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The '''House System''' is the basis of [[undergraduate]] student residence at the [[California Institute of Technology]] (Caltech). Caltech's unique House system is modeled after the [[residential college]] system of [[University of Oxford|Oxford]] and [[University of Cambridge|Cambridge]] in England. Like a residential college, a House embodies two closely-connected concepts — it serves as both a physical building where a majority of its members reside and as the center of social activity for its members.
== Talk archives ==
*[[Talk:Anarchism/Archive1]]
*[[Talk:Anarchism/Archive2]]
*[[Talk:Anarchism/Archive3]]
*[[Talk:Anarchism/Archive4]]
*[[Talk:Anarchism/Archive5]]
*[[Talk:Anarchism/Archive6]]
*[[Talk:Anarchism/Archive7]]
*[[Talk:Anarchism/Archive8]]
*[[Talk:Anarchism/Archive9]]
*[[Talk:Anarchism/Archive10]]
*[[Talk:Anarchism/Archive11]]
*[[Talk:Anarchism/Archive12]]
*[[Talk:Anarchism/Archive13]]
*[[Talk:Anarchism/Archive14]]
*[[Talk:Anarchism/Archive15]]
----
The Houses resemble [[fraternities and sororities|fraternities]] at other American universities in the shared loyalties they engender. Unlike in fraternities, however, potentially dangerous "rushing" or "pledging" is replaced with the week of "rotation" at the beginning of the school year, and students generally remain affiliated with one House for the duration of their undergraduate studies.
Freshmen go through a process known as Rotation during the first week of classes to get assigned to a House. This process has rules associated with it to try to give freshmen a chance to choose between the Houses in an unbiased way. These rules are located on the IHC website [http://www.ugcs.caltech.edu/~ihc/documents/rotation.html here].
==Survey : Scope and Purpose==
As suggested by the Wikipedia guides for conflict resolution, this is a survey. Please answer these three questions and '''only post once -- do not respond to others in this thread'''. Once a signficant amount of people have responded (let's say 10) we should discuss synthesis, compromise, or whatnot. Please post less than 500 words (post something simple). I will enter my opinion after at least two others post. --[[User:Albamuth|albamuth]] 09:23, 5 Feb 2005 (UTC)
== History ==
===What are the distinguishing characteristics of anarchist philosophies?===
: * Since the split from nihisit movement, it was always a fight against all forms of discrimination. Definitions of "fight" and "discrimination" vary significantly, but always include working towards a non-hierarchical society. {{User:Beta_m/sig}}
{{Expand|date=March 2007}}
: * A movement against hierarchy in all its forms, most importantly the state, Capitalism, sexism, reacism, heterosexism, etc...--[[User:Che y Marijuana|Che y Marijuana]] 00:36, Feb 6, 2005 (UTC)
Caltech established the House System in 1931, recasting the existing fraternities as '''Blacker House''', '''Dabney House''', '''Fleming House''' and '''Ricketts House,''' now known as the South Houses. Expanding student population was accommodated in 1960 with the North Houses: '''Lloyd House,''' '''Page House,''' and '''Ruddock House.''' A new state-of-the-art residential facility named '''Avery House,''' was opened in 1996, but was not initially considered part of the House System, and freshmen were not allowed to live there. Like most of the buildings on campus, Avery House and the South Houses are in [[Mission Revival Style architecture|California Mission]] style, and resemble [[Cloister|cloistered]] [[Abbey|monasteries]] with enclosed courtyards; the North Houses are of [[Modernism|Modern]] design.
: * Distinguishing characteristics of anarchist philosophies are that they are anti-state, anti-capitalist, for equality, decentralization, autonomy of the individual. Individualism should not be confused with an opposition to organization, nearly all anarchist philosophies are for organization. Opposition to hierarchy/authority is universal and that includes all institution, ideologies, organizations, and pracices that are coercive, forced, oppressive, or is otherwise hierarchal. To protect the rights of the individual, anarchism has always been for voluntary cooperation. --[[User:Fatal|Fatal]] 04:24, 6 Feb 2005 (UTC)
The Caltech houses were formed from members of disbanded fraternities in [[1931]]. The fraternities were as follows:
: * Anarchism, which was once referred to as "libertarian socialism", originates in a critique of the State and Capitalism. The philosophies expoused by anarchist writers have varied in degree but have always reflected those twin critiques, whether the writers saw them as inextricably linked or merely related via fundamental principles; abuses of power, unfair distribution of wealth, exploitation of the common person, alienation, classcism, division of races, and so forth. --[[User:Albamuth|albamuth]] 20:13, 6 Feb 2005 (UTC)
*Blacker: [[Phi Alpha Rho]], also known as Pharo
: * Anarchism has two distinct varieties. The first is includes [[syndicalism]], extreme [[liberalism]], and [[communism]], along with all the varieties contained within communism (especially revolutionary communism), from [[state communism]] to [[primitivism]]. This form is a type of [[idealism]]. The second type contains those who pursue real [[anarchy]]. The first group includes most people who choose to call themselves anarchists, while the second, likely vastly more numerous, includes much of the prison populations of most nations, and an enormous % of criminals and practitioners of [[warlordism]] generally. [[Alignment (role-playing games)]] is an interesting way to discuss the moral distinctions amongst the Chaotic Alignments. Within this paradigm, most of the first sort of anarchist would be [[Chaotic Good]], whilst the second would consist mainly of [[Chaotic Neutral]] or [[Chaotic Evil]] persons. {{Vip|user=Sam Spade}} 21:51, 6 Feb 2005 (UTC)
*Dabney: [[Gamma Sigma]]
*Fleming: [[Sigma Alpha Pi]] and [[Pi Alpha Tau]]
*Ricketts: [[Kappa Gamma]], also known as Gnome
The current state of affairs is in flux. Beginning in the 2005–2006 school year, [[Student#Years|frosh]] were allowed to live in Avery. Also in 2005, work began on a major renovation project for the aging South Houses, whose residents have been relocated to a temporary modular housing complex. The renovations were completed at the beginning of the 2007 calendar year. Students moved back into the South Houses on 15 December 2006, though construction continues.
: * Anarchism is the opposition to any individual, group, or organization ''governing'' or ''ruling over'' any individual. I think it's as simple as that. If any person is prevented from ''voluntarily'' exercising his will in regard to all that is his (''meaning'' that coercive influence is being directed upon him by another) then anarchy lacks existence. What is "his" (a person's rightful property) is one area where debate comes in. I think everyone would agree a person's body is "his." Determing what else is the rightful property of a person is an issue of dispute among anarchists --most particularly between "traditional anarchists" and anarcho-capitalists (or "free-market anarchists"). Of course another area of dispute is which particular actions are "voluntary" and which are not. But I don't think any of these disputes should matter in regard to ''defining'' anarchism (which should only take a sentence or two.) [[User:RJII|RJII]] 16:28, 8 Feb 2005 (UTC)
== House Memberships ==
: * "Anarchism" is a word used to describe a number of related philosophies which critique hierarchy, coercion, and domination in all forms. They also advocate mutual aid, voluntary association, decentralized organizing, etc. [Getting any more specific wouldn't be a broad description of anarchist philosophies, but even in that short form anarcho-capitalism and nationalist anarchism don't qualify]
There are two ways to gain membership in a House: Rotate in at the beginning of one's frosh year, or become a member afterwards.
=== Rotation ===
: * Anarchism, first and foremost, is not to be confused with ''anarchy'' (when used in the sense of chaos and disorder). Thus any and all referance to ''anarchy'' as a state of disorder or chaos is inappropriate for this page save for a single sentence disabugating the two terms and linking to the anarchy article. Beyond that, anarchism refers to a broad ideology first concieved as a self-description by those who sought to end all forms of institutional human dominance, both political and economic. This theory does not seek to create perfect humans who live in total harmony, but rather to ever strive toward the goal of elminating human coercion wherever it is found. In this, it is distinct from ''any'' philosophy that seeks to compromise in accepting certain forms of human domination as "inevitable" or "justifiable." Such ideologies are not "new and improved" forms of anarchism, but rather rejection thereof. Thus, while it is a form of libertarianism, it is distinguished from all other political movements which seek to retain coercive political structure, including the property entitlement of capitalism, the panarchic advocacy in nationalism, and the pseudo-representative states of liberalism. [[User:Kevehs|Kev]] 00:31, 9 Feb 2005 (UTC)
Rotation is the process by which frosh choose (and are chosen by) the House they will be affiliated with. Upon first arriving at Caltech, the frosh are given a random room assignment in a random House, and then spend a week eating lunch and dinner in all of the Houses, getting an opportunity to meet people in all of the Houses.
These meals and meetings are an opportunity both for the frosh to get to know the feel of the different houses and for the upperclassmen to meet and rate the frosh so both can see where they might belong. At the end of this week, the frosh rate (as of 2007) each of the Houses on a scale of 1 to 20; based on this, and the opinions of the Houses' existing members, the frosh are placed into a House which will be their home physically and socially for the next few years. Pains are taken to maintain a certain level of mystery. This secrecy is often due to the frank—and sometimes personally uncomplimentary—discussions within the House selection committees, which are sometimes divided into factions. Also, the selection process is constrained: there are only a limited number of openings in each House, and it is impossible to simultaneouly meet the preferences of all of the Freshmen and Houses. Although typically the Houses try to make new members feel welcome as a part of the community, occasionally either a Freshman or a House will be assigned their lowest preference, which is sometimes problematic.
Despite the constraints, this two-way selection process of joining a House, and social interaction after joining, gives each House a distinctive personality that is often remarkably stable over decades. Alumni often retain fierce House loyalty and can often guess the House membership of other Caltech graduates due to personality clues.
: * It's impossible to completely separate ''anarchy'' and ''anarchism'', as they clearly share a common root, and anarchy, in some sense of the word, is the state of affairs that anarchists seek to achieve. But it's ironic that one of the meanings of "anarchy" in the dictionary (''American Heritage Dictionary'', 3rd edition) is "Absence of any cohesive principle, such as a common standard or purpose." If this were true of the anarchist movement, then there would be no basis for the loudly-asserted insistence that some people, groups, and philosophies were "not really anarchist" because they violated some alleged principle of anarchism. So, clearly, the words "anarchy" and "anarchism" have a number of meanings, some of them contradictory. Anarchism has as its first definition in the dictionary, "The theory or doctrine that all forms of government are oppressive and undesirable and should be abolished." This definition clearly includes anarcho-capitalists, as it says nothing about what opinions anarchists should or must have on the subject of capitalism vs. socialism, just that whatever view they may have, they don't favor having it forcibly imposed by a government. Thus, voluntary socialism and voluntary capitalism are equally compatible with an anarchist society under this definition. It also, incidentally, says nothing about racism (something else that has been brought up here as incompatible with anarchism); it's perfectly possible for somebody to think that other races are inferior, but still favor the abolition of all government. They wouldn't likely have much luck in convincing the races they oppose to march voluntarily into anarchist concentration camps, though. "Nationalist anarchism" seems dubious, however, as "national" implies the existence of a "nation", which is usually considered synonymous with a government. Another dictionary definition of anarchism is "Rejection of all forms of coercive control and authority", which is more like what many of the participants here are using as their definition, as it's broader than just being anti-government. This is the definition that some claim excludes anarcho-capitalism. But this depends on a belief that capitalism is inherently coercive, which is, of course, a point on which anarcho-capitalists (as well as minarchist libertarians) disagree. [[User:Dtobias|Dtobias]] 13:27, 9 Feb 2005 (UTC)
=== Other Memberships ===
* Opposition to all forms of hiearchy, for example the state, capitalism, nacism racism fascism, simply All forms of rule, wheter done by laws or economic pressure/power. [[User:Foant|Foant]]
There is a second way to obtain membership in a House: apply at some point after Rotation. The process varies from House to House, but in general one makes an announcement at dinner to the effect of "I would like to be a member of Booty House," and the House conducts a vote (the nature of the vote, again, varying). ("Booty House" is commonly used to refer to any unspecified House.) Some Houses (in particular, Blacker, Fleming,<ref>While Fleming nominally has social memberships, they consider ''all'' undergraduates to be social members automatically (and they don't require social members to pay dues). So in effect, Fleming does not have social memberships.</ref> Lloyd, Page, and Ruddock) have two tiers of memberships: Full members and social members. However, Page does not allow dual-full membership, therefore if you become a full member of Page you must give up any other full memberships. Anyone who rotates into the House is automatically a full member; individuals who would like to become members afterwards can choose between full and social membership. The relative difficulties in attaining full and social memberships differ from House to House, as do the relative privileges that each membership type affords; the only universal truths are that full membership is harder to attain than social, and that full members may live in House-associated property while social members may not.
== Overview of the Houses ==
* The main distinguishing characteristic of anarchist philosophy is: opposition of rulers, hierarchy, and oppression of any kind. This includes, capitalism (which is naturally hierarchical), racism, sexism, ageism, etc. --Jazz Remington 02:05, 10 Feb 2005 (UTC)
{| class="wikitable"
* There is no one received definition of the word "anarchism", so there can be no exclusive set of criteria to determine what anarchism is. That's not necessarily the most important question with regard to what should be in this article, though. - [[User:Nat Krause|Nat Kraus]][[User_Talk:Nat Krause|e]] 19:58, 10 Feb 2005 (UTC)
! House !! Members !! Color(s) !! Slogan !! Motto !! Website
|-
! colspan="6"| South Houses (Hovses)
|-
|{{rh}}| [[#Blacker House|Blacker Hovse]]
| Moles
| Black
| γδβγ (God Damn Blacker Gang)
| Sed nvlla nisi ardva virtvs ''"Nothing is worthwhile unless it is difficult"''
| http://blacker.caltech.edu/
|-
|{{rh}}| [[#Dabney House|Dabney Hovse]]
| Darbs
| Green
| DEI (Dabney Eats It)
| Fidelis et gratus ''"Faithfulness and thankfulness"''
| http://www.ugcs.caltech.edu/~dei/
|-
|{{rh}}| [[#Fleming House|Fleming Hovse]]
| Flems
| Red
| FEIF (Fleming Eats It Faster)
| Let the deed shaw
| http://fleming.caltech.edu/
|-
|{{rh}}| [[#Ricketts House|Ricketts Hovse]]
| Skurves / Scurves
| Maroon
| FGD (Fuck God Dead)
| Prend moi tel que je suis ''"Take me as I am"''
| http://ricketts.caltech.edu/public/
|-
! colspan="6"| North Houses
|-
|{{rh}}| [[#Lloyd House|Lloyd House]]
| Lloydies
| Gold
|
| I live and die for those I love
| http://lloyd.caltech.edu/
|-
|{{rh}}| [[#Page House|Page House]]
| Pageboys
| Blue
| Thank You for Not Sucking!
| Spe labor levis ''"Let the labor be light"''
| http://www.jrpage.net/
|-
|{{rh}}| [[#Ruddock House|Ruddock House]]
| Rudds
| Navy Blue
| Ruddock Rhymes with Buttock
| Virtutis mammilas exsugimus ''"We suck dry the teats of Virtue"''
| http://ruddock.caltech.edu/
|-
! colspan="6"| Other
|-
|{{rh}}| [[#Avery House|Avery House]]
| Averyites ''or'' Slaves<sup>1</sup>
| Purple and Silver
|
| Creativity, integrity, tenacity
| http://avery.caltech.edu/
|}
<sup>1</sup> No official, uniformly-used name has been established for members of Avery House. For more information see Avery House's section.
== The South Houses ==
===What purpose should this article serve?===
: * To show to the reader what "Anarchist Movement" is. As it is not a homogenous movement, it is important to give different examples, with understanding that the reader might wish to read up more on the particular idea. But that would not be the purpose of the article. {{User:Beta_m/sig}}
The South Houses are often referred to as "Hovses" since that is the spelling used in the inscriptions on the actual buildings, in imitation of ancient Latin writing. The South House complex opened in 1931.
: * To show the Anarchist movement, link to its history, and summarize some of iots main ideas. Though it isn't a homogenous movement, it does share certain characteristics that are not negociable.--[[User:Che y Marijuana|Che y Marijuana]] 00:36, Feb 6, 2005 (UTC)
=== Blacker House ===
: * The purpose of this article should be to clearly explain to a user who knows nothing about anarchism what it is, its history, etc. It should also outline things that are anarchist as well as things confused with anarchism that are false. It should be as unbiased as possible, decisions for edits based only on anarchist philosophy, ideology and facts. To clarify, it is not a POV to cite anarchist definition and ideology as a clear indication that something is not anarchist when it is a true explanation. --[[User:Fatal|Fatal]] 04:27, 6 Feb 2005 (UTC)
[[Image:BlackerHovse.gif|thumb|right|the Lowenbrau lion - the unofficial symbol of Blacker - along with Blacker's slogan]]
'''Blacker Hovse''' was built with the help of funds donated by [[Robert Roe Blacker]], a trustee of Caltech. Members of Blacker House are referred to as ''Moles.''
One of the traditions of Blacker House is the ''Hellride.'' In a defiant response to the prohibition against playing The [[Ride of the Valkyries]], and to the constant announcements of fake [[Ditch Day]]s by seniors, the freshmen living in a part of the House named Hell (so called for its unbearable heat in the summer and cramped quarters) would announce a Hellride. They then barricade the hallway and play The Ride at high volume, daring the upperclassmen to break in and drag everyone to be drenched in the showers.
: * The article should explain the concept of anarchism as distinct from other ideologies. Therefore it needs to establish necessary stipulations for what ideological schools, social movements, historical events, literature, and cultural memes qualify as the article's own definition of anarchism. The purpose of the article is to describe a clear idea with examples to the reader without confusing or conflicting information. --[[User:Albamuth|albamuth]] 20:20, 6 Feb 2005 (UTC)
Blacker house features halls painted as Heaven, Purgatory, and Hell. In Hell, an elevator switch is rigged to cause a red light to flash the prime numbers with the speed determined by the switch setting. Blacker's courtyard formerly featured a habitable treehouse and a giant tire swing, but the tree that bore them was cut down during renovations of the house in the 2005-2006 academic year.
: * The article must, overcoming the demographics of its editors, succeed in presenting the reader a [[NPOV]] overview of the expert POV's regarding what the term "anarchism" is today, and what the history of the idea has been. [[Original research]] must be countered at every turn. Gaining featured article status and achieving the intellectual honesty and rigor necessary to satisfy both reasonable adherents and critics must be fundamental goals. Things should be explained in such a manner as to comprehensively inform someone with no knowledge of the concept whatsoever. Only thus can we provide the very highest standard of quality to our fearless readers. {{Vip|user=Sam Spade}} 22:05, 6 Feb 2005 (UTC)
The [[war cry]] of Blacker House is '''γδβγ''' ([[Greek alphabet|Greek letters]] for ''gdbg,'' or ''God Damn Blacker Gang''). The story is that in the 1978 or 1979, it was popular for Blacker students to climb on top of [[elevator]]s and ride them. One time, security went inside the elevator looking for the students, who were on top of the elevator. The security muttered, "God Damn Blacker Gang", and the name stuck. Blacker students began signing GDBG or γδβγ on all their pranks. Blacker has also been referred to as the ''House of Fucking Geniuses'' and the inscription ''HOFG'' can be found throughout the tunnels along with ''γδβγ''. In the [[1960s]] the house slogan was "Blacker Hovse for gracious living" which became "The Hovse of Gracious Living" by the [[1990s]].
: * This article should describe the mainstream, no-qualifiers form of Anarchism, while also taking the time to briefly introduce readers to not only its subsets, but also hybrid political philosophies such as "anarcho"-capitalism, which are of interest if for no other reason than to illustrate that the word "anarchism" itself seems to be taking on more positive cannotations (else other groups wouldn't be so eager to adopt the word), indicating at least some success in the movement itself. Still, the main focus of the page needs to be Anarchism without qualifiers, and its purpose should be to educate readers about the unalloyed to give readers a more solid basis of comparison when they inevitably decide to delve deeper into the subject. --[[User:Corvun|Corvun]] 09:11, 8 Feb 2005 (UTC)
=== Dabney House ===
: *It should serve to give a succinct definition of anarchism that encapsulates all forms of anarchism; how diverse the different forms of anarchism are is going to determine how broad (or even vague) the definition needs to be. Then it should go on to describe the matters of dispute in regard to what constitutes "voluntary," "property," etc, and list and describe each of the various forms. The most important part, in my opinion, is the intro. If it's good, it should naturally guide everything else in the article. [[User:RJII|RJII]] 16:38, 8 Feb 2005 (UTC)
[[Image:Dabney-minimalist.png|thumb|right|The "minimalist coat-of-arms" of Dabney House, designed by old Darb Kaihsu Tai in the late 1990s, based on the full coat-of-arms.]]
'''Dabney Hovse''' is the smallest of Caltech's Houses. Residents of Dabney House are referred to as ''Darbs.''
Dabney House, as part of the single building that makes up the four "South Houses," was constructed in 1930 and 1931. It was known as the House of Gentlemen and the House of Captains, but underwent a dramatic change in personality during the 1960s. In 1973, the House was disowned by the Dabney family when students from Dabney House protested a presidential visit with a sign on the library bearing the simple phrase "Impeach [[Richard Nixon|Nixon]]." This event has been a touchstone for Darbs ever since. The house became associated with the hippie lifestyle, and in 1990 multiple Dabney House members were banned from campus housing for performing lewd acts in the house courtyard (an event known as "the fipi").
: *This article should inform the reader of the meaning and history behind the word anarchism and its various political ideologies, including various sub-movements, notable figures and events, and some detail of the basic philosophy behind the ideology itself that unites the extremely diverse movements within. It should also serve as a link-page to all the various forms of anarchism, and to those claiming to be a part of the tradition but whose claims are controversial or generally rejected by anarchists with more substantive links to the tradition. However, proper emphasis is to ignore non-notable claimants (including purely internet based phenomena, secret societies for which there is no evidence, and single-person "movements"), and give minimal space to controversial or minor claimants in the form of a brief description detailing their status in relation to the movement as a whole and perhaps some explaination of why their ideology is not generally considered a part of traditional or modern anarchism (this would include various disagreements over the definitions of terms and rejection/ignorance/subversion of core tenets to anarchism). However, links to such notable but controversial claimants are essential to the overall informative nature of the article and should not be removed under any condition. [[User:Kevehs|Kev]] 00:43, 9 Feb 2005 (UTC)
Traditionally standing for "Dabney Eats It," referring to a particularly unpalatable plate of noodles in the 1950s, the acronym DEI has come to be a badge of pride for Darbs. Besides naming the house's recreation room after it and spreading it all across campus, Dabney alumni have made DEI a hidden code in the outside world. The letters can be seen in movies (most notably ''[[Real Genius]]'') and video games (including ''[[Grand Theft Auto: Vice City|GTA: Vice City]]'' and several [[Intellivision]] games). There are even stories of the trigraph making its way into space on JPL [[space probe|probe]]s including the Voyager space craft, and being written on the Moon by astronaut Darb [[Harrison Schmitt]]. In the late 1960s, during on-campus shooting of an episode of the TV series "Mission Impossible", students stenciled "Caution: DEI" in an elevator shaft scheduled to be filmed the next day. The marking was subsequently visible on national television behind Peter Lupus as he paused in one shot, unaware of this Caltech contribution to spy drama.
: * It should give any reader sufficient information on what anarchism is, its ideas and history.
=== Fleming House ===
: * To give information about anarchism, in all of its meanings and usages, not a slanted subset "anointed" by some group that acts like they own the word in a proprietary way (ironic given that those people claim to oppose private property). [[User:Dtobias|Dtobias]] 00:47, 10 Feb 2005 (UTC)
'''Fleming Hovse''' was built with funds donated by a number of people, and the name Fleming was chosen to honor [[Arthur Fleming]], then the chairman of Caltech's Board of Trustees.
Members of Fleming Hovse are called ''Flems.'' The house color is Red. The motto, from the crest as commonly seen on house beer steins, is "Let the Deed Shaw."<ref>"Let the Deed Shaw", archaic for "Let the Deed Show", is also the motto for [[Fleming College]], in [[Peterborough, Ontario]]. The crest and motto derive from the noble House of Fleming of [[Biggar, South Lanarkshire]], [[Scotland]].</ref> The house battle cry is "Go Big Red!" Another important maxim is "Flems stick together!", as well as the slogan "Where men are men, giants walk the earth, and the thundering herd is real".
: * This article should give a generalized overview of anarchism that is easily accessable to everyone. Meaning, it should be more simpilar than the Anarchist FAQ. --[[User:Jremington|Jazz Remington]] 02:07, 10 Feb 2005 (UTC)
The physical layout of Fleming House includes rooms numbered 8.5 (formerly the RA apartment, now a triple) and π([[pi]]).
: * I feel that there should be two pages: one to disambiguate different senses of the word "anarchism", and the other to discuss the socialist-anarchist movement associated with Proudhon, Emma Goldman, Malatesta, etc. It doesn't really matter very much which one is where. - [[User:Nat Krause|Nat Kraus]][[User_Talk:Nat Krause|e]] 19:58, 10 Feb 2005 (UTC)
Fleming House has traditionally been the athletic house, and has maintained a tradition of athletic excellence over the past decade. Both the Interhouse Trophy, awarded to the winner of the Interhouse Athletic Competitions, and the Discobulus Trophy, awarded to the winner of a king-of-the-mountain style, challenge-oriented series of competitions, have called Fleming home for the past 5 years. This emphasis on athletics is explicitly a part of Fleming's self-conscious rejection of the [[nerd]] [[stereotype]] that developed at Caltech after the elimination of its [[dress code]] in [[1968]].
===What criteria should be used for inclusion in this article?===
: * The submovement, must be linked to other parts of the larger movement, even if it not linked to all (syndicalism and primitivism don't really link for example, but there is a link between syndicalism and anarcho-communism and primitivism and ecoanarchism). When the particular trend of anarchism existed (or began) should make no difference, neither should the number of "followers" (term is used loosely). {{User:Beta_m/sig}}
Fleming has a strong rivalry with Page House. Flems refer to Page House solely as "pagesux." Both houses prank each other and include the other in initiations.
: * The faction must be linked intrinsically, even if on a shaky relationship, to the entire movement. There are disagreements between different factions in Anarchism, but generally they are still considered disagreements between Anarchists. The same cannot be said about "Anarcho"-Capitalism or National-"Anarchism". Which are trends that consider themselves Anarchists, but are universally rejected within the movement. It is also important to look at where these trends come from and what kind of support they have, a "movement" that consists of one site and a dozen members is simply not noteworthy.--[[User:Che y Marijuana|Che y Marijuana]] 00:36, Feb 6, 2005 (UTC)
==== Fleming Cannon ====
: * If the criteria to be included is in question as to whether it is anarchist or not, it should be known that it must be non-hierarchal and meet the other basic requirements already outlined in the article. If something is to be decided as to whether it is relevant or part of the larger movement, population does actually matter. For example, there are an extremely small number of people (possibly only the guy that made one small website on it) that believe anarchism should be melded with monarchism. If we pretend for a moment that this actually was non-hierarchal, then it would still not be relevant to include in the article because the number of followers is so rediculously small. For the sake of space, since this is wikipedia, all that should be included in the article are things, people, and movements which had something significantly to do with anarchism in the past or does in the present. --[[User:Fatal|Fatal]] 04:35, 6 Feb 2005 (UTC)
The Fleming Cannon, a Caltech landmark, is fired to mark important events, such as the end of rotation, Ditch Day, the end of the year, and graduation. It is a thunderous noise that can be heard and felt all over campus.
After [http://www.flemingcannon.com/history.html returning] to campus in [[1980]], the Fleming Cannon was stolen by [[Harvey Mudd College|Harvey Mudd]] students in 1986 ([http://people.bu.edu/fmri/somers/cannon.html as detailed in this article]). At the demands of both college administrations, the Cannon was returned to Fleming House approximately 8 weeks after the prank.
: * The bounds of the article should start out as historical, not ideological. Anarchism consists of a history that started somewhere around Proudhon and Bakunin, and included diverse movements and individual activists and writers, associated in various ways, cooperating and competing in various ways, but all claiming parts of the same shared history and all calling themselves anarchists. The various movements and ideologies included in this history (up to present times) should be represented in proportion to their historical weight---whether that is measured in terms simply of number, of historical impact, of success in promulgating their ideas, whatever. This doesn't answer all questions, but give us the framework that should be argued within---there is no need to decide what is The Correct Anarchist Line. There is only need to figure out how 'popular' or how high an impact various ideologies or movements have had. If the answer is 'a tiny one', then they should get only a tiny mention. --[[User:Nil|Nil]] 07:53, 6 Feb 2005 (UTC)
It was rumored that Harvey Mudd would attempt to steal the cannon again in 2006 to celebrate the 20th anniversary of their original theft. However, the cannon disappeared a day before the anniversary only to show up at [[MIT]], just in time for Campus Preview Weekend, during which many rising freshmen visit MIT. A (seemingly fake) moving company by the name of [http://www.howeandser.com/ Howe & Ser Moving Co.] has taken credit. (The name is a double [[pun]]: When substituting "and" for the [[ampersand]], it reads "how we answer", while substituting the [[Latin]] ''[[et]]'' for the ampersand gives "[[Howitzer]]".) Displayed prominently in front of MIT's [[Green Building (MIT)|Green Building]], the Fleming Cannon sported a giant, gold-plated [[MIT class ring]] around its barrel.
: * This is an encyclopedia. To best attempt an "objective" stance, there needs to be a clear guideline or model for inclusion. The criteria must be ''universal'' (can apply for all cases), ''independantly testable''(anyone can research and apply them--no secret knowledge), and have ''fecundity'' (the criteria can apply now and in the future, plus leave room for more questions/distinctions). This is no different than whan makes for a good scientific theory. [[String Theory]] and [[quantum gravity]] are completely different, competing theories but to the average reader, many nuances must be explained. To make the difference between an anarchist ideological/historical event and other social movements clear to the average reader, the article should provide explicit criteria. --[[User:Albamuth|albamuth]] 20:32, 6 Feb 2005 (UTC)
A day after the prank was disclosed, Fleming's members began planning a recovery operation on the night April 7th. They immediately mounted a large-scale operation, sending 23 members to Boston within 24 hours. The Flems were greeted at MIT by a group of students and police who watched as the cannon was loaded into a truck. Afterwards, a friendly barbecue celebrated the event.
: * The only criteria for inclusion is quality, (think [[featured article]]) [[verifiability]], [[Cite your sources|Citability]], and the 32k size concern. The definition of anarchism is not the single organic movement beginning with [[Proudhon]] and [[Bakunin]] (which should be discussed), nor is it [[syndicalism]] alone, nor any one thing. Rather anarchism is a natural concept based on [[anarchy]] (the temporary absence of governmental authority), rather than any one of the movements, incidents, uprisings or states (like say [[Somalia]]) that represent it. {{Vip|user=Sam Spade}} 22:26, 6 Feb 2005 (UTC)
:''For more information, see [http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-me-cannon11apr11,0,1900487.story?coll=la-home-headlines.html this story] in the [[LA Times]] or visit the [http://fleming.caltech.edu Fleming Hovse website]''
: * Anything that's closely relevant to the concept of anarchism. I would't worry about it too much. If something strays too far off topic, someone will delete it. Or if it's not mentioned or elaborated on enough, someone will put it in. All these arguments will be rehashed over and over. Anything we write will be erased many times over through the course of time anyway. I don't think Wikipedia is designed to allow for finality but incessant "warfare." [[User:RJII|RJII]] 16:48, 8 Feb 2005 (UTC)
=== Ricketts House ===
: * Anything notable should be mentioned. Nationalist anarchism, for example, is non-notable, with no historical or political significance other than disrupting this article. Anarcho-capitalism is more notable. But, we should make it clear that these contrived submovements do not come out of the same historical trajectory that produced the others and are not linked movements. I mean, if you go to an anarchist bookshop you could probably find syndicalist and primitivist stuff (depending on the scope of their inventory) but anarcho-capitalism is an independent, unrelated movement that happens to have a related prefix and is generally not even taken seriously by any other anarchist "submovement"(as for nationalist anarchism, few have ever even heard of it as is seen by the confused reaction by regular editors of this article). Such subcategories should not be treated as equal in importance, nor should they be contrasted throughout the article as if they have equal merit or that such debates occur often (anarchists generally ignore or brush off anarcho-capitalists, anarcho-capitalists do the same to anarchists. Or wait. "Left" anarchists.) To present these subcategories in any other way is to distort the landscape of the anarchist movement and ignore trends in the history of anarchist thought. I support a seperate section for any of these questionable schools of thought, where their ideas are surveyed and compared to the rest of the article, so that their views do not distort the rest of the article and create misunderstandings about their role in the greater anarchist movement. [Sorry, that was a jumble of only partially coherent thought, I have a headache and I'm tired :P] --[[User:Tothebarricades.tk|Tothebarricades.tk]] 20:33, 8 Feb 2005 (UTC)
[[Image:RickettsCrest.jpg|thumb|right|Ricketts Crest - "Take me as I am"]]
'''Ricketts Hovse''' was funded by and named for [[Louis Davidson Ricketts]]. Members of Ricketts House are called Skurves (or Scurves) due to a play on the similarity of the name Ricketts to the disease [[rickets]] and the fact that [[scurvy]] is another vitamin deficiency disease. Members of Ricketts Hovse were known as ''Rowdies'' until about 1960; alumni of that period still draw the distinction between ''Rowdies'' and ''Skurves''.
Ricketts traditions include fire related activities and the brakedrum. Prior to early 2003, the Ricketts courtyard housed a large concrete firepot, in which massive fires were often enjoyed during cool Pasadena evenings. However, due to tightening of Pasadena fire codes and the Caltech administration's recent focus on liability concerns, the firepot was removed. The brakedrum is a contest between the freshman class and the sophomore class over ownership of the brakedrum.
: * As above, anything notable (to be specific, that which is beyond the internet, beyond single-person advocacy, beyond secret societies with no evidence) should be mentioned in some form, but proper emphasis placed on controversial and minor movements (i.e. their mention should be brief and include links to their own articles if such exist). Anarchism, as a political ideology, is distinct from anarchy, mere anti-state ideology, mere isolationism, or mere anti-capitalism. As such, inclusion on this page should be based on loose adherence to the most basic of anarchist values, including ''total'' abolition of the state, and a never-ending push to eliminate human domination in whatever forms it arises including: prisons, judiciary, politicians, human bondage in contractual or physical form, etc. Ideologies which advocate such institutions as compatible with human freedom are subverting the very definitions of the words used by anarchists to promote their ideology. Thus, the determination of what is and is not part of anarchism is not formulaic, it is subjective and organic in accordance with the values of those following in the tradition of anarchism. As such, there is no simple rule to follow, and judgements based on inclusion and extent of coverage in this article should include its significance (in numbers of subscribers and real-world events), its degree of adherence to past anarchist values, its continuing rejection of institutional status-quo (regardless of what the status-quo happens to be), its acceptance by other anarchist movements involved in the tradition, its compatibility with the underlying theory, its coherence with the basic meaning(s) of the word itself. [[User:Kevehs|Kev]] 00:58, 9 Feb 2005 (UTC)
Ricketts House was known for athletics and student government in the 1950s, but in the past decades Ricketts has been known less for these activities, and more for activities which push the motto "Take me as I am" to the limit. Scurves have in recent years assumed the role of agents provocateurs on campus, confronting a growing legalism on the part of campus administration with increasingly envelope-pushing displays of self-expression. A recent example has been the inverted [[pentagram]] which Ricketts had displayed for years on the front wall of its dining room. Administration members have called for the removal of the pentagram as it represents a symbol which may offend the general public who view the house during tours. Furthermore, they cite the questionable political correctness of a pentagram in the house. However, Ricketts Hovse maintains the tradition of the mural as one of Ricketts oldest symbols, even included in the Ricketts Hovse crest. Ricketts also cites the purpose of the houses; to promote Caltech undergraduate community, not to satisfy potential tourists. The hindrance of putting the mural back up has even drawn into question the supremacy of freedom of expression, as one of the basic tenets of Ricketts, over what some might call "political correctness." During the recently completed renovations, the mural was painted over, and a new mural policy has been put in place. The administration has yet to listen to cries from Ricketts Hovse officers who maintain the validity of putting their mural back in place.
: * Anything notable, yes... and don't let one slanted group define in a monopolistic way what's "notable". [[User:Dtobias|Dtobias]] 00:49, 10 Feb 2005 (UTC)
In 2005, the administration pressured Ricketts to make their website private because many of the pictures and quotes on the website were considered to be potentially offensive.
: * The criteria for inclusion into this article is simple: if said inclusion is anti-hierarchy, anti-capitalism, anti-oppression, and anti-authority, then it should be considered to be included. Or, if it is related to anarchist history or information about the movements, collectives, communes, etc. that are anarchistic in nature. --[[User:Jremington|Jazz Remington]] 02:08, 10 Feb 2005 (UTC)
== The North Houses ==
: * The more I think about it, the clearer it becomes that anarcho-capitalists and ''sui dissant'' traditional anarchists are simply using the same word in different senses. When a (pro-capitalist) libertarian asks another libertarian "Are you an anarchist?", he would never give a reply like "Yes, because I agree with Bryan Caplan that Spooner and Tucker were fundamentally on our side," or "No, Bakunin was way off." That would be irrelevant from their perspective. He would simply answer based on whether he favored abolishing the state. For left-wing anarchists, on the other hand, ___location within the historical anarchist movement is crucial. This is why we need to have a disambiguation page. Personally, as I have said before, I think it would be clearer to have the disambiguation page here, under [[anarchism]], because the anarchism of the anarchist movement is far from the most common usage, and then put the contents of this article somewhere else (maybe under [[anarchist movement]]); but it works either way, so long as we have a note at the top of the article saying ''This article is about the philosophy of anarchism associated with thinkers such as Pierre-Joseph Proudhon and Mikhail Bakunin. For other senses of the word anarchism, see [[anarchism (word)]]''. - [[User:Nat Krause|Nat Kraus]][[User_Talk:Nat Krause|e]] 19:58, 10 Feb 2005 (UTC)
=== Lloyd House ===
Lloyd House is smallest of the three North Houses. The North Houses were constructed in 1960 with funds provided by the Lloyd Foundation and other donors. Lloyd House was named in memory of Mr. Ralph B. Lloyd and his wife, Mrs. Lulu Hull Lloyd. Mr. Lloyd was a member of the Board of Trustees of Caltech, 1939-1952.
==Survey Results==
Members of Lloyd House are called Lloydies and the house color is gold. The motto is "I live and die for those I love."
This is my summary of the survey results.
'''What are the distinguishing characteristics of anarchist philosophies?'''
* A movement against hierarchy, which requires opposition to capitalism, statism, racism, etc. (8 responses)
* An extension of the word "anarchy" (1 response)
* Opposition to any individual, group, or organization governing or ruling over any individual without any other ''implications''. (1 response)
* There are too many interpretations of anarchism for it to be defined by strict criteria. (1 response)
Lloyd House is governed by a student-elected, student-run Executive Committee, or "Excomm," of 9 members: President, Secretary, Superintendent, Treasurer, Social Director, Athletic Director, and 3 representatives at large. The Social Director and Athletic Director are aided by the Social Team (5 members) and the Athletic Team (3 members). There are 8 Upperclass Counselors (UCC's) and various appointed positions, such as Librarian, Historian, and Pool Monkey. The Purple UCC's roommate is responsible for maintaining the house pornography collection. He is given the unofficial title of "Ima Palmer".
'''What purpose should this article serve?'''
* It should give a very certain definition (mostly traditional) of anarchism and show examples in strict accordance to that definition. (4 responses)
* It should do the above, but also include controversial claimants to which there is a good account of. (5 responses)
* It should supply the reader with sufficient information on what anarchism is. (1 response)
* It should comply with wikipedia policy. (1 response)
Lloyd House (Building #54 on the Caltech map) is located along the Olive Walk. The physical structure of Lloyd House is an "L"-shaped, two-story building. At the intersection of the two "legs" of the house are "Lower [[Crotch]]" and "Upper Crotch," which serve as communal lounge areas.
'''What criteria should be used for inclusion in this article?'''
* Should only include notable flavors of anarchism that don't contradict "mainstream" anarchist values. (5 responses)
* Should include mainstream, historical information but also include notable, semi-related movements. (5 responses)
* Only criteria should be quality of source reference. (1 response)
* The article needs disambiguation. (1 response)
Lloyd is divided into seven alleys: Purple, Kaos, VI ([[Virgin Islands]]), Fingal's, [[Valhalla]], Inferno, and Tropic. Each alley is decorated with theme-appropriate [[mural]]s. Some key murals include: the expansive Purple mural in the theme of Japanese [[tsunami]] waves, the [[M. C. Escher|Escher]] mural in Kaos, the tropical mural in VI, the "Enjoy [[Crack cocaine|Crack]]" mural in Inferno that mocks the famous [[Coca-Cola]] slogan and contains a reference to [[Alan Moore]]'s graphic novel [[Watchmen]], and the newly painted modern art in Tropic.
So, looks like people largely agree on what anarchism ''is'' and dispute a little on what should be included in the article, except that the source material should be reliable. From this, my recommendation is that the article needs to revise the introductory paragraphs to correctly define the article's stipulation of what qualifies as anarchism and also include "controversial claimants" that don't quite fit that definition but are historically notable. I recommend that the controversial topics be put a separate section but not the "Schools of anarchist thought" section, where Anarcho-Capitalism is listed now. --[[User:Albamuth|albamuth]] 00:04, 11 Feb 2005 (UTC)
The "shed" used to be a stand-alone building in the courtyard that housed Lloyd's big screen TV. Now the "shed" exists indoors, in a room adjacent to Valhalla that used to be part of the MOSH's office.
:I very much disagree w your conclusion, and would suggest it is majoritarian rather than concensus based. Since its extremely obvious the demographics here are almost entirely left-anarchist, taking a majoritarian approach to determining article content is extremely biased. ([[User:Sam Spade|Sam Spade]] | [[user_talk:Sam Spade|talk]] | [[Special:contributions/Sam Spade|contributions]]) 13:33, 11 Feb 2005 (UTC)
====Famous Lloydies====
==Responses to Survey Answers==
[http://cripplingdepression.com/ Crippling Depression], a satirical [[comic strip]] that was published regularly in the California Tech, the student newspaper, was drawn and written by Lloydies.
I moved these responses to respondants of the survey here. Sorry! I want the survey to be nicely formatted. --[[User:Albamuth|albamuth]] 18:07, 5 Feb 2005 (UTC)
:: (1)Beta has given a very narrow and factional definition. It excludes important anarchist traditions such as anarcho-capitalism and primitivism. It also excludes smaller, newer movements such as national-anarchism. Both etymologically and historically, the defining feature of 'anarchism' (unqualified) has been opposition to 'the state'. See Proudhon, Bakunin, Kropotkin, etc.
Lloydies are known for their elaborate pranks. The classic [[Great Rose Bowl Hoax|prank of the 1961 Rose Bowl]] was pulled off by the "Fiendish Fourteen," members of Lloyd House. Flashcards that were intended to cheer for the Washington Huskies football team were changed to read Caltech. The Hollywood sign was changed to read "Caltech" in 1987 by a group of Pageboys and Lloydies.
::: Anarchism is not etymologically defined as opposition to the state, but absence of rulers. ALL of the anarchists you cited took that to mean absence of capitalist coercion along with state domination, and all of them took it to mean absence of the mini-states that your site specifically advocates. [[User:Kevehs|Kev]] 18:28, 5 Feb 2005 (UTC)
Every year since 1994, Lloydies have climbed onto the top of Millikan Library to construct the Lloyd Christmas Tree, a monumental structure of numerous Christmas lights strung together to resemble a 10-story Christmas tree topped with a 12-feet-tall "L." The latest prank was the pranking of MIT's prefrosh weekend, in which many Lloydies were involved.
:::: This is in response to people saying that the core of [[Anarchism]] is the fight against [[Capitalism]]. I will agree with that, but there were many movements that didn't. For example many anarchists in [[USSR]] have welcomed [[privatisation]] in the same way some anarks in the [[Western Europe]] argue for some level of [[nationalisation]] (for example of utilities) as the short term goal. It all depends on where you stand and from which direction you approach the oppressive regime. {{User:Beta_m/sig}}
A common folklore that has been passed down throughout the years is that of the Purple LSD lab. It has been said that sometime in the 70's, a group of [[chemistry]] majors living in Purple blocked off some of the alley for a special project. The product of their project, was dubbed "Lloyd-grade" LSD, to denote its extraordinary purity. The rumor goes that it was one of the largest sources of LSD at the time. Nearly the entire senior class (only 3 seniors are mentioned in the yearbook from 1970) was expelled when the [[FBI]] invaded the house.
:: (2)Agreed, in principle, but there is so much disagreement about what the 'anarchist movement' is (probably because it is very different things to different people) that the 'examples' will probably be under continued dispute. If the object is to attain agreement you probably need to adopt a minimalist approach and just give a few dictionary definitions, skipping the examples.
=== Page House ===
::: Dictionary definitions alone will not work. People often use highly selective dictionary definitions, and several of the most common definitions contradict one another. [[User:Kevehs|Kev]] 18:28, 5 Feb 2005 (UTC)
<!-- Unsourced image removed: [[Image:PageCrest.jpg|thumb|right|Page House crest]] -->
Upon the arrival of the North Houses in the 1960s, members of Ricketts house splintered off to populate the newly constructed Page House. Members of the house are known as Pageboys (even the women), and the house crest includes the "mechanical horse" with a banner reading ''spe labor levis'', a Latin [[idiom]] meaning "May the work be light" (and is often followed by "And the drinks be heavy"). House construction was funded by J.R. Page, former vice president of the First National Bank in Los Angeles, and chairman of the Caltech board of trustees from 1943 to 1954. While Page lacks the architectural history of other houses, or the affluent contributions of benefactors, its large size plus popular social activities provide the house with a large influx of money heavily used for party construction, the purchasing of hot tubs left and right, and buying nice Christmas and end-of-year presents for the cleaning crew. The largest (room-wise) of the houses, Page has been home to KCAL, the Interhouse Roller Coaster, and also used its access to the basement so that Pageboys could cover the concrete with dry ice, a prank copied in the movie [[Real Genius]].
:: (3)Enormous scope for disagreement here because the concept of 'linked' is (a) vague, and (b) highly politically charged. If this criterion is adopted there will be a variety of edit wars between those who wish to filter out movements that they consider 'not linked' and the advocates of movements that consider themselves to be 'linked'. Some of the disputed movements, such as the anarcho-capitalists, are pretty big (and old). Again, a minimalist approach might be the fairest and most sustainable solution.
In response to other houses quixotically claiming certain items to be off limits in regard to pranks (rendering them Non-RF-able), the Page House president at the time named that The President be unprankable as well. Not getting the joke, the Interhouse committee allowed it, and to this day, the only two items in Page House that cannot be the target of pranks are the craps felt and a poster of President Nixon. The poster is passed on to each House President shortly after s/he is elected.
::: The kind of 'minimalist' approach that you are advocating will allow anyone with an internet connection and an imagination to pretend that they have a "new and improved" offshoot of anarchism to lobby for. Anarcho-monarchism? No problem, just throw up a webpage like anon here and the next thing you know you are a legitimate movement being "censored" for saying perfectly acceptable things like, "we believe in the right of everyone to be ruled by a sovereign." Whether or not the criteria should open the door for people like the capitalists is a seperate issue, one that you are only commenting on because it turns out that anarcho-capitalism is a whole heck of a lot closer to nationalist anarchism than and of the traditional movements are. It is very obvious it should not leave things open for people who explicitly say in multiple articles, "we are not anarchists," as your site does. [[User:Kevehs|Kev]] 18:28, 5 Feb 2005 (UTC)
All student rooms in Page are designed as doubles; however, when vacancies arise, upperclassmen may live in rooms as singles. According to house bylaws, the newly elected Page House president may choose to reside in any room as a single. Other popular rooms include the "long doubles" upstairs and downstairs, and Page 201, which has easy access to the arcade roof between Page and Lloyd House, also known as The Bridge. The FU, across from the Library, is Page House's entertainment room, complete with dozens of bean bags. Its name originates from a prank in which Fleming painted a large "F" on its door. Rather than painting over it, Pageboys simply painted a "U" below it. The FU was formerly a triple, and before that was the RA apartment, which is now located downstairs. The Library itself is Page House's greatest and most notorious landmark, and although its collection is always being removed to be recycled elsewhere, its contents are meant to reflect the works and contributions of contemporary Pageboys and all who pass through its hallowed halls. For these reasons, the Library is the only room in Page House in which one must wear shoes.
I'm not sure what deluded planet you're coming from, but please point out the organizations that consider themselves National-"Anarchist" or "Anarcho"-Capitalists, and those "big" influential numbers they have or have had at critical points in history. Not only are these movements not accepted by Anarchism, and therefore not Anarchist, but they are also insignificant and simply not noteworthy on the main Anarchism page.--[[User:Che y Marijuana|Che y Marijuana]] 00:41, Feb 6, 2005 (UTC)
Favorite Pageboy activities include grilling on The Bridge, champagne at Millikan to celebrate the end of quarter, and Intrahouse, in which all eight alleys in Page partake in the annual tradition of applying primer and painting pictures that are combination of funny and creepy and always rife with innuendo. The painting in between alleys 6 and 7 covers "the fruit wall", a favorite target for PVC-borne projectiles, particularly fruit which tend to vaporize on contact. In addition to Intrahouse, there is the annual Stranding Of the Freshmen ("It's ''coooold'' on Mount Wilson!"), the Wait Staff Initiation, and Grease Frosh, in which Pageboys make liberal use of Caltech's grounds and upkeep fund by selecting a designated freshman in each alley (referred to as that alley's Grease Frosh), who is then sent scampering about the Beckman lawn in the effort to evade upperclassmen who are trying to tackle an opposing alley's Grease Frosh before theirs are tackled. Pageboys then rinse themselves in Gene Pool, producing a nice, visible Crisco and lard film on the surface. Until 2003, they first rinsed in Millikan Pond, but the ___location has changed due to administrative request. Finally, all the Pageboys rinse off completely in the Fleming showers.
----
I think it's POV to say that anarchism is anti-capitalism since there is such a thing as anarcho-capitalism (free-market anarchism). I think to be honest you would have to say, rather, that "most anarchists" are anti-capitalism, that is, most anarchists are socialist anarchists or whatever. Advocates of governmentless pure capitalism would not agree that their is an authoritarian "heirarchy" or any kind of coercion in such a system. I think when you start making judgements as to whether anarcho-capitalism is "hierarchical," as I understand how you mean it, you start putting "POV" in the article. I think the only way you could get away with it and be truly neutral is to have an article exclusively devoted to "traditional anarchism" or something like that. Besides, the anti-capitalism anarchists insisting on a monopoly of the word "anarchism" is a little un-anarchistic isn't it? [[User:RJII|RJII]] 04:37, 6 Feb 2005 (UTC)
=== Ruddock House ===
[[Image:Ruddock_house_crest.jpg|thumb|right|Ruddock House crest]]'''Ruddock House''' was constructed in 1960 in honor of Albert Billings Ruddock, the Chairman of the Caltech Board of Trustees. Approximately 175 Caltech undergraduates are members of the House, and approximately 90 reside in the House. Members of Ruddock House are nicknamed "Rudds." During the week, student waiters serve family style dinners in the dining room; some notable dinner traditions include the throwing of bread rolls and "floating" members who break dinner rules by pouring water on them. The hallways, referred to as "alleys" by undergraduates, are adorned with various murals including reproductions of M. C. Escher works, a Monopoly Board, Simpsons characters, and a two-story mural of an astronaut. This mural, called "The Spaceman" by Rudds, is based on a photograph of Ed White's spacewalk during Gemini 4. The painting was made completely by Phil Cormier ('79) in a day's worth of work. Interestingly, a few years later Rusty Schweickart, Jr. (whose [[Rusty Schweickart|father]] walked in space on [[Apollo 9]]) was elected house president. Another Rudd connected to the space program is Phillip Engelauf ('78), who later became a flight director at JSC.
==== OPI ====
: Saying that "most anarchists" are against capitalism implies that it is possible to be an anarchist and be for capitalism. In other words, it gives away the capitalist position at the outset, rather than keeping the language neutral. Great care has been taken in many of these articles to avoid such language.
After the unfortunate demise of a campus-wide undergraduate party tradition, Interhouse, Ruddock began the tradition of OPI. OPI, standing for either "Our Private Interhouse" or "(Our) Own Private Interhouse," traditionally occurs during the winter term of the academic year. One of the most notable aspects of the OPI is the amount of time and effort put into construction and artwork for the sets of the party. Recent years' preparations have included skylines of Tokyo, a giant Egyptian pyramid, and a 16' tall windmill from Moulin Rouge.
== Avery House ==
: Describing the anarchist POV is not the same as violating NPOV wikipedia policy. In fact, describing anarchist POV is one of the purposes of this article. Finally, explaining that anarchism has always been, both historically and philosophically, anti-capitalist, is not creating a "monopoly" on the word anarchism. It is supporting ''meaning'' for the word anarchism. If we remove the meaning anarchism has always had since the first individuals began to self-describe as such in order to placate the desires of every possible group claiming the title, then the word will lose all meaning in the process. [[User:Kevehs|Kev]] 08:37, 6 Feb 2005 (UTC)
[[Image:AveryLogo.gif|thumb|right|The logo of Avery]]
'''Avery House''' is part of the housing system at the California Institute of Technology, housing [[undergraduate]]s, [[graduate student]]s, [[Faculty (university)|faculty]], and visiting guests.
The jury is still out on a nickname for Avery's members. "Averyites" is used frequently on internal house email lists, and sometimes in conversation. The terms "[[Aviary|Birds]]" and "Averoids" have fallen into disuse. Other Caltech students sometimes call it "Slavery House," thus making the members "Slaves." While some hold that this derives from a reference to the sizable [[Christianity|Christian]] population of Avery and [[Nietzsche]]'s characterization of Christianity as a [[Master-Slave Morality|slave morality]], most believe this is simply a convenient way to make the name "Avery" derogatory.
:RJ, you've already stated that you thought anarchism was just "not governing" anyone else, which by that I assume you mean official government. By this, you have said that anarchism is exactly the same as anti-statism, which it is not. However, if you expand the defintion of "state" and rightfully argue that the term state can also cover other hierarchal institutions like the workplace and capitalism, then anti-statism does mean anarchism. However, in general, anti-statism is used to refer to JUST government in its strict literal official sense. It is this definition which I believe you're under the assumption that anarchism is. Anarchism is much more than that, anarchism is against all hierarchy, all irrational authority, everywhere, in every area of society. I'm not trying to insult you at all, but from this I gather you have a limited understanding of anarchism, and your POV might lead one to believe that anti-capitalism isn't a priority for anarchists, but it is. --[[User:Fatal|Fatal]] 23:01, 6 Feb 2005 (UTC)
A segment of members of the on-campus houses refuse to recognize Avery as a House, although starting in recent years. Avery is part of the Rotation process, houses freshman, and has official status as a student house. This change has led to a debate regarding Avery's importance to the Caltech community. Perceptions about Avery have changed significantly now that there are many students for whom Avery has been a house during the entire time they have been students at Caltech.
::That's not my understanding of anarchism. When I said that anarchism was the "lack of anyone governing anyone else" that's what I meant. I wasn't referring to "official government" but any form of someone ruling over someone else. Anarcho-capitalists think that capitalism, in its pure form, is just that ..the lack of anyone governing or ruling over anyone. They don't think that employers, for example, or ruling or governing anyone, and that's precisely the reason that they favor capitalism or free trade. Both traditional anarchists and anarcho-capitalists are against the same thing. It's just that they disagree on what constitutes governing, coercive hierarchy, or whatever you want to call it. Free-market anarchism (anarcho-capitalism) clearly falls under the title "anarchism." At a previous time in history all anarchists apparently were against capitalism, but that's no longer the case. Some of you guys are trying to hold on to the past, but this is a new day. Not all anarchists are against capitalism. By the way, "anti-statism" isn't the same as "anti-state." Capitalists who are in favor of the existence of government are also anti-statism, as [[statism]] means centralized control over an economy by a government rather than being against government itself. I suggest you use "anti-state" to avoid confusion. [[User:RJII|RJII]] 23:59, 6 Feb 2005 (UTC)
Many outside Avery and a faction within Avery maintain that this decision was driven mainly by faculty concerns and does not reflect the needs of the Avery community. But others agree with the move, pointing out that Avery's inclusivity will give freshmen a social alternative to sometimes-overbearing traditions held dear by the other houses. By a 10-to-1 vote in May 2004, the Faculty Board approved the decision on a two-year experimental basis, though it is widely expected to become permanent. As Avery does not have many traditions similar to those of other houses, members of Avery have a reputation as "trolls" (members of the Caltech community who spend most of their time studying rather than socializing). While this perception is in some cases accurate, particularly for those who use Avery as off-campus housing, part of the reputation stems from the fact that students from every house tend to socialize within their own house more often than not, combined with Avery's physical distance from the other houses.
:::Using your definition of statism, anti-statist capitalists are for anti-statism and that's it. Anarchism has never been and is not purely anti-statism, it's much more than that. We are not trying to "hold on to the past", we're not dinosaur leninists for christ's sake. The hierarchy of boss over workplace, capitalist over company, and such is one of the oldest struggles. It is simply foolish to think that capitalists are not building a class system over the lower class and exerting power over their labor. When a construction worker is employed to build a luxury apartment complex that he could never afford to live in, that's arbitrarily serving the upper class and what does he get in return? A wage, a meager response for his labor when his labor is something he could be enjoying. And the monetary system! For that under capitalism can only be hierarchal and only deny things to those who don't have it. I could go on forever. Capitalism has wayyyy to many counts of hierarchy against it to ever be anything close to non-hierarchal.
Members of Avery House argue that they prefer Avery's alternative environment, and that much of the student population complains about Avery being a house while having limited personal experience with it. Many think that in time Avery will establish its own traditions and identity as a house, although some within the house do not agree that this is a good thing. Some examples of emerging traditions are an affinity for [[Dance Dance Revolution]] and [[Karaoke Revolution]], which are scheduled events during prefrosh weekend hosted by Avery House, and strong undercurrents of Christian and Asian/Asian-American culture.
::::Well, anarcho-capitalists disagree, and that's my point. If they thought there was anything un-anarchistic, or coercively hierarchical, or any "governing" going on then they wouldn't be pro-capitalism (or free-market). Whether it is a not is a matter for debate but not a matter of deciding peremptorily in the very definition of "anarchism." Anarcho-capitalists think that the world that "traditional anarchists" want is not a truly anarchistic or based in voluntary human interaction. And, I know they object to your ideas as being inconsistent with "true anarchism" as well. But there is common ground in that both advocate what they ''believe to be'' the ideal of human freedom and the lack of external "authority" over the individual. So, in the most basic sense "traditional anarchists" and free-market anarchists (anarcho-capitalists) are both anarchists. [[User:RJII|RJII]] 12:29, 7 Feb 2005 (UTC)
There are some noticeable policy differences between it and the rest of the student houses besides the historical one of only recently accepting freshman through Rotation. For one, Avery facilities (dining hall, conference room, and library) are available for use by other members of the Caltech community for events; thus, Averyites often find their house's courtyard filled with partying alumni or their library being used for faculty conference. In some cases Avery students have been unable to access their dining facilities due to such arrangements, forcing them to eat elsewhere. Another important distinction is that in addition to the already-exceptional inclusion of faculty in residence and graduate students, a significant portion of Avery's rooms are reserved as "off-campus" spots. These can be chosen by members of any House (including Avery itself) that are prevented from living in their own House due to a lack of rooms—or, in Avery's case, lack of undergraduate-assigned rooms. Finally, due to a policy said to have been put in place by R. Stanton Avery himself, Avery members are not allowed to place anything "nonremovable" on the walls, and thus their house lacks the murals that decorate most other undergraduate residences.
:::::Well, they can disagree all they want, but the reality is, the lack of '''any''' recognition as a form of Anarchism from any Anarchists makes their claim dubious enough not to be taken seriously. Which to me means, if they are to be included on this page, it will be in the "what Anarchism is '''not'''" section, with a link to its own page. And yet again, its lack of any major movements, its lack of mass membership, historical battles, etc... just makes its mention here unjustified.--[[User:Che y Marijuana|Che y Marijuana]] 20:21, Feb 7, 2005 (UTC)
== Off-campus Housing ==
::::::If we were all simply trying to edit this to our own points of view, I'd put communism and socialism in the "what Anarchism is '''not'''" section, as I see such hyper-statist systems as completely antithetical to any rational conception of anarchism. However, we're supposed to be trying for a NPOV here. [[User:Dtobias|Dtobias]] 12:07, 8 Feb 2005 (UTC)
Caltech-owned housing that is not part of any of the eight Houses is known as "off-campus" housing, even if it is acually physically located on the Caltech campus. (Non-Caltech owned housing is called "off-off-campus.") These housing units do not maintain memberships or have the community or tradiations that the other Houses have. Off-campus housing currently consists of Marks House, Braun House, the Del Mar apartments, the Chester apartments, and a handful of single-family homes owned by Caltech. All of these are either within the Caltech campus, or within one block of it. A small portion of Avery is also included in the off-campus lottery with the rest of these properties.
::::::: This strange bit of logic would end with the unavoidable conclusion that the very people who originally called themselves anarchists, those who took part in forming the meaning of the word as it is used today as a self-description, were not anarchists. Further, that the very people those anarchists opposed most vociferously are in fact anarchists. In other words, it would be to strip all meaning from the word by reversing it. Actually, I suppose that would be easy to do if one existed in a vacuum, carefully removed from history in a nice bubble of neo-classical liberal rhetoric designed to ensure that the average anarcho-capitalist has no clue what they are talking about but insist on voicing their opinion as often as possible. Ah, Rothbard was such a genius. [[User:Kevehs|Kev]] 18:34, 8 Feb 2005 (UTC)
==External links==
== Problem with Anarchism ==
*[http://www.ugcs.caltech.edu/~ihc/ the Interhouse Committee (IHC)] - committee of the presidents of the Houses; plans and supervises Rotation and inter-House sports and activities
*[http://www.housing.caltech.edu/undergrad/ Caltech Undergraduate Housing] - from the Institute's Housing Department
*[http://donut.caltech.edu/about/history/Jou02/Jou02Houses.pdf A History of Undergraduate Self-Governance at Caltech; Part II, A History of the Undergraduate Houses (1930-2002)]
*[http://turli.caltech.edu/ Task force on Undergraduate Residence Life Initiatives (TURLI) report]
== Footnotes ==
I think the problem lies in what people believe anarchism and the definition of anarchism is. An ararchist may claim he is practicing anarchism, but not necessarily in the true sense of the actual definition. I think the inclusion of the different view points of what people believe is anarchism should be included, however the basic definition should not be changed. --[[User:AllyUnion| AllyUnion]] [[User talk:AllyUnion|(talk)]] 10:39, 8 Feb 2005 (UTC)
<references/>
[[Category:California Institute of Technology]]
:Lingusitics is the cause of many a problem, because people redefine words for themselves or use words in different senses or use words to gain attention when it fact they are not associating at all with the defintion of that word. People in the media use "anarchy" to get attention, brainless pop punks falsely claim to be anarchists just because they like using a stylized version of the circumscribed A. What we have here in this talk page are fascists and power mongers that have mislabeled themselves to put accross a more "positive" image that is false. --[[User:Fatal|Fatal]] 23:07, 8 Feb 2005 (UTC)
[[Category:Student houses]]
== Protection ==
What good is done by keeping this page protected? Two people are prevented from making a clearly bad edit that portrays fascist nationalism as anarchism? This is what page history and rollback are for.
There are several changes that I would like to make, but these "national-anarchists" are getting what they want, our attention. [[User:Guanaco|Guan]][[User talk:Guanaco|aco]] 03:12, 9 Feb 2005 (UTC)
: One person, actually... But there seem to be other issues in the air. [[User:Kevehs|Kev]] 05:10, 9 Feb 2005 (UTC)
:: Yes, I think until we figure out if we want to include "Anarcho"-Capitalism, this page remaining protected is best for all. I know the things I would like to change about this article (making it crystal clear that "Anarcho"-Capitalism is not a form of Anarchism, period) need discussing, and those who would like to take this article in the other direction (including Neo-Nazis under the definition of Anarchism) also need to be subjected to this discussion. So yeah, for the good of all sides, this article should remain protected till we can decide whether Anarchism is compatible with Capitalism, or its lesser forms, Nazism included.--[[User:Che y Marijuana|Che y Marijuana]] 05:55, Feb 9, 2005 (UTC)
:::People aren't going to hesitate to put "anarcho-capitalism" in as a form of anarchism regardless of what is "decided." So does what is "decided" really matter? I doubt it. Might as well keep it protected eternally. To expect finality and unanimity on Wikipedia is ludicrous. Just battle it out eternally without resolution is my recommendation. [[User:RJII|RJII]] 06:08, 9 Feb 2005 (UTC)
::::Sure, but unanimity is not what we're working towards. If this process fails (we should at least try), then the article will be unprotected anyway and there will be simply anarchy. (haha) --[[User:Albamuth|albamuth]] 06:16, 9 Feb 2005 (UTC)
:::: I think everyone knows that the article will never be "finalized". It wouldn't be wikipedia if that were the case. But social procedures tend to generate a legitimacy that will help better represent everyone's view rather than those of one or two eager editors. It is the process, rather than any particular goal, which is being tested. [[User:Kevehs|Kev]] 06:30, 9 Feb 2005 (UTC)
::: Doesn't nazism promote racial hatred or programs? Anarchism, from what I've understood, is against racism, and nazism is practically nothing but racism. As for "Anarcho"-Capitalism," capitalism naturally rests of private property and hierarchy, which is two things that anarchism is against. So I guess, in my sense anyway, nazism and capitalism are against what anarchism promotes. --[[User:Jremington|Jazz Remington]] 06:00, 9 Feb 2005 (UTC)
:::: The best way to express this is to post answers to the survey. --[[User:Albamuth|albamuth]] 06:03, 9 Feb 2005 (UTC)
::::: I'm sorry, what survey? --[[User:Jremington|Jazz Remington]] 20:46, 9 Feb 2005 (UTC)
:::::: [[Talk:Anarchism#Survey_:_Scope_and_Purpose|This one]]. --[[User:Albamuth|albamuth]] 22:47, 9 Feb 2005 (UTC)
This is my proposed program for unprotection:
* :: We get 10 responses to each of the survey questions.
* :: People start drawing conclusions to to the survey.
* :: Discussion.
* :: Guidelines for the article are drafted.
* :: Discussion / Revision / Approval by majority
* :: Unprotection of page
* :: Neccessary changes made and guidelines posted as "sticky" in the talk pages.
That's roughly what I'd like to see happen. I know it sounds rather involved, but since this topic is so damned controversial, it should be done in an orderly fashion. --[[User:Albamuth|albamuth]] 06:03, 9 Feb 2005 (UTC)
== Insight ==
"''it's ironic that one of the meanings of "anarchy" in the dictionary (American Heritage Dictionary, 3rd edition) is "Absence of any cohesive principle, such as a common standard or purpose." If this were true of the anarchist movement, then there would be no basis for the loudly-asserted insistence that some people, groups, and philosophies were "not really anarchist" because they violated some alleged principle of anarchism.''"
:Hear hear. Its more than ironic, it is true, and insightful. There is no such basis for complaint, and besides, exclusionism is hierarchical. ([[User:Sam Spade|Sam Spade]] | [[user_talk:Sam Spade|talk]] | [[Special:contributions/Sam Spade|contributions]]) 15:55, 9 Feb 2005 (UTC)
:: You are a troll Sam. How many times have you been reminded of the distinction between ''anarchy'' and ''anarchism'', how many times have you ignored this and pressed on with the same claim that there is no difference between the meanings of the two words? [[User:Kevehs|Kev]] 16:20, 9 Feb 2005 (UTC)
:::Amen to that! (in a non-religious sense, heh). --[[User:Fatal|Fatal]] 03:08, 10 Feb 2005 (UTC)
:The problem is that "anarchy" is commonly used in a way that is markedly different than its actual etymological meaning. Dictionaries don't ''decide'' how words are used, they ''record'' usage. When an improper use of a term becomes common enough, it is recorded in a dictionary. A good example is the ironic use of "fulsome", which has absolutely no linguistic basis, getting its own definition in the dictionary alongside its more proper meaning.
:One finds similar biases in language everywhere. If you look up "anarchy" in Roget's Thesaurus, you get synonyms like "chaos" or "disorder". I was quite surprised when I expected to find synonyms like "freedom", "liberty", and the like, but couldn't find anything of the sort. Right here on Wikipedia, one can see how the word "[[villain]]" was originally derived from a word meaning "poor" or "impoverished". This boils down to the fact that the use accepted by the majority often results in a definition heavily tainted by a MPOV (Majority Point Of View), rather than a definition based in actual etymology (which is NPOV).
:In this case, the NPOV meaning of the word "anarchy" is that which corresponds to its etymological construction. ''An-'' meaning "no" and ''-archy'', referring to social structure (as in hierarchy, matriarchy, etc.). In a world ruled by people hopelessly devoted to kings and presidents, who cry for more cops on the streets and more powerful militaries -- in such a word, the idea of having "no social structure" is a frightening thing, equated with disorder and chaos. When, in fact, it is the position of Anarchists that it is possible for people to act in an orderly and civilized manner without having a social structure imposed on us; that "no social order" does ''not'' lead to chaos and disorder.
:Essentially, then, Anarchists define "anarchy", and hence Anarchism, by its literal, NPOV meaning, whilst the dictionary records its most commonly used (yet incorrect) form, complete with subjective POV cannotations and all. --[[User:Corvun|Corvun]] 22:58, 9 Feb 2005 (UTC)
::If a word is used in a certain way "commonly" then it's automatically the correct usage regardless of how it was used before. The correct use of a term isn't a constant thing. "Original meaning" and "proper usage" aren't necessarily the same thing to anyone but the most extreme pedant who is going to find it difficult to communicate with modern civilization. [[User:RJII|RJII]] 23:14, 9 Feb 2005 (UTC)
:::If you disregard etymology and determine a word's "correct" use by how it is commonly used, then all bets are off. "Irregardless" becomes a standard word. Slang terms are taught in English classes along with "the", "and", or "but". Technical definitions are thrown out the window. Next thing you know, you're telling your volkswagon to stair taller monkey cup.
:::The correct use of a word is determined by etymology and etymology alone, or at the least must be etymologically justifiable (as in the case of "ain't" as a contraction for "am not"). All else is just slang. Not that I have a problem with slang -- I use it frequently -- but slang definitions are not the same as the real thing. You cannot etymologically justify using the word "anarchy" to mean "chaos". That simply isn't accurate.
:::And as far as communicating with modern civilization: "modern civilization" is a contradiction. There is nothing civilized about the modern world, as is evidenced by these deplorable misuses of the English language. --[[User:Corvun|Corvun]] 23:37, 9 Feb 2005 (UTC)
::: I would tend to think that regardless of where one comes down on what the "correct" use of a term is, it would still be somewhat silly to base political theories on something as simplistic as a dictionary definition. In fact, doing so would require the complete rehauling of almost every political topic on wikipedia. [[User:Kevehs|Kev]] 01:24, 10 Feb 2005 (UTC)
::::That is an ''extremely'' good point! I wish I'd thought of it. --[[User:Corvun|Corvun]] 02:02, 10 Feb 2005 (UTC)
:::::I find it ironic, or perhaps telling, to find anarchists here arguing for an essentialist right/wrong definition of a word, deriving from etymology, when anarchist economists also tend to be among the relatively few defenders of the Labor Theory of Value, which argues for an essentialist, objective measure of value, deriving from labor. As a subjectivist on denotation as well as value, I would say that the definition of a word derives from long and sustained use, and etymology has very little to do with it. An incorrect but common use of a word doesn't become correct immediately, but it does eventually if it is widely used and understood. "Irregardless" will probably be acceptable some day. - [[User:Nat Krause|Nat Kraus]][[User_Talk:Nat Krause|e]] 19:58, 10 Feb 2005 (UTC)
::::::(See [[#Etymology vs. Usage|Etymology vs. Usage]] below. --[[User:Corvun|Corvun]] 02:01, 11 Feb 2005 (UTC)
::: "He uses 'anarchism' indifferently with 'anarchy', which is a hardly more correct use of words than saying that a Conservative is one who makes jam." - George Orwell. The dictionary definition of the word is unimportant. My definition of anarchy is a positive one because I am an anarchist. However, most dictionary writers are not, and the dictionary definition for "anarchy" is not in line with anarchist thought (reflecting common usage, which means nothing - "bad" is commonly used to mean "good", for example, which is even more confusing). I am quite tired of this debate showing up, personally. :P --[[User:Tothebarricades.tk|Tothebarricades.tk]] 19:17, 10 Feb 2005 (UTC)
::::Then it would seem you'd be more suited to contributing towards an anarchist site, rather than one where [[Wikipedia:References|references]] trump [[Original research|editer bias]], and [[rigour]] is to be expected. In summary, uncited anarchist POV is worth nothing here, common / expert usage is what we are here to record. I am sick of editorial demographics trumping factual accuracy and [[M:Foundation issues]]. The wikipedia is not ment to be a [[Majoritocracy]], nor is it ment to be an opportunity to lobby your favorite POV (altho thats exactly what it has become). ([[User:Sam Spade|Sam Spade]] | [[user_talk:Sam Spade|talk]] | [[Special:contributions/Sam Spade|contributions]]) 19:30, 10 Feb 2005 (UTC)
::::: And that is exactly what you have been doing ever since you arrived on the anarchism pages Jack. [[User:Kevehs|Kev]] 19:35, 10 Feb 2005 (UTC)
Absolutely, indeed insisting upon accordance with wiki policy and intellectual rigour is what I have been doing on ''every'' page since I got here. ([[User:Sam Spade|Sam Spade]] | [[user_talk:Sam Spade|talk]] | [[Special:contributions/Sam Spade|contributions]]) 19:59, 10 Feb 2005 (UTC)
:::::The word "anarchy" is discussed in the intro. The dictionary definition is irrelevant to anarchism, and equating them is hardly intellectual rigorous, but a dismissive and silly way to attack beliefs you oppose. You could discuss how some people think the proposals of anarchists will lead to your definition of "anarchy", which I'm sure you believe. That is a rational way of going about this. Otherwise, I don't see the objective of your comments here. --[[User:Tothebarricades.tk|Tothebarricades.tk]] 21:18, 10 Feb 2005 (UTC)
=== Etymology vs. Usage ===
Personally, I think it would be nice if there were a "High English" and "Low English". The language has a well-enough established place in the world that there isn't any reason why it couldn't be done, as it has been in many other languages. Or perhaps "Formal English" and "Colloquial English" (so as not to imply a value judgement, as both forms would be held in equal esteem -- such that it would be considered "vulgar" to speak Formal English in a casual setting, for instance).
In Colloquial English, "irregardless" would be a legitimate term. Slang and non-standard definitions would be as valid as standard. "Anarchy" could be used to refer either to anti-authoritarianism or to chaos and confusion. The ironic use of "fulsome" would remain standard. "Ain't" and "altright" could still be non-standard. ''Et cetera''.
In Formal English, "fulsome" would never be synonymous with "insincere", "anarchy" would only refer to anti-authoritarianism or the lack of rulership, and "irregardless" would not be a word. "Ain't" and "altright", being as etymologically defensible as similar words (isn't, aren't, almighty, almost, already, altogether), would be considered perfectly standard in Formal English -- or, alternately, if we reject "alright" in favor of "all right", then we'd have to use "all together", "all mighty", "all most", and "an other", rather than "altogether", "almighty", "almost", or "another". Basically, Formal English would require consistency, rather than what we have now: a completely arbitrary system of accepting or rejecting words based on the whims of English "authorities" deciding how the rest of us should speak based solely on what sounds best to their own ears.
In such a system, Formal English would be based in etymology, whilst Colloquial English would be based on cannotations. "Epithet", for example, would refer to descriptive bynames or ekenames in Formal English, but in Colloquial English could still mean "a derogatory name". Likewise, "orange" in Colloquial English would refer to the whole spectrum between red and yellow just as it does now, but in Formal English could only refer to a specific shade of ''yellowred'' (from Old English ''geoluhread''), just as "violet" is a specific shade of ''purple'', or "lime" a specific shade of ''green''. Also, the [[singular they]], as in "I saw someone, and they were pushing a shopping cart" might be acceptable in Colloquial English, whereas in Formal English, you'd have to say "I saw someone, and it was pushing a shopping cart", which is grammatically correct but considered extremely impolite (Formal English would not concern itself with what is "polite", only with what is technically and grammatically proper). Formal English would also retain all four second person pronouns, ''thou'', ''thee'', ''ye'', and ''you'', instead of simply (and confusingly) using ''you'' in all four cases.
Of course, this isn't likely to happen any time soon, but a guy can dream. --[[User:Corvun|Corvun]] 01:28, 11 Feb 2005 (UTC)
P.S. Sorry for going off-topic.
== CrimethInc.... ==
...is not a "school of anarchist thought" any more than, say, [[NEFAC]] is. Actually, they've written essays basically saying, there is no crimethincism, we are not an organization or an ideology, etc. They espouse a fairly new brand of anarchism which is often called [http://www.anarchist-studies.org/article/articleview/43/1/1/ Post-left anarchy], and is evident in the writings of others. Anyway, I propose changing this entire section to "Post-left anarchy" (post-leftists often use anarchy instead of the dogmatic sounding "anarchism") and expanding it discuss the ideas of people like [[Bob Black]], writers associated with [[Anarchy: A Journal of Desire Armed]], etc. This whole trend is actually very mainstream in the modern anarchist movement, so it deserves attention. --[[User:Tothebarricades.tk|Tothebarricades.tk]] 19:00, 10 Feb 2005 (UTC)
:Haven't some of you guys been making a big deal of how "anarchy" and "anarchism" are totally different concepts in the sections above? [[User:Dtobias|Dtobias]] 20:14, 10 Feb 2005 (UTC)
:: I haven't seen anyone say they are totally different concepts. I have seen several people say that they are distinct. Meaning they are not exactly one and the same. Meaning some of the meaning behind each word carries over to the other but not all of the meaning. [[User:Kevehs|Kev]] 20:24, 10 Feb 2005 (UTC)
::Well, it depends on who's defining it, as I said. When an anarchist says anarchy, it obviously has different connotations than when a conservative or a dictionary says it. But please, not this discussion again! haha --[[User:Tothebarricades.tk|Tothebarricades.tk]] 21:07, 10 Feb 2005 (UTC)
:I agree that crimethinc. should not be included in the "Schools..." section. I also forsee a major reformatting of the section titles. Hmm...
* Definition of anarchism
* History of anarchism
* Schools of anarchism
* Contemporary anarchist phenomena (here's where Crimethinc. belongs)
* Controversies in anarchism (here's where Anarcho-Capitalism is mentioned)
* Links, etc.
:: --[[User:Albamuth|albamuth]] 00:10, 11 Feb 2005 (UTC)
== The See-also section ==
Do we really need this to be so long, considering the inclusion of most of it in [[Template:Anarchism]]? --[[User:Tothebarricades.tk|Tothebarricades.tk]] 19:34, 10 Feb 2005 (UTC)
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