Talk:Professional wrestling match types and User talk:76.102.153.133: Difference between pages

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{{pro-wrestling}}

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__TOC__

"This is a one fall match where three wrestlers fight instead of two. The winner of this match is the first wrestler to get a pin fall or submission. What happens in the case of a disqualification is not clear (I've never seen it happen)."

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In the event of a disqualification or count-out the match continues with only two legal competitors.

Some missing match types:

*Triple Cage

*Bra and Panties/Tuxedo

*Elmination Chamber

*Survivor Series

Um are these all real? Some look they come from the fictional world of video gamedom. --[[User:Stevertigo|<strong>&#25140;&#30505sv</Strong>]] 06:01, Aug 29, 2003 (UTC)

*Triple Cage was done by WCW. Hogan & Savage vs. 8 Men as I recall.

*Bra & Panties - done several times by WWE. Tuxedo was done once in a Lilian Garcia/Howard Finkel match

*Elimination Chamber...done 3 times by WWE.

*Survivor Series - give me a break.

I have also added to the death match type area the Electrified Pool Barbed Wire Rope match. It was fought in FMW during 1992. I have video proof on my computer also if anyone wants conformation. The participants were Gladiator, Mr. Pogo & Hideki Hosaka vs. Gannosuke, Onita & Niyama.

:The three-tiered cage was most recently used in 2000 as part of "War Games: Russo's Revenge," a match held on Monday Nitro. It was most famously used at Slamboree 2000 in a World Heavyweight Championship match between David Arquette, Diamond Dallas Page, and Jeff Jarrett. So in other words, yeah, it's been used. [[User:Jeff Silvers|Jeff Silvers]] 21:19, 16 December 2005 (UTC)

::The Tuxedo Match has been done a lot more than "one time", it was a staple of managerial feuds in the 80s and is where the Bra & Panties match came from. It deserves to be in there, if not the actual name of the entry. [[User:Bdve|Bdve]] 02:07, 18 January 2006 (UTC)

----

Remember that measurements quoted by announcers (such as "20 feet high") are usually overstated for dramatic effect. Don't take them at face value.

I'll start pages listing throws, holds, etc. soon. --[[User:gwalla|gwalla]]

== Cleanup ==

I added a cleanup notice. There's just too many matches under the first main heading. They should be divided into types of matches - submission, hardcore, special stipulation, etc.

I also deleted some "fake" match types. The "David Kara" matchtype was probably fake - for one thing, the only search results Google came up with were two - both link to content from this page. If anyone has evidence on the "School House" one, post it here. --[[User:Jtalledo|Jtalledo]] 23:48, 4 Mar 2005 (UTC)

*The only ''shool house match'' i can think of is the one between Tommy Dreamer and Chris Nowinski, this saw them fight in a school house room (blackboard, school desks, school chairs and such) but they didnt have to find anything because Dreamer won by pin fall

A lot of these seem redundant. There's several versions of matches that are "no disqualification with gimmick", "strip your opponent", or "get the item to win" with a slightly different gimmick. A lot of them were done only as one-time gimmicks that failed, cheesecake matches involving sub-par women wrestlers with large breasts, or matches that only made sense in context ("I respect you" was only done to put Brian Pillman over. There wasn't even really a match there. It certainly doesn't deserve it's own category, at best it should be a footnote under "I Quit"). A lot of these matches, though, did happen at one time or another. Pro Wresting has never been one to shy away from a bad idea. --[[User:UsaSatsui|UsaSatsui]] 09:16, 8 Jun 2005 (UTC)

== Refactor ==

I've just done a bit of cleanup, but this article is in desperate need of a refactor. The list is enormous, and other than the separation into singles, tag, and "extreme" categories there is almost no order to any of it.

I think we should separate multiple-man melees from the regular singles matches, and also separate stipulations on consequences (such as "I Quit"), which can be applied to basically any sort of rule set, from matches with different rules (such as "no DQ" or "ladder match"). And alphabetize everything within those categories. We can probably also consolidate some match types: "I Quit" and Retirement are almost identical, and the Royal Rumble is just a variant of the classic Battle Royale. [[User:Gwalla|<nowiki></nowiki>]] &mdash; [[User:Gwalla|Gwalla]] | [[User talk:Gwalla|Talk]] 05:40, 27 Apr 2005 (UTC)

:Giving this a little bit more thought, I think the article has grown to the point where it can't be easily maintained. How about we split off [[List of professional wrestling tag team match types]] and [[List of professional wrestling melee match types]], moving this to [[List of professional wrestling singles match types]], and create a new article [[Stipulation (professional wrestling)]] for the stipulations like "I Quit"? Or maybe "list of varieties of..." would be better than "...types", which sounds a little too informal. [[User:Gwalla|<nowiki></nowiki>]] &mdash; [[User:Gwalla|Gwalla]] | [[User talk:Gwalla|Talk]] 02:25, 1 May 2005 (UTC)

::Rather than splitting off a list of tag team match types, perhaps merging them into [[tag team]] would be more useful? [[User:Gwalla|<nowiki></nowiki>]] &mdash; [[User:Gwalla|Gwalla]] | [[User talk:Gwalla|Talk]] 03:07, 29 May 2005 (UTC)

==Dubious matches==

Some of the matches in here I've never ever heard of, do not cite any actual uses of the terms, and generally seem of dubious veracity. These include the Bar Room Brawl, Dutchess [sic] of Queensberry Rules Match, Good Housekeeping Match, Jailhouse Match, Junkyard Scrap, and White Castle of Fear Match (says it's just a leather strap match, but where does that name come from?). Match types, like everything in Wikipedia, '''''[[Wikipedia:Verifiability|need to be verifiable]]'''''. Unless we get some cited instances of these match types in actual use (not your favorite e-fed) soon, I'm going to start deleting them.

Most of the "extreme variations" (I still don't like that division) also need cites, as anyone can come up with a 10,000,000 Thumbtack Barbwire Poisoned Katana C4 Ninja Star Elimination Match or whatever. [[User:Gwalla|<nowiki></nowiki>]] &mdash; [[User:Gwalla|Gwalla]] | [[User talk:Gwalla|Talk]] 03:07, 29 May 2005 (UTC)

:Well, I can back up my additions-

*Bar Room Brawl was on July 27, 2003 at Vengeance, including the APA and a few jobbers.

*Duchess of Queensberry match was at a WWF PPV in 2001 between Chris Jericho and William Regal at Backlash on April 28, 2001.

*Jailhouse Match was in the WWF between the Mountie and Big Bossman on August 26, 1991 at Summerslam

*White Castle of Fear match was a heavily promoted Vader / Sting match in WCW at SuperBrawl 3 on February 21, 1993

*Cry Baby match was at In Your House 6 on February 18, 1996.

I don't know about the junkyard match. That one might be fake. The same goes for some of the "extreme variations".

[[User:McPhail|McPhail]] 23:29, 30 May 2005 (UTC)

I have seen a Lucha en Juala Electrificada match before, it was Chessman and Charly Manson vs. Electro Shock and El Zorro. I think I actually wrote a review for that episode... --[[User:Darren Jowalsen|Darren Jowalsen]] 02:31, Jun 11, 2005 (UTC)

:The Junkyard match was held as part of WCW's Bash at the Beach 1999, though it was referred to as the "Junkyard Invitational" match, not the "Junkyard Scrap" match. I'll make that correction. Also, the "Good Housekeeping" match was held at WWF No Mercy 1999, between Chyna and Jeff Jarrett. --[[User:HeartBurn Kid|HBK]] 16:53, Jun 11, 2005 (UTC)

The C4 match was used in Japan involving mick foley

==Splitting and renaming this article==

This article has gotten to be almost unmanageably large. It's time to consider breakouts.

I suggest we break this into separate list articles for singles/three-man matches and melee matches; perhaps the three-man matches (handicap, triple threat, three way dance) should get their own article. Tag team match types should be merged into [[tag team]]. Hardcore matches and deathmatches should be merged into [[hardcore wrestling]], as well as any "extreme variations" that we can find citations for. Stipulations (such as "I Quit" and the Luchas de Apuestas) should be broken out into [[stipulation (professional wrestling)]]. Perhaps cage matches and their variants should be broken out and [[cage match]] turned from a redirect into an actual article.

At the very least we need to move this article, as it goes against general article naming conventions. I suggest [[List of professional wrestling match types]] or possibly [[List of types of professional wrestling matches]]. If we go with the split proposed above, the new title should specify singles matches.

I'm going to start things off by breaking out the tag team matches and adding them to [[tag team]]. [[User:Gwalla|<nowiki></nowiki>]] &mdash; [[User:Gwalla|Gwalla]] | [[User talk:Gwalla|Talk]] 23:21, 8 Jun 2005 (UTC)

==Barbed Wire Steel Cage Match==

I found out that this match type is found in two different sections of this article at:

* [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Professional_wrestling_match_types#Barbed_Wire_Steel_Cage_Match]

* [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Professional_wrestling_match_types#Barbed-Wire_Steel_Cage_Match]

Where should it be placed? - [[User:Scorpion]]

:In [[hardcore wrestling]] with the other hardcore match types. ;) [[User:Gwalla|<nowiki></nowiki>]] &mdash; [[User:Gwalla|Gwalla]] | [[User talk:Gwalla|Talk]] 02:38, 14 Jun 2005 (UTC)

:So, does it belong in two sections or one section? - [[User:Scorpion]]

:One section, I'd say. Maybe a "see:" link in the other. [[User:Gwalla|<nowiki></nowiki>]] &mdash; [[User:Gwalla|Gwalla]] | [[User talk:Gwalla|Talk]] 02:09, 24 Jun 2005 (UTC)

== Offload to [[Foreign object]] ==

As [[Foreign object]] is an article on foreign objects in wrestling, perhaps more info on matches involving foreign objects should be placed in that article as well. [[User:KelvSYC|kelvSYC]] 05:59, 15 September 2005 (UTC)

== Match grouping ==

"You're Fired", "Retirement" and "Pink Slip" should be grouped together. In addition, Clockwork Orange House of Fun should be grouped together with the foreign-objects matches, not extreme matches. --[[User:Kitch|Kitch]] 16:46, 16 September 2005 (UTC)

:This article is way too long. We should split it, like tag matches have been split already. Perhaps the sections could be "Singles matches", "Multiple person matches", and "Hardcore matches and extreme matches". The question is can "Item on a pole" be considered hardcore, or should they be listed under singles/etc. Many items require rewriting aswell.

:↪[[User:Lakes|Lakes]] 17:34, 16 September 2005 (UTC)

I agree that this should be made into seperate articles and I think that more match types should have their own articles [[User:Petergm|Petergm]] 22:24, 21 January 2006 (UTC)

== Elimination Chamber match ==

I request that the Elimination Chamber match be added. It is unique and noteworthy.

:It has its own article. See [[Elimination Chamber]]. --[[User:Jtalledo|Jtalledo]] [[User_talk:Jtalledo|(talk)]] 15:12, 19 October 2005 (UTC)

== War Games info ==

War Games was created AND made famous in The Great American Bash in 1987, and were great in the WrestleWar eras (1991-1992), but Fall Brawl is where it jumped the shark at this point.

::[[WarGames Match]] article needs a good clean up --- [[User:Paulley|Paulley]] 15:53, 1 April 2006 (UTC)

== Pictures ==

I feel that each match here should have a SMALL picture beside it, showing the reader a in depth view of what happens in the match. Most people would think it will clog it up, but if it is a small picture I believe it will make the Wiki better.

:There used to be a few here, but they turned out to copyright violations. I think we can find some preferably free pictures later, but we should concentrate on reorganizing this list first. --[[User:Jtalledo|Jtalledo]] [[User_talk:Jtalledo|(talk)]] 23:16, 14 December 2005 (UTC)

:Sounds fine to me, whatever is good with you.

--[[User:Terry3k|Terry3k]] [[User_talk:Terry3k|(talk)]] 24:16, 14 December 2005 (UTC)

== Notability criteria for inclusion ==

I propose that to minimize the junk on this page, that only matches fitting some notability criteria should be included. They include:

* The match type has happened on more than one occasion, with a reasonable mix of wrestlers throughout their history. This, for example, eliminates unique one-off feud blowouts, or one-time tournaments.

* The match is the signature match of a particular wrestler (eg. Seregentti Survival to [[Monty Brown]], etc.)

* The match type occured in a top-tier wrestling promotion, as defined by whatever authoritative sources we have (ie. a type specific to a local wrestling promotion should not be included, while a WWE match should).

* The match should either be very commonplace (one fall, Bra and Panties), logistically difficult in terms of setup (Hell in a Cell, Elimination Chamber), physically demanding (Iron Man, Submission), or marketed in a different manner (TLC, Ultimate X)

Minor variations to standard matches should be included only if they are either a logical extension of the original format (eg. pin only is notable as it is a minor variation to a one-fall), or is notable under the above criteria for different reasons. Notable euphemisms for certain match types (ECW Rules for Hardcoare matches, etc.) should also be included.

If at all, specific dates should not be mentioned, as we are trying to explain how the match would work in general.

Any comments on the above?

[[User:KelvSYC|kelvSYC]] 05:03, 17 December 2005 (UTC)

:I have done some clean up moved a few matches to thier own articles and removed any examples of a match the have no baring on the match type itself... hope that helps --- [[User:Paulley|Paulley]] 17:36, 18 December 2005 (UTC)

To reduce the length of the page, we should also adopt that matches that differ in only minor non-wrestling aspects should be considered identical, and should be listed with the more common type of match. Thus, while "No Disqualification" and "Hardcore" remain distinct (due to match flow), we shouldn't list oval cages ("Rage in a Cage") being separate from square cages ("Steel Cage Match") as the only difference is in the shape of the cages. We should not have separate entries for minor variations of the main category of matches, such as "Chair Match" or "Submission Match". [[User:KelvSYC|kelvSYC]] 21:05, 12 January 2006 (UTC)

== Tournament Section ==

Why was the Tournament Section Removed?

:see [[Professional wrestling tournament]] --- [[User:Paulley|Paulley]] 13:43, 21 December 2005 (UTC)

==Current cleanup(matches I think should go)==

Matches mentioned more than once under different names:

Ambulance Match / Casket Match / Dumpster Match / Last Ride Match<br>

(All pretty much the same thing, just with a different container. Changing the subsection just to "Container match" and giving the difference would make things easier to read.)

Short Leash/Bull Rope<br>

(Exact same thing.)

These matches only happened once and probably won't happen again:<br>

Blood Bath Match<br>

Empty Arena Match<br>

Hangman's Horror Match<br>

"Over the Top, Off with the Top" Match<br>

Special Outside Referee<br>

Jailhouse Match<br>

Kiss My Foot Match<br>

Junkyard Invitational<br>

King of the Road Match<br>

Hog Pen Match<br>

Lion's Den Match<br>

Final Wars Brawl<br>

Football Classic Match<br>

10,000 thumbtacks death match<br>

2/3 Lightube Logcabin Deathmatch<br>

Brimstone Match<br>

Chamber of Horrors<br>

Electric Pool Match<br>

(Don't know what to do with these. Notable ones could be mentioned on the competitors specific pages, non notable ones just mentioned in passing, but they don't need subsections.)

they've already been made leave them, what's wrong with more information[[User:Petergm|Petergm]] 23:09, 21 January 2006 (UTC)

::What's wrong is the page in a pain to try to read and sift through. [[User:Bdve|Bdve]] 23:18, 22 January 2006 (UTC)

:::There is also the issue with having too much cruft. A one-time match with unique rules by an obscure promotion is not by itself notable for inclusion. There has to be something with the match, such as its execution, competitors, surrounding storyline, etc. that must accompany it.

Matches only used for one specific wrestler:<br>

Casket Match<br>

King Of The Mountain Match<br>

Serengeti Survival Match<br>

(I propose such matches be mentioned on the specific wrestlers page.)

Matches that just don't sound right:<br>

Silver Dollar Match<br>

Taped Fist Match<br>

[[User:Bdve|Bdve]] 03:28, 19 January 2006 (UTC)

Comments:

*Learn how to use Wiki markup. Your comments are not readable without it.

*The Lion's Den match is particularly notable as it was used by wrestlers with big MMA backgrounds ([[Ken Shamrock]] as an example) as it "simulates" MMA under pro wrestling. However, seeing the name of the match seems like it's a Ken Shamrock specialty.

*KOTM is a TNA specialty. As a matter of fact, it has been contested on more than one occasion in TNA with different wrestlers. To say KOTM is a wrestler-specific is to say that TLC is specific to E&C, Hardyz, and Dudleyz.

*I question most of the extreme variations, but I am not an expert in the independent circuit and the specializations of particular promotions.

*SOR is "celebrity valet", so it's not a match type in itself (neither is special guest referee, but it is significant to have its section).

[[User:KelvSYC|kelvSYC]] 00:48, 23 January 2006 (UTC)

::Well, whatever on the comments. I don't see how the lists could be hard to read. Bulleting it was doing more harm than good and I didn't expect someone to edit in the middle of it.

::Moving past that;

::*I'm not a big fan of TNA and I've honestly only heard of one King Of The Mountain match, so that's just my bad.

::*I've never seen another Lions Den match other than Shamrocks while he was in the WWE either. I'd gladly strike my objection to it, but I'd just never seen it before.

::*I take back my objection to the "Special Outside Ref", I can actually think of a couple and not always with celebrities.

::For what it's worth, that's why I posted my thoughts here and then brought it up on the [[Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Professional wrestling|project page]] before I did anything.

::[[User:Bdve|Bdve]] 02:13, 23 January 2006 (UTC)

We should kill any match that has only been done more than once or twice. This should be a page about the general types of matches, not a list of of every match type that has taken place. (see [[WP:NOT]]). I took out the Silver Dollar match, as that seems to be a one time thing at a WCW PPV.--[[User:Toffile|Toffile]] 01:01, 23 January 2006 (UTC)

:Also, I should note that this shouldn't have matches that are only in one promotion. Totally unnecessary, and if someone feels strongly enough, mention it in the article on that promotion.--[[User:Toffile|Toffile]] 01:15, 23 January 2006 (UTC)

== My suggestions on elimination ==

Here is a list of matches I propose eliminating from the article. The criteria is fairly simple. It should be a match that is seen with some regularity, and should be used in multiple promotions. (Only exception is that if it was in a major promotion such as WWF, TNA, or WCW as well as ECW). If it was clearly a variation of another match (We have entries on both a tables match and a double tables...) I suggested we should list it under that match. This is really just an initial trim, the serious reorg and trimming can come after this.

'''Definitely eliminated'''

#Blood Bath Match-It notes that Gangrel and the brood made these famous...hasn't been seen in years.

#Canadian Rules Match - Is this really needed? Just a giant catch all category for matches that share a similar plot.

#<S>Double Jeopardy Match - Two matches in one ring.Outside of ECW it looks like it's only in some minor promotions.</S>

#Finisher Match-Can't seem to find much of this match anywhere, other than in general match-type reference list. (The only time I could find a reference was for a small indy promo).

#<S>"Over the Top, Off with the Top" Match - Has happened once or twice, not really a common match.</S>

#Serengeti Survival Match - One time match

#Arm Wrestling Match - I really think this is unnecessary, it's a arm-wrestling match. Uncommon.

#Sumo Match - Rare match

#<S>Jailhouse Match-It's a uncommon match (if not rare), I can only find one record of it. Mention it in the kayfabe bios, if needed.</S>

#<S>Kiss My Foot Match-No. Just no.</S>

#<S>Junkyard Invitational-One time match.</S>

#<S>King of the Road Match-One time match.</S>

#Rage in a Cage - It's an old [[AWA]] event, and of all things it's a cage match with a different shape cage than normal.

#Final Wars Brawl-This seems to be almost the same thing as War Games. I also really can't find much record of this sort of match happening

#Football Classic Match -This hasn't happened in a long time and only a few times (if that), I really see no reason to keep it.

#10,000 thumbtacks death match-It is a match with thumbtacks. It is no more special than a normal hardcore match.

#Barefoot Thumbtack Match-It is a match with thumbtacks. It is no more special than a normal hardcore match.

#Beds of (Objects) Death Match -Seriously, it's a hardcore match that starts with the ring covered in weapons.

#Clockwork Orange House of Fun Match -This is mentioned twice. See "Hangman's Horror".

#Electric Pool Match - It was used once, as it says.

'''Should be merged'''

#<S>Double Tables Match-Variant of a tables match, doesn't require it's own section</S>

#Flag Match -Seems very smimlar to a strap match. I'd mention it as a variant in that section, personally.

#Empty Arena Match-One time match, just mention it for Foley and Rocky if needed.

#Hangman's Horror Match-Match that occured once or twice. Credit it over on Raven's page, not here.

#Short Leash Match-It's a variant on the strap match, without having to touch the corners.

#<S>24/7- Mention this on the [[WWE Hardcore title]] page, not here. It's not a match type, it's a belt stipulation.</S>

#Sadistic Madness-Variation on the First Blood match...no need for it's own article.

#Bar Room Brawl-It's only real claim is that it's in the WWE video games, and it probably won't ever be held because there's no more [[APA]]. (Mention it in them though)

#Boiler Room Brawl- How many were there? 2? Just mention their significance in Foley's article.

#Doomsday Cage Match -It's a variation of the triple cage concept...

#<S>King Of The Mountain Match -One time, I suggest keeping it on Jarrett's page.</S>

#2/3 Lightube Logcabin Deathmatch - Merge it with the article on [[CZW]].

#200 light tubes death match-Merge it with the article on [[CZW]].

#Cage of Death-Merge it with the article on [[CZW]].

#Lucha en Jaula Electrificada - Cage variant

#Shattered Dreams Match -Merge it with the article on [[CZW]].

#Chamber of Horrors-Put it on the [[Halloween Havoc]] page.

'''Should be discussed'''

# Beat the Clock Match- I would get rid of this, as the only prupose seems to be for NYR. If the WWE continues to use it as a way of setting things up, then it should keep it's own spot. Until then, mention it in the [[Elimination Chamber]] article.

#Barbed Wire Massacre -Barbed wire ropes match. Probably should be noted somewhere.

#Brimstone Match - This seems to be pretty similar to an Inferno match, to be honest. I'd suggest a merge, but I'd get some discussion

# Relay Match - Seems to be something of a rarity, I've never really heard about this, so...

*<S>'''''Container-based Variations''''''</S>

::<S>I suggest we just kill all the subsections of this. The introduction gives the rules for just about each match, the only difference being in the "container". I think a small list of different containers would be good, however the '''Hog-Pen''' should not be mentioned, since it's happened all of once.</S>

In fact even more disturbing, I discovered that most of this article is a copyvio of this [http://www.answers.com/topic/professional-wrestling-match-types] article from answers.com. If I seem a bit biased against deathmatch wrestling...honestly I really can't see much to list here. It's a niche, and [[WP:NOT#Wikipedia_is_not_an_indiscriminate_collection_of_information|Wikipedia is not an indiscriminate collection of information]] Just link the [[Deathmatch wrestling]] here.--[[User:Toffile|Toffile]] 03:02, 23 January 2006 (UTC)

And as a note, this will collapse this article from being around 80 different types of matches to around 30 types if all suggestions are implemented.--[[User:Toffile|Toffile]] 03:06, 23 January 2006 (UTC)

:I'm not sure if you've noticed or not, but the Answers.com page you linked to lists as its sole cite... Wikipedia. They copied from us, not the other way around. At any rate, I do applaud the cleanup effort. --[[User:HeartBurn Kid|HBK]]|[[User talk:HeartBurn Kid|Talk]] 04:42, 23 January 2006 (UTC)

::Good point, I really hadn't noticed that. I think the page's worse flaw is that we're allowing "notable" matches in, even if they were done once. The problem is that using it, is that it's a subjective word. What I think is notable and non-notable, is not always the case. For example, the Empty Arena match is fairly notable as being entertaining (at least to me). However, the Junkyard Invitational is notable as [[wrestlecrap]] (to many people, not just me). I don't think we should list both, as they are not common types of matches. They were a one-time deal, that if really necessary, should be mentioned some other article. Hopefully we can get some more discussion going here. (Sorry if I veered off on a tangent.)--[[User:Toffile|Toffile]] 04:53, 23 January 2006 (UTC)

I'll object to the finisher match, as it has been used on numerous occasions, and it has a notable list of variations. For example, [[Mark Henry]] once challenged [[Viscera]] in a gorilla slam match (granted it was stupid in the sense that Henry allowed Viscera to win by sitting on the top turnbuckle). [[Billy Gunn]] also won a finisher match in the WWE when he used the Fameasser, and so on. As for the others:

* Canadian rules - I'd find a better name for it, but it's definitely signifigant in terms of match flow.

* Arm wrestling - it's a cliche in pro wrestling that the rules are "enforced" more often, as the ref is able to catch the heel cheating more often.

* Beat the Clock - although it's only notability is in NYR, it's a general format applicable as a lead-in to any big match.

Much of the hardcore variations may be moved to [[hardcore wrestling]], although a rewrite of that may probably be needed. [[User:KelvSYC|kelvSYC]] 17:51, 24 January 2006 (UTC)

:Matches that haven't taken place for a long time should be mentioned in some capacity for posterity if nothing else. What you should really focus on doing with this page is removing all match types that are simply an existing match with a different name and a slight twist. They should still be listed in the text, just not under a separate heading. For example, there could be a moderately detailed paragraph on the ladder match and then a sub-paragraph stating "a variant of this match where... is known as the 'xxx match'." The problems on this page are mostly due to uneccessary replication of information, not the improper inclusion of information. Deleting match types simply because "there weren't very many" is not a good idea, because matches that only happen infrequently are the matches that are least likely to receive coverage in a less comprehensive information repository. [[User:McPhail|McPhail]] 19:19, 24 January 2006 (UTC)

::McPhail. I'm trying to do eliminate. (For example, I moved King of the Mountain to Ladder Match, since it's essentiallly a reverse ladder match.) There are some old ones that I agree should be kept like War Games, but I really can't see keeping the Junkyard Invitational. Personally I think there should probably be two lists, one for common match types, and one for notable match types. However, there isn't so I'm trying to keep balance between the two types.--[[User:Toffile|Toffile]] 14:04, 25 January 2006 (UTC)

:KelvSYC, most of the last section is all deathmatch wrestling. I think they should be removed from the article, as no matter how you slice it, DM wrestling is nothing more than a niche, and to most people it's not common, nor is it especially notable. I agree that the information should probably get preserved in some way.--[[User:Toffile|Toffile]] 14:04, 25 January 2006 (UTC)

::Move it to [[Hardcore wrestling]]? There's already a section on deathmatches there, the whole section could be lifted from here and dropped somewhere in there. Deathmatches (of this variety anyway) tend to be done in "Hardcore" crowds. But this article should still mention the regular style (Texas) Deathmatch then link over to that one as "More extreme variants". --[[User:Bdve|Bdve]] 18:44, 26 January 2006 (UTC)

I'd agree that you should move deathmatches to hardcore wrestling, but don't delete them only because you dont like them, on a side note the swiming pool match was done twice in fmw.

==Burn Brawl==

Is this thing legit? Google turns up nothing, none of the usual places have it listed as anything...If no one objects I'm just gonna trash it -[[User:Bdve|Bdve]] 21:05, 31 January 2006 (UTC)

Its obviously fake, read the story about the Luchadores...

-Terry 4k

==Ironman==

where is the ironman match?

i think it should be added as the most controversial moment in wretling history happened in one,and while it is not too common,it is not rare either.

i would do it if i knew enough... [[User:Lord revan|Lord revan]] 15:44, 1 March 2006 (UTC)

:[[Iron Man match|Here]] [[User:Bdve|Bdve]] 00:06, 2 March 2006 (UTC)

== Brimstone Match ==

Did a brimstone match ever really happen anywhere? The only reference to it I can find is the fact that it was included in an ECW video game.[[User:MattSutton1|MattSutton1]] 19:14, 15 April 2006 (UTC)

:Gone[[User:Bdve|Bdve]] 17:57, 16 April 2006 (UTC)

== 64.149.54.40 ==

What is this person doing? They seem to be rearanging things and putting matches in weird places. Care to explain? I really want to revert it all. [[User:Bdve|Bdve]] 01:40, 17 April 2006 (UTC)

==Reorg Template==

Removing reorg template. This tag is intended as a courtesy to editors actively maintaining the page over a span of minutes/hours. Leaving it on for over 6 months (!) and hundreds of edits is discouraging to others who may want to edit but may hold back. Big changes should always be discussed on talk, and we do have revert tools if there are massive problems. Please don't replace this tag for long periods. -- [[User:Cmh|cmh]] 22:42, 12 May 2006 (UTC)

== 2/3 falls ==

Should this be given a section and write up? It's mentioned in passing somewhere but that's it for now. Just an idea.[[User:Bdve|Bdve]] 02:35, 16 June 2006 (UTC)

== Reorganizing this page ==

This page is quite a mess. There is a HUGE list and a mishmash of "real/common" match types and bizarre one-off match types. Furthermore, all the Tag Team variations are in the Tag Team entry. I think each main section should basically have its own entry, where some can be combined to give the following:

* Singles Matches

* Non-wrestling Matches

* Weapon-based Matches

* Enclosure-based Matches

* Team matches

* Multi-Competitor Matches

* Hardcore/Extreme Matches

* List of Pro Wrestling Match Stipulations

If I get some time, I'll mock up the page and see if it can be better organized...

[[User:Davetron5000|Davetron5000]] 12:44, 21 June 2006 (UTC)

:I agree, there are problems with the page. However, the section headings need to be better. Surely "Hardcore/Extreme Matches" could also be variations of singles matches (possibly). Also, further problems arise with matches such as the Bra and Panties Gaunlet match. Surely it should not be given its own setion, it is two types of speciality match combined. Anyway, I personally believe that the best way to clean up this article woulld be to use a more tabular method; for each entry it should say 1. how the match differs from the normal match, and 2. how the competitors win the match.[[User:13756|13756]] 15:01, 21 June 2006 (UTC)

:: Perhaps outlining the basic types of matches (which I define to be "singles", "tag team", "battle royal", "steel cage" and "ladder". Maybe an additional "misc"?), with common variants (e.g. 3-way dance, 6-man tag). Then perhaps a section on stipulations (e.g. first blood, falls count anywhere, weapon on a pole), with each stipulation listing specific instances of matches of that type. In my mind somethingn like a "Boiler Room Brawl" isn't a match ''type'', but more of a specific match of the ''type'' "singles matche" with the stipulations "falls count anywhere" and "takes place outside ring". [[User:Davetron5000|Davetron5000]] 13:09, 22 June 2006 (UTC)