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'''Ev Teel Urizen''' is a [[fictional character]] in the [[Marvel Universe]]. It was created by writer [[Mike Carey]]. Ev Teel Urizen first appeared in issue 197 of [[X-Men]] (May, 2007).
{{Wikiproject Alternative music}}
{{Wikiproject Punk music}}
Ev Teel Urizen is a [[mummudrai]], a mental parasite constructed of energy latices that exists on the astral plane. Mummudrai are "born" with every living being in the womb. In [[Shi'ar]] legend, they are described as the a living being's first contact with the idea of "the other". While many die in the womb, some choose to remain in the host's mind, harmless and dormant. This was the case with Urizen, who stayed harmlessly with its host Ul'var Urizen.
==Biography==
Urizen fled from the edge of Shi'ar space following a trail of psychic energy to the X-Men's Mansion, seeking help from the X-Men's powerful psychics to stop Hecatomb before "he" (as Urizen refers to it) consumed everything.
I snipped this: "It is also said Mark went back to college after his departure from AFI." Said? Did he or didn't he? Needs substantiation. [[User:Saint Mahone|Saint Mahone]] 22:44, 31 March 2006 (UTC)
Like all mummudrai, Ev Teel Urizen possesses the powers of telekenisis and telepathy and can inhabit and posess nearly anyone by performing jumps on the astral plane.
I took out the sentence at the end that mentioned the DVD titled "I Heard A Voice" that is rumoured to be released on December 12th. The source of this information is not legitimate, and there is a great possibility that the title and release date of the DVD are fake. I also took out the DVD section, because it is not relevant unless this rumour is confirmed. [[User:X stella|X stella]] 04:35, 20 October 2006 (UTC)
==Fictional Character Biography==
If you would just go to their official website you would see that a DVD is going to be released on December 12, 2006. I don't remember the name though-Leandreamo
===Origins===
Ev Teel Urizen was born together with its original host, Ul'var Urizen. Mummudrai can meet a variety of fates, most dieing in the womb, while others survive by consuming the minds of their hosts or choosing to peacefully and dormantly reside in the host's mind. Urizen chose the latter and peacefully existed within Ul'var.
==AFI=Extraction acronymand War===
During a Shi'ar war with another planet, the Heptarchy, Urizen was foreceably extracted from Ul'var and psychically disected by Shi'ar scientists and engineers whose goal was to create an artificial mummudrai from its template that could be harnessed into a controllable weapon. The weapon, termed the "Hecatomb" could be turned on and off and would ideally be placed near the planet. There it would consume and erase the minds of anything nearby, killing the planet's population while leaving the planet intact and inhabitable.
Shouldn't the page be "A Fire Inside" with redirect from the abbreviation? I speak only from the standpoint of standardization, having no knowledge of this particular band.[[User:Kukkurovaca| -- कुक्कुरोवाच]]|[[User talk:Kukkurovaca|Talk‽]] 00:08, 10 Jun 2004 (UTC)
A flaw in Hecatomb's design, however, caused the weapon to malfunction. Hecatomb could not contain the vast amount of mental energy absorbed from the planet's population at one time and as a result, merged all the minds of the dead together with itself. Now consisting of the many horrified minds of an entire planet's population, the Shi'ar technology to shut it off failed and only served to anger it and further exacerbate its insatiable hunger for thoughts and minds.
:I think the band is nearly always known as AFI. The long name is really only a point of trivia that fans know and few others care about. [[User:TUF-KAT|Tuf-Kat]] 05:23, Jun 10, 2004 (UTC)
===Flight and "Supernova"===
::Well, as near as I can tell, everything about the bound is obscure and known only to fans. ::grin:: But there are plenty of things that are at any rate ''referred to'' primarily by initials (the [[United States|US]] leaps to mind that are nonetheless properly called by their full name, and the official website also uses the full name. On the other hand, the articles on DNA and AIDS are listed under the abbreviations and not the full text, so perhaps my case for standardization is specious.[[User:Kukkurovaca| -- कुक्कुरोवाच]]|[[User talk:Kukkurovaca|Talk‽]] 07:23, 10 Jun 2004 (UTC)
Urizen eventually broke free from its Shi'ar containment fields, but found itself chased by the Hecatomb. Urizen believes this to be due to the fact that it's "scent" was familiar to Hecatomb, since Hecatomb was modeled off of Urizen.
Following a trail of psychic energy, Urizen fled from Shi'ar space to Earth, a journey that took centuries. Following behind it, Hecatomb consumed any mind that it encountered along its path.
:::Well, they were not always known as A Fire Inside, but they have always gone by the initials AFI, so there you go. [[User:Darkstarwithin|Darkstarwithin]] 08:59, 18 Jun 2004 (UTC)
Eventually arriving at Earth, Urizen took possession of the deceased body of an old men, Paul Brunner, who had been hit by a truck. Piloting the dead body, Urizen reached the gates of the X-Mansion. Upon arrival, it jumping into the mind of the recently rescued and comatose [[Lady Mastermind|Reagen Wyngarde]], leaving the X-Men to puzzle about the nature of an animated corpse of no one in partucular suddenly stopping outside their gate. They were distracted, however, by the more pressing issue at hand--the [[Children of the Vault]]. During the conflict, Reagen regained consciousness and was recruited by [[Rogue (comics)|Rogue]] onto her new team of [[X-Men (vol. 2)|X-Men]].
Speaking from my perspective, saying "I love A Fire Inside" in typical conversation or something of the like makes you seem as if you are trying too hard. Really. Another common "joke" in the AFI community is to call them "Afee" or "Ahfee"; mocking the mispronunctiation that plagues us. Some laugh hysterically. I shake my head and call you an idiot. And they have ALWAYS been A fire inside. ALWAYS. Some say A Bunch of Freaking Idiots, blahblahblah. It runs the gamut. But the band has repeatedly stated that they have always been. Just, FYI...I know...you don't care...[[User:d3s0lat3_Fa1th3]]
==="Infection"===
: Hence my username. ;) [[User:Afee|Afee]] 22:01, 19 November 2005 (UTC)
After defeating the Children of the Vault, Rogue's squad next came into conflict with Pandemic. Pandemic kidnapped Rogue to perform experiments on her to see if mutations could be caught and exploited like a virus. The team went to rescue her and during a conflict, the as of yet unrevealed Urizen protected Reagen by attacking a soldier behind her, causing [[Iceman (comics)|Iceman]] to suspect something was up with Reagen, though she appeared unaware of anything strange. Later, after Rogue had been rescued while in critcal condition, [[Sabretooth (comics)|Sabretooth]] stated that Reagen doesn't smell right and that there is something inside of her that "stinks like it's dead." Reagen also ignored these comments.
==="Red Data"===
Back when I used to listen to them in the mid-90s, the band explicitly stated that AFI didn't stand for anything, whenever people would ask! They seem to have rewritten that part of history, because I never saw the phrase ''A Fire Inside'' appear until the EP of that same name was released, after they had already released several albums. ''Abuncha Fuckin' Idiots'' was sort of the joke name for the band, and their writing credits were assigned to ''Anthems for Insubordinates'', but neither was the band's name. --[[User:Delirium|Delirium]] 05:15, Oct 15, 2004 (UTC)
In ''X-Men'' #197, While the team rushed Rogue to a hospital on Providence, an island created by Cable, Reagen demonstrated that she had been fully aware of something residing in her mind and was determined to remove it. Using her own powers of illusion on herself and some assisted hypnosis, Reagen discovered where Urizen was hiding. This is technically the first time Urizen was revealed/introduced in totallity. Urizen tried to hide behind a mental wall and even took Reagen's own form to trick her, but Reagen was hardly fooled and angrily expelled Urizen from her mind. However, Urizen forefully took over Reagen's body and made her way to Cable, whom it recognized as someone powerful enough to help it and to whom it explained the grave situation of Hecatomb's imminent arrival on Earth.
:Well, on their third album which was released in 1997, if you look on the inside of the cd case near the hinge, you can see the text "a fire inside" printed on the card.[[User:Darkstarwithin|Darkstarwithin]] 14:05, 26 Oct 2004 (UTC)
:: Granted that 'personal research' is against Wiki policy, but just to weigh in with personal experience, I was a member of security for 924 Gilman in 1994/95 and became aquaintanced with AFI (amongst others). I asked the same question they must have by now heard a blue-million times. The answer? It stands for nothing, really. Davey laughed, though, and said ''Abuncha Fuckin' Idiots''. For whatever it's worth. [[User:Saint Mahone|Saint Mahone]] 22:03, 31 March 2006 (UTC)
Urizen offered to bond with Cable and restore his lost telepathy and telekenisis, making the two fo them stronger as one to face Hecatomb. Remembering the previous threat caused by another mummudrai, [[Cassandra Nova]], the X-Men were distrustful of Urizen's motives and Cable intially refused. However, Hecatomb arrived as stated and began slaughtering the population of Providence to feed while searching for Urizen, eventually wielding the power of 8 billion minds as offensive weapons. Seeing that there was no other choice, Cable reluctantly agreed. Together, Cable and Urizen battled Hecatomb, but began losing ground when Hecatomb adapted its attacks to separate the two.
A friend of mine told me it used to be Askin' For It as that was the name of the fan club listed on one of the first albums if I remember correctly. [[User:Cdwillis|Cdwillis]] 04:06, 22 April 2006 (UTC)
===Death===
On the official messaeboard it says
In a last ditch effort, Cable/Urizen telepathically woke up Rogue, who was in critical condition and infected with Pandemic's "Strain 88", a virus that caused Rogue to instantly absorb a person's entire mind with one touch, effectively killing them. Before Rogue could get to the scene of the battle and eventually defeat it, Hecatomb managed to separate the mind meld between Cable and Urizen with a mind blast. In its final moments, Urizen screamed that it was dying and frantically begged Cable not to let Hecatomb assimilate it before Hecatomb finally consumed and "killed" Urizen.
Before Hecatomb could kill Cable next, Rogue managed to defeat it by absorbing all 8 billion of Hecatomb's merged minds into herself. Though Rogue now contains all the memories of every dead mind that Hecatomb absorbed, it is unknown whether or not Urizen's is among them.
"Has AFI always stood for A Fire Inside?"
==Powers and Abilities==
* Davey, Adam, Hunter and Jade's band has always been called "A Fire Inside."
As a mummudrai, Ev Teel Urizen possesses significant telepathic and telekinetic abilities. It is able to posess anyone with a sentient mind (though things such as Cable's forcefield can stop it) and can exploit that individual's abilities (such as using Lady Mastermind's illusions or Mystique's morphing abilities). It can also reside dormantly within a host's mind, though its ability to be detected is clear from Reagen's own psychic abilities and Sabretooth's enhanced sense of smell.
When mind-melded with Cable, Urizen's power (as a hybrid with Cable) is increased, giving them immense telekenisis (the ability to throw the Children of the Vault's ''The Conquistador'', a UCC-Type Tanker and the ability to levitate the entire island of Providence). After they are separated in ''X-Men''#199, Cable says that his telekenisis and telepathy died with Urizen.
Could it not be said that when Geoff and Mark were in the band it didn't mean anything? And that with the new members came a "new" name? 03:17, 3 June 2006 (UTC)
{{Uncategorized|date=June 2007}}
:Yeah, that sounds like a deliberately evasive answer. It does mesh with the other evidence that use of "A Fire Inside" came to the fore around the time Jade joined the band. --[[User:Delirium|Delirium]] 03:47, 10 June 2006 (UTC)
In their early CDs they are credited as Anthems for Insubordinates. I guess later they just changed their names. On other CDs like Shut Your Mouth and Open Your Eyes they call them A Fire Inside. Does that make any difference to anyone?[[User:Yourpalgiggles|{{Mistress Winter}}]] 23:23, 10 August 2006 (UTC)
:They did change their name. Maybe Davey, Adam, Hunter, and Jade's band has always been A Fire Imside, but what about the earlier incarnations of the band? That's why the Q:A cited names the bandmembers specifically. - [[User:Enzo Dragon|Enzo Dragon]] 12:10, 26 August 2006 (UTC)
: I know back in the day their website was AskForInformation.hotmail.com So maybe AFI orriginally stood for Ask For Information. <small>—The preceding [[Wikipedia:Sign your posts on talk pages|unsigned]] comment was added by [[Special:Contributions/65.25.68.76|65.25.68.76]] ([[User talk:65.25.68.76|talk]]) 16:11, 9 December 2006 (UTC).</small><!-- HagermanBot Auto-Unsigned -->
== Very Proud of Ya release date / label ==
I'm not convinced this section is correct. It states the release was '95, then re-released 96 on Nitro. However, the article doesn't mention the first album re-release on nitro (96). I think this might be a mix-up. As far as I can tell, VPOY was released for the first time on nitro in '96.<br>
: You have VPOY confused with ATASF. [[User:Afee|Afee]] 22:01, 19 November 2005 (UTC)
VPOY was officially released in 1996. I have the CD, and you can check the release date on Amazon and the official AFI site. -- [[User:Hotdoglives|Hotdoglives]] 24 October 2005
== Linked Article ==
Is there really a reason the article links to a random concert review from over two years ago? Any reason to keep it? At all? --[[User:Blue Dream|Blue Dream]] July 5, 2005 23:57 (UTC)
: well it's relevant, since it's them performing, and it isn't doing any harm... -- [[User:Jdowland|Jon Dowland]] 22:06, 13 July 2005 (UTC)
:: Eh, I guess. Alright then. --[[User:Blue Dream|Blue Dream]] 02:10, July 14, 2005 (UTC)
== Genre ==
We're on the brink of edit wars here with respect to genre, so let's get all the arguing out of the way here. We've had various edits and reverts labelling AFI as punk, punk rock, hardcore, hardcore punk. I think there's definite reason to mention a gothic influence encompassing all hallows to the art of drowning, too. -- [[User:Jdowland|Jon Dowland]] 08:27, 18 July 2005 (UTC)
:There ya' go! Gothic music is practically defined by horror imagery and themes (though I don't mean to downplay it's other attributes and structural differences from punk). AFI has DEFINATELY had horror themes and imagery as a mainstay since All Hallows (at least). You simply can't deny the influence. - [[User:Enzo Dragon|Enzo Dragon]] 10:03, 23 August 2006 (UTC)
::: Gothic Rock/Death Rock spawned from the Punk scene. AFI are really neither though. [[User:JanderVK|JanderVK]]
To whoever wrote the new genre sentence: Good save. [[User:Afee|Afee]] 22:01, 19 November 2005 (UTC)
Yep, definately can't be labelled as hardcore, maybe gothic/punk? Musically wise they seem to have a punkish sound, but lyrically definately goth [[User:222.154.66.70|222.154.66.70]] 07:08, 4 June 2006 (UTC)
:AFI started as a hardcore punk band, and those roots echo in their music right up to Decemberunderground (best example is Kill Caustic). AFI themselves have confirmed this. Therefor, the hardcore label stays. - [[User:Enzo Dragon|Enzo Dragon]] 17:59, 26 August 2006 (UTC)
I think the genres listed now are OK. Though people need to stop adding emo. [[User:Dwnsjane2|Dwnsjane2]]
They started as punk/harcore, then expanded their sound, most notably incorporating elements of gothic rock. I have no idea where the emo tag comes from; in fact i've never heard anyoe outside of Wikipedia call them emo. The current genre terms (alternative, punk, hardcore) are fine by me. [[User:WesleyDodds|WesleyDodds]] 01:43, 19 June 2006 (UTC)
:Though AFI seem to have dropped the horror imagery for the most part, they've turned around and picked up some cyber-goth tricks. Best example is 37mm. - [[User:Enzo Dragon|Enzo Dragon]] 13:15, 23 August 2006 (UTC)
I think goth/punk is fine I guess.-Leandreamo
Whoever wrote the new label is wrong. AFI isn't emo. Their myspace (yes I'm a myspacer) labels them as rock/rock/rock. I think they should be labeled as rock or gothic rock, because they definitely aren't emo. No offense to emos, but labeling AFI as emo is an insult to AFI.
::The term "emo" is PURELY a market-based term now, anyway. AFI is listed under their label as punk/alternative rock. Their myspace claims they are rock. MTV (though I hate to cite them) refers to them as punk rock. The only people claiming they are emo are misinformed, worthless magazines that have little or no understanding of what the tag "emo" refers to. [[User:Enzo Dragon|Enzo Dragon]] 10:03, 23 August 2006 (UTC)
::Agreed. Except they are not gothic rock.
Havok is influenced by some Gothic rock groups, but that doesn't make AFI themselves part of that genre, Alternative will do. - [[User:Deathrocker|Deathrocker]] 01:05, 8 July 2006 (UTC)
::: I re-added the meniton of emo elements on some tracks, with a citation to People magazine. Fullquote: "AFI (which stands for A Fire Inside) also incorporates elements of emo on cuts like "Summer Shudder," showing they are a band for all seasons." Please do not delete cited material. -- [[User:JHunterJ|JHunterJ]] 11:28, 9 July 2006 (UTC)
::::One of the reasons your addition continues to be removed is that it is presented as fact. Perhaps if you were to present it as quoted opinion, not as many people would remove it. - [[User:Enzo Dragon|Enzo Dragon]] 22:33, 2 September 2006 (UTC)
::::: It is presented as fact in the cited article. (Please use <nowiki>~~~~</nowiki> to sign your talk page comments.) -- [[User:JHunterJ|JHunterJ]] 11:24, 21 August 2006 (UTC)
::::::Yet, the article you are citing is, itself, a collection of the writer's opinions on AFI, not neccessarily facts. Such writing style is fine for magazines like "People", but Wikipedia is not a magazine. It is an encyclopedia, and so the content is expected to be fact, and not just some person's opinion. If you're going to make claims that AFI incorporates elements of "emo" and treat it as fact in an encyclopedia article, you'd better have a citation better than a magazine based around opinion. I think for such an accusation to be made and treated as fact, you'd need to be able to cite the band itself. - [[User:Enzo Dragon|Enzo Dragon]] 12:04, 26 August 2006 (UTC) <small>Stop signing my posts for me, kid.</small>
:::::::Classifying music into genres is inherently a matter of opinion anyway, since the classifications are just agreements between listeners. "AFI is rock" is opinion, at its core. If you're going to deny the cited claim, the burden is on you to find a "better" citation. (Citing the band itself is still citing an opinion: the band members' opinion.) -- [[User:JHunterJ|JHunterJ]] 11:16, 22 August 2006 (UTC)
::::::::Ha ha. "Better citation". Who's opinion does "better" need to agree with? Still, I think although genre is somewhat based upon opinion, there is a largely technical side to defining musical genre. - [[User:Enzo Dragon|Enzo Dragon]] 10:03, 23 August 2006 (UTC)
:::::::::Well, let's start with "any" citation. I only put "better" in quotes because you appear to disdain the People magazine cite. Or cite the technical definition of emo that the tracks can be objectively compared to. -- [[User:JHunterJ|JHunterJ]]
::::::::::I'll get right on that, then. - [[User:Enzo Dragon|Enzo Dragon]] 13:17, 23 August 2006 (UTC)
:::: I suppose I can't delete because the emo note because it is sourced. As long as that mention doesn't justifly the genre being changed to emo or emo being added as a genre. Because obviously the term emo should only be applied to the emotional hardcore bands (Rites Of Spring, Moss Icon etc.) and the post-/indie emo that were influnced by them (Sunny Day Real Estate, Get Up Kids etc.). [[User:Dwnsjane2|Dwnsjane2]] 23:11, 9 July 2006 (UTC)
::: I'm also hopeful that having a note that some songs have emo elements will help ward off editors who would otherwise add it as a genre. -- [[User:JHunterJ|JHunterJ]] 23:19, 9 July 2006 (UTC)
:::I will only be okay with an emo label if the band members themselves would confirm it. Otherwise they're alternative rock. There's a dozen labels that could be attributed to this band, since their music is somewhat unique in comparison to other bands of the same "alternative" genre. Remember, because they have a song called "Endlessly, She Said" doesn't qualify an Emo label. Remember, Evanescence got the Christian label with their song "Tourniquet" because of the lyrics. So in the mean time, I think it would be best to keep the genre as Rock or Alternative. And I agree, it may be okay to add that some songs have emo elements, in addition to gothic and punk. --[[User:Prezboy1|Prezboy1]] 16:12, 23 July 2006 (UTC)
Why should AFI be classified as gothic. The only reason one would classify them as that genre, if can even call it a genre, is because of the way they, or should I say the way Davey looks.--[[User:Ahlymel|Ahlymel]] 01:33, 31 July 2006 (UTC)
::Though I wouldn't go as far as to say that AFI is "gothic rock", they have noted bands of both the post-punk and gothic persuation as influences, and every album since Shut Your Mouth has had a tint of trad goth in it, whether it be in the sound or imagery they use in their songs. [[User:Enzo Dragon|Enzo Dragon]] 10:03, 23 August 2006 (UTC)
AFI shouldn't be classified as gothic. I was just pointing out that while some elements of different songs have been called "emo", there are just as many songs that could be classified as having gothic undertones. As I said before, AFI is either Alternative or Punk... and until the band members classify their genre as something else then I believe it is okay to change it. --[[User:Prezboy1|Prezboy1]] 20:30, 1 August 2006 (UTC)
:: You will find that Emo is to represent the amount of emotion in the lyrics. AFI meets the criteria.
::: There's a lot of emotion in a lot of different bands lyrics, doesn't make them "Emo". Give me a break. As for Gothic Rock, yes Davey has been influenced by a few trad Goth bands, but doesn't make the band Gothic Rock at all. Their latest release has Rhonan Harris (SP?) of VNV Nation doing samples, but that doesn't make them FuturePop. I see more elements of Industrial/EBM (in their latest stuff) than Gothic Rock in any of their stuff. [[User:JanderVK|JanderVK]]
::::Totally agreed. AFI has been leaning into Industrial since Sing the Sorrow, and it's stronger on Decemberunderground, though I wouldn't list it as a genre as of right now. [[User:Enzo Dragon|Enzo Dragon]] 21:55, 2 November 2006 (UTC)
I'd say A Fire Inside was/is/has been an emocore (REAL emocore, not the MTVfriendly pop rock bands that whore themselves as being emo), punk, gothic hardcore and alternative band.
First 2 albums are definitely emocore/emocore-influenced punk. The next 3 are more gothic-influenced punk/alternative/rock. Sing the Sorrow a Gothic Hardcore/Alternative album. And finally DecemberUnderground a Modern Rock/Alternative Pop/Gothic album.
[[User: Gothic Embrace|Gothic Embrace]] 22:15 (GMT +1) 27th October 2006
: A Fire Inside is definitely NOT Hardcore Punk present day. So I edited it a bit.
[[User: Gothic Embrace|Gothic Embrace]] 21:27 (GMT +1) 29th October 2006
::The state of the term "Emo" is a joke. Bands acredited to supposedly have started Emotive (Fugazi, Rites of Spring) have at one time or another openly admitted that they had done nothing but write punk rock, and often wonder why they had been put under a new genre.
::At any rate, until you started abusing the edit feature, the genre section had genrely settled. It is in wide concurance that AFI is now Alternative Rock, and AFI themselves only state Rock as their genre (take a look at their myspace). The song Kill Caustic, and, to a lesser extent, Affliction, are both "Hardcore Punk" songs. Davey has stated this (read pre-release interviews), and the music itself reflects the stylings of hardcore punk music.
::I strongly suggest you refrain from kicking this silly little edit-war farther - the changes will continue to be reverted by everyone else. [[User:Enzo Dragon|Enzo Dragon]] 21:47, 2 November 2006 (UTC)
:::Haha. Whatever. Calling those songs hardcore punk is wrong and misleading. But alright. I've already heard of the band, so I won't be checking into wikipedia to find info about it. And I am aware of the bands starting the emocore scene opposes the tag "emo". They are still considered the founders of the genré. Gothic Embrace 14:03, 3 November 2006 (UTC)
::::They are not hardcore punk songs. However Hardcore Punk Should remain in the infobox because the band has played hardcore punk and still has some hardcore influences in even their more recent work. Though little, they have not completly abandoned the genre.
And they started the emocore scene? Read the article on emo.[[User:Dwnsjane2|Dwnsjane2]] 00:37, 4 November 2006 (UTC)
Whoa whoa whoa I have no idea how they could be labeled "hardcore punk". Is it because he screams every so often and they use a faster beat in some songs? Labeling them as such is an insult to Black Flag, Bad Brains, Gorilla Biscuits and the like. "Hardcore" and "Hardcore Punk" is much more than just a different way to play your instruments or sing.
::No it is not. Their first few albums were hardcore punk. [[User:Dwnsjane2|Dwnsjane2]] 23:13, 4 November 2006 (UTC)
:::"Their _first_ few albums were hardcore punk". Which again means: labelling them as a present hardcore act is incorrect. Look at the Black Flag article, it doesn't say that they're a hardcore punk band, now does it? And besides: their first albums sounded way more old skool emocore than hardcore. [[User:Gothic Embrace|Gothic Embrace]] 14:52, 5 November 2006 (UTC)
::::Yes, their first few albums were hardcore punk. The hardcore influence however is still somewhat present. Therefore it should remain in the infobox. [[User:Dwnsjane2|Dwnsjane2]] 02:16, 6 November 2006 (UTC)
:::::They are gothic and horror punk influenced... should "gothic rock" or "horror punk" be added to the genrélist? [[User:Gothic Embrace|Gothic Embrace]] 11:34, 6 November 2006 (UTC)
"Whoa whoa whoa I have no idea how they could be labeled 'hardcore punk'. Is it because he screams every so often and they use a faster beat in some songs? Labeling them as such is an insult to Black Flag, Bad Brains, Gorilla Biscuits and the like. "Hardcore" and "Hardcore Punk" is much more than just a different way to play your instruments or sing."
Obviously, this person has never heard past albums.
----They have changed their genre throughout their career. right now it is emo, and in the past it has been all of the above mentioned genres.
----I swear, Davey gets a hair cut and all of the sudden they are tagged as "emo", which I completely don't understand since ALL music is emotional
:::I don't know who put "Cold wave" in the genre section, but I think it should be removed because right now, it links to a weather page. [[User:Lizzysama|Lizzysama]] 21:47, 10 December 2006 (UTC)
AFI have certainly been a hardcore punk band since they formed, and the hardcore sound is evident right up to DU. But i think that some songs on "The Art of Drowning" and much of "Sing the Sorrow" would be best classified as melodic hardcore. Listen to Dancing through SUnday.
== Albums/Vinyls/EPs without pages ==
Given that I'm going to have an excess of free time in the near future, I think I am going to take it upon myself to flesh out AFI's discography a bit more. I started working on ''336'' a little. Question, though: would it be appropriate of me to add them into the rotation on the individual existing album pages? For example, currently ''[[The Art of Drowning]]'' links forward to ''[[Sing the Sorrow]]'', and ''Sing the Sorrow'' back to ''The Art of Drowning'', despite ''[[336/Now The World|336]]'' coming out between them. Once I get the ''336'' page up to snuff, shall I set those two pages to link to it, and have it link forward and back to them?--[[User:Blue Dream|Blue Dream]] 19:55, July 20, 2005 (UTC)
: Well, ''336'' isn't an album, so I wouldn't suggest doing that. Looking at e.g. [[Bloodflowers]], singles/EPs etc. are not included in the rotation. However, the box on the RHS of [[Broken (album)]] indicates that singles, EPs etc. ''are'' included in the rotation for [[Nine Inch Nails]] (note also the page title being prefixed with (album), dispite it not being an album). I'd suggest looking around other groups and seeing what the concensus is. NIN may be an exceptional case, as every last release of theirs was given a unique sequencing ('halo') number, singles and all. I think some of AFI's earlier releases may be more difficult to include like this, so I'm inclined to think only albums should be in it. -- [[User:Jdowland|Jon Dowland]] 11:25, 21 July 2005 (UTC)
:: I agree with you that NIN doesn't really work as an example either way, with their Halo system and all, but I think that EPs of entirely new material deserve -- i.e., ''All Hallow's'', ''A Fire Inside'', and ''336'' -- should be... well, I don't want to say treated as albums, because they're not... essentially, I think there's a difference between a single, which may or may not include any b-sides, and an EP, which is specifically new material, generally. The Cure haven't really had any EPs, per se... even though they did have a few non-album singles back in the day -- which somewhat defeats my point, doesn't it, then? Hm... --[[User:Blue Dream|Blue Dream]] 19:21, July 21, 2005 (UTC)
:::It's all debatable: I guess this goes to show there are no hard and fast rules :) I'd argue that [[Japanese_Whispers]] was an EP. -- [[User:Jdowland|Jon Dowland]] 11:35, 22 July 2005 (UTC)
Or are the EPs and early stuff not significant enough to warrant that? Thoughts, anyone?--[[User:Blue Dream|Blue Dream]] 19:55, July 20, 2005 (UTC)
: well, personally, I think the All Hallows EP is their best release - I intend to work on, if not write entirely, that article someday. -- [[User:Jdowland|Jon Dowland]] 11:25, 21 July 2005 (UTC)
Or hell, is this job not worth doing at all? --[[User:Blue Dream|Blue Dream]] 19:55, July 20, 2005 (UTC)
: it's up to you what you spend your time doing :-) -- [[User:Jdowland|Jon Dowland]] 11:25, 21 July 2005 (UTC)
: You've done a great job with the discography. It makes me feel all warm inside to look at that enormous list of releases because it really shows at a glance that AFI was around before StS. Besides, the albums are the things that really MAKE the band - their history and all that is extra stuff. I would consider the EPs as equal to the albums. There's a huge difference in length, but isn't ''All Hallow's'' usually acknowledged as one of their BEST albums? ''A Fire Inside'' was the last album made with a member of the original line-up (the end of an era), and ''336'' is part of the ''Clandestine'' and ''Sing the Sorrow'' mystery that's had fans over-analyzing things for three years now. Wow. [[User:Afee|Afee]] 21:55, 19 November 2005 (UTC)
===Singles===
I really do not think the articles for the following are needed:
*[[Girl's Not Grey UK 7"]]
*[[Girl's Not Grey Germany]]
*[[Girl's Not Grey Europe]] (says its an album, but only has 4 tracks)
*[[The Leaving Song Pt.II UK 7"]]
*[[The Leaving Song Pt.II Australian Tour Edition]]
*[[The Leaving Song Pt.II Germany]]
*[[The Leaving Song Pt. II EU Cassette]]
*[[The Leaving Song Pt.II UK CD1]]
*[[The Leaving Song Pt.II UK CD2]]
They are devoid of much information and are quite pointless, they haven't even been linked to. There should only be one Girl's Not Grey and The Leavig Song article (at MOST) each, every format should not get its own article. I think they should be labelled for deletion. Plus, articles should '''start with the article name''' and articles such as these should '''include the band's name''' in the first few lines, not only as a category. [[User:Tartan|Tartan]] 22:58, 10 May 2006 (UTC)
::Done. I've merged them all into one article for each. [[User:Dwnsjane2|Dwnsjane2]] 03:37, 11 June 2006 (UTC)
:::Didn't notice this till now, but thanks for that. [[User:Tartan|Tartan]] 16:29, 20 June 2006 (UTC)
I'd like to point out that there is no confirmation that Kill Caustic is going to be the next single. [[User:X stella|X stella]] 21:01, 31 October 2006 (UTC)
Furthermore, I'd also like to point out that Endlessly, She Said has not been confirmed as the next single. So far there has been no official news of the next single. I'd like to see the sources for where people are getting this information. [[User:X stella|X stella]] 20:44, 2 November 2006 (UTC)
==Dates==
Shouldn't the dates be wikified? [[User:Raylu|raylu]] 17:35, August 13, 2005 (UTC)
: The first occurence of each, sure. -- [[User:Jdowland|Jon Dowland]] 23:49, 13 August 2005 (UTC)
==Compilations==
Down in the compilations section... Myspace Records doesn't need the "Rabbits are Roadkill" song name listed by it. None of the other compilations have the song names listed. No reason to start doing it now, unless you mean to go back and add the song names to the other compiliations too. --[[User:Hotdoglives|Hotdoglives]] 12:28, 22 December 2005 (UTC)
== Vandalizing ==
It appears someone didn't like AFI too much and vandalize the Bio section to say "AFI Sucks!" in large, bold letter before the article started. As far as I can tell, it's the only change he made. I edited it back. If you check the history, the change is the one right before mine- I'm not sure if this guy has vandalized more articles, that might be something to look into. [[User:Mouseclicker|Mouseclicker]] 05:42, 23 February 2006 (UTC)
Nope. He hasn't. --[[User:Dwnsjane|Dwnsjane]] 05:58, 5 March 2006 (UTC)
:You can find out the edits of any user by going to the "my contributions" link that is at the top of the page when you are logged in (right next to the links to watchlist and logout). Click on it and it will show all your edits. Look at the URL and just change the username to the username you want to see and viola! If there are spaces in the username, use_underscores_like_this. There is probably an easier way, but that's how I do it. [[User:The Ungovernable Force|The Ungovernable Force]] 07:45, 14 March 2006 (UTC)
There is also another vandalism that doesn't seem to have been reported here recently: just before the "mainstream success" section, there is a bit of vandalism that I can't seem to remove, no matter which edit I click, Including the one at the top. I'm referring to the statement beginning with "A BAG OF W***", and I don't know how they did this. [[User:TIKKIMANN|TIKKIMANN]] 21:42, 22 November 2006 (UTC)
== Compilations ==
The compilations section is huge. I've moved the "real" compilations into it (the eponymous release on Nitro and the vinyl boxed-set), but the others are mostly multi-artist punk comps. It would make more sense to list the actual song(s) that AFI ahve on those comps where possible, but also that should go in it's own article as it really crowds out the rest of the info on this one. Assuming there are no objections I'll do that in the near future. -- [[User:Jdowland|Jon Dowland]] 20:53, 20 April 2006 (UTC)
== previous members ==
I was just wondering why there is no reference to AFI's previous members. And this article also says right at the top that AFI was formed by not only Davey and Adam, but also Hunter and Jade. That isn't true. This should be fixed by somebody.[[User:Conner f|Conner f]] 01:57, 4 May 2006 (UTC)
==Covers==
Since now we are listing the covers, we need to make an organized list of them, to replace the messy paragraph we have now. [[User:Hotdoglives|Hotdoglives]] 07:00, 16 May 2006 (UTC)
==Years Active==
Didn't the band become inactive both between 1993 and 1995 (when members attended college) and in 1998 (when Mark left)? --[[User:Kahlfin|Kahlfin]] 18:54, 16 May 2006 (UTC)
==Lower It==
In the biography, I found the following sentence: "The song 'Lower It' is rumored to be about straight edge kids who do not stay straight edge." I searched and could not find a source for it. I myself have heard rumors both that the song is about Mark and that the song is political. Unless someone can find a source, I'm going to remove it. --[[User:Kahlfin|Kahlfin]] 19:10, 17 May 2006 (UTC)
==Too Many Links==
Do we really need so many links at the bottom of the page? I think the offical AFI Site, The DF, The Myspace and maybe AFISeries should suffice. This isn't a bulletin board for every fansite out there. [[User:Krys Nyteshade|Krys Nyteshade]] 19:51, 30 May 2006 (UTC)
:I agree. I think some people have been adding their own fansites just to get publicity. Let's take some of those down. [[User:Hotdoglives|Hotdoglives]] 10:17, 31 May 2006 (UTC)
:AFI Series deserves to be linked down at the bottom. It's probably the only AFI fansite that gets exclusive material and permissions from the band. - [[User:Enzo Dragon|Enzo Dragon]] 10:04, 23 August 2006 (UTC)
Just went and dropped a couple of more that had popped up. Uh, looks like I'm not logged in. This is Krys again.
== Bands Agent ==
I am a writer, trying to get an interview with AFI, but have not been able to contact them. Do you know how to contact their agent, or the direct members?
yeah check out Fuse "Making of Miss Murder" and they show there tour manager. jaykob
I'm not sure. Althouh looking on their website might help. [[User:Dwnsjane2|Dwnsjane2]] 06:20, 4 June 2006 (UTC)
== The Offspring Cover ==
The Offspring covered AFI's Totalimmortal (All Hallows EP) for the soundtrack of Me Myself & Irene (2000). It got a fair amount of radio play, and helped in exposing AFI to larger audiences. The lead singer of The Offspring, Dexter Holland, at the time owned the label AFI was signed to (Nitro Records), and is featured as a backing vocalist on a number of Black Sails songs. Important enough? [[User:GoodCyning|GoodCyning]] 16:53, 19 June 2006 (UTC)
:I would think so. Where would it go in the article? --[[User:Kahlfin|Kahlfin]] 21:59, 22 June 2006 (UTC)
== Logo ==
The current image of the band's logo looks like it was made on MSPaint or something...Someone please find a higher-quality rendering of it if u can. Unless, of course, the band simply favors crappily-drawn logos. --[[User:Wikiwow|Wikiwow]] 18:08, 24 July 2006 (UTC)
:I have a better image of the logo but i have no idea how to get it up. Would anybody like to tell me how? -- ''posted anonymously at 18:21, July 28, 2006 from IP 152.163.100.73''
::There should be an "Upload file" link in the toolbox on the left-hand side of the page. You may need to register first, or get a registered user to upload it for you. -- [[User:JHunterJ|JHunterJ]] 13:29, 29 July 2006 (UTC)
:Ok. So I found the upload thing. Only problem is that it confuses the hell out of me. So I guess you guys will have to find someone who understands how to do all that.--[[User:Conner f|Conner f]] 22:31, 29 July 2006 (UTC)
::There's also [[Wikipedia:Uploading images]]. If there's still confusion, that page (uploading images) should be edited to clarify the process. Let me know if so! -- [[User:JHunterJ|JHunterJ]] 23:49, 29 July 2006 (UTC)
:I finally managed to change the logo. My confusion was lifted after going over things in the uploading images article like suggested. It should look better than the previous one. If not, it's my fault[[User:Conner f|Conner f]] 00:08, 10 August 2006 (UTC)
:Just so you two know, the the logo that had been featured here was actually a very, very high quality rendition. The reason it looked so crappy on the wiki is that it has a fade-boarder, meant for a color other than white. - [[User:Enzo Dragon|Enzo Dragon]] 10:09, 23 August 2006 (UTC)
== VMAs & Mystery ==
I think it should be added that AFI is nominated for this year's VMAs under Best Rock Video,
Best Direction in a Video, and Best Cinematography in a Video.
Also, I was very surprised to see that there was no mention of the Charlotte/336/Clandestine mystery. It's become an obsession to many AFI fans, new and old.
--[[User:Echoing0comfort|Echoing0comfort]] 04:38, 8 August 2006 (UTC)
:It'd be hard to mention Clandestine within the band's wiki. However, if someone wanted to start a seperate wiki on the mystery, and then list it under "see also:", I'd get behind it. [[User:Enzo Dragon|Enzo Dragon]] 10:08, 23 August 2006 (UTC)
::I'm going to try to add unfo about the mystery that into the article. Though it I can't go into the entire mystery in detail because for the most part it is alot of unconfirmed facts. As for the VMA, I don't think it is nessasary to add that to the article until we find the results. [[User:Dwnsjane2|Dwnsjane2]] 18:22, 22 August 2006 (UTC)
:::I wouldn't call any part of Clandestine "uncomfirmed facts". There are beliefs some fans hold that are entirely false, however, so you'd want the right people to help you write. - [[User:Enzo Dragon|Enzo Dragon]] 10:08, 23 August 2006 (UTC)
::::Alot of it is unconfirmed facts. None of the theories suggested have been confirmed by the band is true. The only confirmed facts are the obvious evidence, and the short film.
:::::I wouldn't describe someone's theory as a "fact" in any context, and the mystery isn't based around those theories, reguardless. Therefor, you COULD describe the entire mystery in detail without any problem, and leave the reader to come up with their own theories. - [[User:Enzo Dragon|Enzo Dragon]] 12:06, 26 August 2006 (UTC)
::::::they won.
== Other Notes section ==
I think that the "other notes" really breaks up the flow of the article. When I read it, it sounds very "by-the-way". Perhaps I'm just crazy. Still - is there any way we can get all of those facts in without it reading like a bunch of forks in a newspaper? - [[User:Enzo Dragon|Enzo Dragon]] 10:05, 23 August 2006 (UTC)
::I've tried to incoperate as much of those into the article as possible. Because some of them occur to me as more part of the history of the band as opposed to trivia. [[User:Dwnsjane2|Dwnsjane2]] 18:19, 22 August 2006 (UTC)
== We need to get this article locked. ==
I'm getting tired of idiots coming in and putting [[emo]] in the music genre area.
:Hey, I think it should be locked too. It's not A Flute Inside people. Their page isn't a page for opinions
::Actually, we don't need to lock it, we simply must revert vandalism. Editors, note that the first comment above was made by the same address that vandalized [[AFI (band)]] in recent days [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=AFI_%28band%29&diff=prev&oldid=80350976 here]. And when you revert vandalism, why not take the time to go back to the last clean version. Remove ALL the vandalism, not just one "Flute". [[User:BabuBhatt|BabuBhatt]] 16:31, 24 October 2006 (UTC)
I apologize for that. My eight your old brother makes joke edits on wikipedia. I haven't vandalized anything. I am also a fan of AFI.
should someone put that the missing frame in the music videos is coming out in january? or is that fake cause i read it from here...
== DVD and decemberunderground Special Edition ==
Is there a reason why the inof on them keeps on getting deleted every time i put it up? ([[User:Zeropunk16|Zeropunk16]] 08:02, 28 October 2006 (UTC))
== Genre Section ==
I'd have just put this under the "Genre" headline already created, but I think this deserves special attention.
GothicEmbrace made an edit awhile down the line, and then continued insisting that the genre section should be devided into sections (Early/Mid/Current, or something along those lines). It seems to me that this is both unprecidented and unecessary. Take, for instance, the Clash, a band that has been around the spectrum quite a bit. It's article is not devided into sections, but instead the genres are listed without noting the time-period. This seems most practicle to me, since the job of a band article, as I see it, is to provide information on the band in all years - it is the job of Album articles to assign a genre to individual eras.
Certainly by way of ear-work, we can hear AFI's roots up into their latest work, both in the Hardcore Punk and Punk Rock genres, which makes AFI's case much more a candidate for non-sectioned genre.
[[User:70.16.196.104|70.16.196.104]] 05:46, 4 November 2006 (UTC)
:Emo would be the genre I would classify them as. Seeing as "Correctly or not, emo has often been used to describe such bands as AFI, Alexisonfire, Brand New, Bright Eyes, Coheed and Cambria..."
::AFI is only listed for the sake of objectivity. It says "'''Correctly or not'''", meaning that not all of the band's listed fall within the boundaries of 3rd wave emo. - [[User:Enzo Dragon|Enzo Dragon]] 00:29, 7 November 2006 (UTC)
==Spelling of AFI==
iTunes spell the band A.F.I. What is the correct spelling? [[User:DavidJJJ|DJJJ]] 15:13, 9 November 2006 (UTC)
::It is spelled on the albums without the periods. I'm pretty sure it's AFI. [[User:69.248.110.202|69.248.110.202]] 01:18, 14 November 2006 (UTC)
==New CD?==
The page lists "Clandestine Lullabies" as coming out in 2007. Did I miss something?
== Good ==
These pages are some of the best I've ever read! I think you did a realy good job making and addin these entries. I know alot about Afi cuz i have every single album. YOU NOOB!!!!!!!!!
== AFI is not emo ==
What the hell how come it says that AFI is a emo band???? And it even says that in the beginning they formed an Emo band??? Now i dont know that much about AFI but i know that they are not emo and never were. Any body with the Danzig haircut is deffinetly punk and not emo. Im not going to change it but some one please do. <small>—The preceding [[Wikipedia:Sign your posts on talk pages|unsigned]] comment was added by [[User:Keioffice|Keioffice]] ([[User talk:Keioffice|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/Keioffice|contribs]]) 09:12, 12 December 2006 (UTC).</small><!-- HagermanBot Auto-Unsigned -->
:Done. [[User:Oliver Brown|Ollie]] 16:12, 12 December 2006 (UTC)
== New EP? ==
"The band is also planning on recording a new E.P that should be out by late spring."
Where was this found out at? [[User:Zeropunk16|Zeropunk16]] 22:12, 12 December 2006 (UTC)
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