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Thanks to [[User:Gary King]] for developing the "Editing exercise template" used in the exercises. <span class="texhtml" style="text-shadow:#BBBBBB 0.1em 0.1em 0.1em;">[[User:Tony1|<span style="color:darkgreen;">'''Tony'''</span>]] [[User talk:Tony1|<span style="color:darkgreen;">(talk)</span>]]</span> 04:45, 18 March 2012 (UTC)
==Kudos==
This is an awesome job, Tony. Can I help at all? For example, I'd like to add "date linking" to one of the examples. :) --[[User:Elonka|El]][[User talk:Elonka|on]][[Special:Contributions/Elonka|ka]] 20:47, 6 December 2007 (UTC)
:Thanks Elonka; however, I'm looking for constructive criticism. Does the colour-coding system work? Is Exercise 2c too big (seven issues, plus an eighth) for a single chunk? Is the formatting and structure of the exercises OK? [[User:Tony1|<
== Exercise 2 - final note ==
I hesitate to criticise, but "this" is duplicated. Also, is "just" needed? Thus far, I have found the page and exercises useful. Thanks. [[User:Finavon|Finavon]] ([[User talk:Finavon|talk]]) 20:11, 22 December 2007 (UTC)
:Please ''do'' criticise! Fixed. [[User:Tony1|<
== Example 3b ==
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Isn't ''steam locomotive'' also a double adjective (defining ''technology''), which should therefore be hyphenated? I'd say it's a similar situation to ''post-war''. [[User:The Duke of Waltham|Waltham]], <small>[[User talk:The Duke of Waltham|''The Duke of'']]</small> 19:37, 8 April 2008 (UTC)
:You could hyphenate it, or you mght not: it's one of those borderline case. Certainly American writers are less likely to hyphenate a borderline case. [[User:Tony1|<
::True. But clarity is always to be gained from such hyphenations, isn't it? [[User:The Duke of Waltham|Waltham]], <small>[[User talk:The Duke of Waltham|''The Duke of'']]</small> 04:41, 9 April 2008 (UTC)
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It tightens the wording and dodges the potentially confusing "regular games at championship level" statement. I might be wrong, but would including a "the" before "numerous championship games" merely be redundant? — '''[[User:Deckiller|Deckill]][[User talk:Deckiller|er]]''' 02:13, 24 May 2008 (UTC)
:Got rid of that exercise; a bit cumbersome. [[User:Tony1|<
==1c, Ima Hogg==
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"Display" might also be better than "show off" (it depends on whether you wish to imply ostentation). [[User:Neil|<u style="text-decoration:none;font:100% cursive;color:#600">Neıl</u>]] [[User_talk:Neil|<u style="text-decoration:none;color:#226"><B>龱</B></u>]] 14:02, 29 May 2008 (UTC)
:Thanks for your comments, but I think your suggestions change the substantive meaning. [[User:Tony1|<
::Even the final "the"? [[User:Neil|<u style="text-decoration:none;font:100% cursive;color:#600">Neıl</u>]] [[User_talk:Neil|<u style="text-decoration:none;color:#226"><B>龱</B></u>]] 16:36, 29 May 2008 (UTC)
:::Absolutely: "the art" refers to specific art that the reader can recover not right there but in the preceding text, or from general knowledge—or it's specific because it's ''the'' art that the family had purchased; not any old art. To remove "the" changes the possible set of meanings. [[User:Tony1|<
== 3d ==
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Most of the sentence under 'solution' showed up green for me, I thought it was missing a<nowiki> </font></nowiki> tag. I did a minor tweak to the color name and it appeared fixed, but only in the show preview of the section editor; it still appears broken when you view the whole page. it must be a tag left open in some section above that one. It looks like it's affecting 3c and -e as well, but not 3b, could it be 3b or -c?
Also, in 3d there's still ''innovative although controversial, innovative'', is this just the tag placement? Thanks for making these exercises, they're a great help! I've never seen anything else like them on Wikipedia. [[user:delldot|<
:Fixed, I hope. [[User:Tony1|<
== Example 3e ==
The numbering of the phrases in the solution of example 3e is off. What happened to number five? — [[User:Bellhalla|Bellhalla]] ([[User talk:Bellhalla|talk]]) 12:57, 20 August 2008 (UTC)
:The new numbering system has fixed this, I hope. [[User:Tony1|<
== First ''SR Merchant Navy Class'' excercise ==
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--[[User:Ke6jjj|Ke6jjj]] ([[User talk:Ke6jjj|talk]]) 03:55, 1 October 2008 (UTC)
I thought yes, you're right. Then I though, no. Please see the [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=User%3ATony1%2FAdvanced_editing_exercises&diff=242169491&oldid=239294924 diff] and tell me whether you agree. [[User:Tony1|<
== 2.6 Charing Cross, Euston & Hampstead Railway ==
The section had "Exercise 2f" in the heading, and was the only one with such a prefix. I removed it. --[[User:AnOddName|an]] '''[[User_talk:AnOddName|odd]]''' [[Special:Contributions/AnOddName|name]] 08:48, 2 January 2009 (UTC)
:Thanks. [[User:Tony1|<
== Problem with display ==
Not sure if this is just my browser or what, but in at least one section ([[User:Tony1/Advanced editing exercises#Jane Zhang|Jane Zhang]]) the strikeout text doesn't show up as strikeout, it's just regular (ie, I'm seeing "During Throughout" instead of "During <s>Throughout</s>"). Is this happening for anyone else? Any ideas what might be causing it? '''[[User:Rjanag|r<
: It happens to me, too. The most recent version that works fine is [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=User:Tony1/Advanced_editing_exercises&oldid=261420933 this one]. The page has a lot of opened HTML tags to begin with, so they should be closed. <
:::Thanks to both of you. Rjanang, You want to have a play with it? Looks perfect to me. Are you using ''Internet Explorer''? I do these in ''Safari''. Gary, maybe that is the problem. Can you give me an example of what an HTML tag is? I can then fix them. [[User:Tony1|<
:::: I strongly suggest you use templates. It's a lot cleaner, easier to use, and makes it harder to break things in general. I [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=User:Tony1/Advanced_editing_exercises&diff=270629080&oldid=270621943 updated the first section to show how it's done], which you can do for the rest of the sections. I'll do a few now but it's 4 am for me, so I won't be up for long. <
::::: This is an example of an open HTML tag: {{bcode|1=<font color=maroon>This is maroon. <font color=black>This is black.}} This is incorrectly done; the {{bcode|<font>}} tags should be closed with a {{bcode|</font>}}. In fact, the page uses the tag correctly most of the time, but wherever {{bcode|1=<font color=black>}} is used in the code, it is used incorrectly like in my example, which is causing the page to appear a bit differently depending on the browser. <
*Oh Gary, beyond the call of duty. Thank you '''so much'''. It looks like a truckload of work, and your explanation here was very helpful. After 4 March, when my work-hell ends, I'm going through your changes to learn; then, I'll apply them to my other tutorial pages. I owe you! [[User:Tony1|<
:: Okay, the entire page should be converted. The page loads much faster now than before; previously, the page took longer to load because of all the open HTML tags. At the end of the page, the browser had about 80 open tags; think about it like having 80 open applications on your computer. It slows down the computer. Closing the tag is like closing an application, allowing the computer to do something else.
:: If you want, even code like {{bcode|1=<font color=darkgreen>'''This text is dark green AND bold.'''</font>}} can be converted to a template, like {{bcode|1=<nowiki>{{bold and colored|darkgreen|This text is dark green AND bold.}}</nowiki>}}, but that's up to you. If you check the History, you'll see that using the templates decreases the size of the page; the page size for [[User:Tony1/Know your Manual of Style]], which I just converted, has decreased by 33%. <
== Suggestions re Wind power and SR Merchant Navy Class ==
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*[http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=User%3ATony1%2FAdvanced_editing_exercises&diff=315688043&oldid=315487471 diff]
*[[User:Tony1/Advanced_editing_exercises#Wind power|Wind power]]
*[[User:Tony1/Advanced_editing_exercises#Wind power|SR Merchant Navy Class (2)]] [[User:Tony1|<
::Thanks Tony.
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::'''[[User:Tony1/Advanced_editing_exercises#Wind power|Wind power]]''': At the moment there are two solutions that are identical – I guess you meant to remove the second. It still sounds a little odd to me: I'd have thought three blades '''''is''''' a design, not three blades '''''are''''' a design. But of course "three blades" has to be treated as plural in the first part. I'm no grammar expert so I'll defer to your judgment here. One more alternative: ''The most common design for modern windmills is a three-blade turbine, which minimises forces related to material fatigue.'' [[User:Adrian J. Hunter|Adrian '''J.''' Hunter]]<sup>([[User talk:Adrian J. Hunter|talk]]•[[Special:contributions/Adrian J. Hunter|contribs]])</sup> 12:02, 23 September 2009 (UTC)
:::OK, another try! [[User:Tony1|<
::::The changes look good to me, both here and at the redundancy exercises. I like the commentary on theme. Thanks for responding to my badgering :) [[User:Adrian J. Hunter|Adrian '''J.''' Hunter]]<sup>([[User talk:Adrian J. Hunter|talk]]•[[Special:contributions/Adrian J. Hunter|contribs]])</sup> 14:40, 23 September 2009 (UTC)
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Great job, I love doing these! For excercise 6 I thought:
"A protest grou<
I would refer to that it is logical that the group was founded after/because of the proposal, so "was" would be redundant, and with an extra comma, but fewer words the message still stands clear. (PS: you've written "font colo'''u'''r", with a ''u'' so the corrected text is black, not red) --Regards, [[User:Mottenen|Mottenen]] ([[User talk:Mottenen|talk]]) 20:23, 16 March 2011 (UTC)
:Mottenan, they're too hard for ''me'', some of them. Seriously, I forget the mechanics of each after a while; perhaps I need to brush up on my editing skills by revisiting. Thanks for your comment and for picking up my engvar glitch. Retroactive inhibition, I think the psychologists call it. [[User:Tony1|<span style="color:darkgreen;">'''Tony'''</span>]] [[User talk:Tony1|<span style="color:darkgreen;">(talk)</span>]] 12:43, 17 March 2011 (UTC) PS I do think the meaning is different if "was" is removed. Without "was", the group seems to have self-formed; with it, there's some kind of agent that/who formed the group. [[User:Tony1|<span style="color:darkgreen;">'''Tony'''</span>]] [[User talk:Tony1|<span style="color:darkgreen;">(talk)</span>]] 12:48, 17 March 2011 (UTC)
::Yeah, maybe. It doesn't quite sound like that to me, but maybe I'm just not used to go that much into details when writing English. Anyway, it doesn't really matter, I just wanted to know if there was a specific reason you'd phrased it in that way, and yes there was :) --[[User:Mottenen|Mottenen]] ([[User talk:Mottenen|talk]]) 19:03, 17 March 2011 (UTC)
== On: Ms Ima Hogg ==
With the sentence out of context as it is, it almost seems that it would be alright to say "''to design '''the''' house''" as the reader of the exercise might not know that this particular house "''is one of a class of houses that could be designed for that purpose, not the only one.''" You could then come up with a solution such as:
*"Ima worked closely with architect John Staub to design the house to show off the art the family had purchased."
Which brings me to another point, in the solution given, I found two other words that could possibly be omitted: the "'''the'''" before "''art''", and "'''had'''" after "''family''", and came up with:
*"Ima worked closely with architect John Staub to design a house that would show off art the family purchased."
[[User:L1ght5h0w|L1ght5h0w]] ([[User talk:L1ght5h0w|talk]]) 18:50, 5 June 2012 (UTC)
== HMS ''Agincourt'' ==
The (revised) sentence reads:
{{Quote|Since Brazil's relations with Argentina were warming and the country's economic boom was losing steam, the government negotiated with Armstrong to remove the third dreadnought from the contract.}}
Out of context, it's unclear to me whether 'the county' and 'the government' refer to Brazil or Argentina.
I wonder if something like this would be more clear:
{{Quote|While Brazil's economy was losing steam, its relations with Argentina were warming. This led the Brazilian government to request that Armstrong remove the third dreadnought from the contract.}}
I'm sure you can improve on what I've written, but I hope my point is clear. :) [[User:SashaMarievskaya|SashaMarievskaya]] ([[User talk:SashaMarievskaya|talk]]) 04:27, 5 June 2013 (UTC)
:You're an expert! Thanks for picking this up. I'll change it now. [[User:Tony1|<span style="color:darkgreen;">'''Tony'''</span>]] [[User talk:Tony1|<span style="color:darkgreen;">(talk) </span>]] 13:50, 5 June 2013 (UTC)
== Exercise 6, again (David Bellamy) ==
Somehow the word "the" has crept into the current version of this example, as in "attracted support from ''the'' botanist and environmental campaigner". Is this intentional? I think it is unnecessary. [[User:Ke6jjj|Ke6jjj]] ([[User talk:Ke6jjj|talk]]) 21:42, 3 January 2014 (UTC)
:Ke6, thanks for raising this. I ''think'' the omission of the deictic "the" started in the US in journalistic and other registers, but that it's frowned on by US copy-editors in more formal text. I use it myself, and like it, but I'm wary in formal situations. [[User:Tony1|<span style="color:darkgreen;">'''Tony'''</span>]] [[User talk:Tony1|<span style="color:darkgreen;">(talk) </span>]] 09:57, 4 January 2014 (UTC)
== Quibbles ==
*"Montgomery's feat is often described as the most famous save of all time in an FA Cup final". I often see this sort of over-inflated wording. The meaning is no different if the sentence is changed to: "Montgomery's feat is often described as the most famous save in an FA Cup final".
*"Sunderland, a Second Division club at the time, won the game; this was mostly due to the efforts of their goalkeeper Jimmy Montgomery, who saved in quick succession two of Peter Lorimer's shots at the goal." There's redundancy here, too. All shots are at goal. So "Sunderland, a Second Division club at the time, won the game; this was mostly due to the efforts of their goalkeeper Jimmy Montgomery, who saved in quick succession two of Peter Lorimer's shots", or "Sunderland, a Second Division club at the time, won the game; this was mostly due to the efforts of their goalkeeper Jimmy Montgomery, who saved two of Peter Lorimer's shots in quick succession". The latter has better flow, in my view.
:Given that the non-advanced exercises include work on avoiding redundancy... [[User:EddieHugh|EddieHugh]] ([[User talk:EddieHugh|talk]]) 14:12, 12 June 2019 (UTC)
:And doesn't "In 2009, he finished the season with a career total of 215 goals, breaking Peter Lee's OHL record by two" contradict [[MOS:NUMNOTES]]? Maybe there's been a change since you wrote that one. They're interesting exercises – thanks! [[User:EddieHugh|EddieHugh]] ([[User talk:EddieHugh|talk]]) 14:25, 12 June 2019 (UTC)
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