on feedback from Brion. A few podcasts ago you were talking about Wikipedia and MediaWiki tutorials: he's actually done a thirteen-part video series on editing MediaWiki. Unlike some one of the videos earlier, he does not just the basics, but - I should say, actually, unlike the videos that cover just the mechanics of using MediaWikMediaWiki not the social conventions of Wikipedia. The series runs about 80 minutes long because of some of the non-obvious stuff, like rules or - I should say - page-names and namespaces...

'''1ne: '''Does he explain WikiDrama and all that?

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'''Fuzheado: '''So that's an interesting phenomenon.

'''Kelly Martin: '''The Google ad engine, in order to target advertisements to a page, has to load the page to examine it - to look for whatever the engine looks for - and since Wikimedia blocks all of Google's ad engines from fetching pages and Google is a nice, is a good Internet citizen and it respects robots..txt files, they can't actually index the page and so they can't target the ads. There's no good reason why we would allow - from the Wikimedia Foundation's point of view - why would allow the ad agent to come in there, because Wikimedia's not putting the ads on the page. And by not allowing them to look at the the pages, it reduces the loads on the server, so it's just.. there's no reason why the Foundation would gain anything from doing this.

So it's.. Calacanis is going to have to make an argument to - basically, Brion - why Brion is should allow this, and I don't see Brion as having any vested interest in doing this, it's not like Wikimedia need more traffic coming to their site. And...

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Okay, so for our final note of feedback. As we said last week, we were happy to have some folks pitch in to do some transcription, but this week we had some folks who answered our call for trying to feed our wonderful podcast into speech recognition. I think Daveydweeb has something to say on this..

'''Daveydweeb: '''Yes, indeed. We had an interesting time with voice recognition, trying to get it transcribed. Initially we started out looking for an open source alternative, and we came across some software called [[CMU Sphinx|Sphinx]]... or, as I like to call it, "that annoying software." It seems to still be a development version, it doesn't appear to have released a public version for people to install and use. I spent about two hours trying to get it to install and run and it turned out to completely impossible. we decided sphinx probably wasn't the best solution, considering we couldn't get it to work.

Later, [[User:Jacoplane]], who's actually an administrator at the English Wikipedia, suggested that we use [[NaturallySpeaking|Dragon NatuallySpeakingNaturallySpeaking]] 8, and provided a sample of the episode 6 transcribed by Dragon. The results were... interesting, you might call them. We spent a fair amount of time laughing at those results, in fact. I'm sure all of us have our own interesting little stories about them, don't we?

'''Fuzheado: '''Well, it doesn't.. it's doesn't help that the speech recognition engine doesn't recognise what the word "wiki" or "Wikipedia" is, so obviously it started from a very bad position just off the bat.