Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2019 February 2: Difference between revisions
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's [[Help:Using talk pages|talk page]] or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''
:''The result of the discussion was:'' <!-- Template:Cfd top --> '''Rename'''. [[User:Timrollpickering|Timrollpickering]] ([[User talk:Timrollpickering|Talk]])
:* '''Propose renaming''' [[:Category:War (U.S. band)]] to [[:Category:War (American band)]]
::* '''Propose renaming''' [[:Category:War (U.S. band) albums]] to [[:Category:War (American band) albums]]
::* '''Propose renaming''' [[:Category:War (U.S. band) members]] to [[:Category:War (American band) members]]
::* '''Propose renaming''' [[:Category:War (U.S. band) songs]] to [[:Category:War (American band) songs]]
:'''Nominator's rationale:''' [[War (band)]] was renamed by request to [[War (U.S. band)]] because of [[War (Swedish band)]]. Convention is to use "American" not "U.S." when disambiguating band names (e.g. [[Anthrax (American band)]]), so I moved the article to [[War (American band)]]. Due to the recent name change, category renaming doesn't qualify for speedy. Requesting move of these categories to match article name and naming conventions mentioned herein. Thanks. <span style="color:blue">Star</span><span style="color:orange">cheers</span><span style="color:green">peaks</span><span style="color:red">news</span>lost<span style="color:blue">wars</span><sup>[[User talk:Starcheerspeaksnewslostwars|Talk to me]]</sup> 23:57, 2 February 2019 (UTC)
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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's [[Help:Using talk pages|talk page]] or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>
==== Category:Flora of the Middle East ====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's [[Help:Using talk pages|talk page]] or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''
:''The result of the discussion was:'' <!-- Template:Cfd top --> '''Delete'''. [[User:Timrollpickering|Timrollpickering]] ([[User talk:Timrollpickering|Talk]]) 14:31, 27 February 2019 (UTC)
:* '''Propose deleting''' {{lc|Flora of the Middle East}}<br />
:* '''Propose deleting''' {{lc|Trees of the Middle East}}
:'''Nominator's rationale:''' The [[Middle East]] is not a good region to categorise plants by as it is transcontinental (it includes [[Egypt]] which is mostly in Africa) and it is not a region in the [[WP:WGSRPD|WGSRPD]] scheme which the Plants Wikiproject has adopted. For info: The WGSRPD categories include [[:Category:Flora of the Arabian Peninsula]] and [[:Category:Flora of Western Asia]].
:Note: these categories were created by the now blocked [[User:Look2See1]]. In the longer term the equivalent fauna/fungi/biota categories could also be deleted for similar reasons, but the argument for deleting these is stronger. <b>[[User:DexDor|DexDor]]</b><sup> [[User talk:DexDor|(talk)]]</sup> 21:36, 2 February 2019 (UTC)
::Note: After deletion should check that categories such as [[:Category:Flora of the Arabian Peninsula]] and [[:Category:Flora of Iraq]] are still in [[:Category:Flora of Asia]]. <b>[[User:DexDor|DexDor]]</b><sup> [[User talk:DexDor|(talk)]]</sup> 12:12, 3 February 2019 (UTC)
*'''Strong support''' Another clear example of non-consensus and unnecessary categories created by this banned user and/or their sockpuppets. [[User:Peter coxhead|Peter coxhead]] ([[User talk:Peter coxhead|talk]]) 10:52, 3 February 2019 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per nom. [[User:Johnbod|Johnbod]] ([[User talk:Johnbod|talk]]) 19:16, 9 February 2019 (UTC)
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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's [[Help:Using talk pages|talk page]] or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>
==== Classes of the Order of the Pleiades (Iran) ====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's [[Help:Using talk pages|talk page]] or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''
:''The result of the discussion was:'' <!-- Template:Cfd top --> '''Delete'''. [[User:Timrollpickering|Timrollpickering]] ([[User talk:Timrollpickering|Talk]])
:* '''Propose renaming''' [[:Category:First Classes of the Order of the Pleiades (Iran)]] to [[:Category:Recipients of the Order of the Pleiades (Iran), 1st Class]]
:* '''Propose renaming''' [[:Category:Second Classes of the Order of the Pleiades (Iran)]] to [[:Category:Recipients of the Order of the Pleiades (Iran), 2nd Class]]
:'''Nominator's rationale:''' Parent [[:Category:Recipients of the Order of the Pleiades (Iran)]] uses more clear and encyclopedic wording, so the subcats should follow suit. Whether the class numbers should be spelled out is [[TBD]]. [[User:Brandmeister|Brandmeister]]<sup>[[User talk:Brandmeister|talk]]</sup> 20:18, 2 February 2019 (UTC)
*'''Support''' -- The target has better structured. BUT do we really need it. It is an AWARD granted by a defunct monarchy to females of its royal family and female foreign dignitaries. The latter group are people who tend to receive a lot of awards, which is why we have the policy [[WP:OC#AWARD]]. There is a list in the article. [[User:Peterkingiron|Peterkingiron]] ([[User talk:Peterkingiron|talk]]) 13:18, 9 February 2019 (UTC)
* '''Delete''' per Peterkingiron and per [[WP:OCAWARD]]. If kept, support rename. [[User:Marcocapelle|Marcocapelle]] ([[User talk:Marcocapelle|talk]]) 18:24, 9 February 2019 (UTC)
* '''Delete''' The Iranian female royalty are already under [[:Category:People of the Pahlavi dynasty]] per [[WP:OVERLAPCAT]]. The foreign female officials are not defined per [[WP:OC#AWARD]]. (If kept, by all means rename.) [[User:RevelationDirect|RevelationDirect]] ([[User talk:RevelationDirect|talk]]) 03:43, 10 February 2019 (UTC)
* [[User:Brandmeister]], would you support deletion of these categories? <b>[[User:DexDor|DexDor]]</b><sup> [[User talk:DexDor|(talk)]]</sup> 06:33, 13 February 2019 (UTC)
**Would not mind in that case. [[User:Brandmeister|Brandmeister]]<sup>[[User talk:Brandmeister|talk]]</sup> 08:29, 13 February 2019 (UTC)
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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's [[Help:Using talk pages|talk page]] or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>
==== Category:Districts of Balochistan Province ====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's [[Help:Using talk pages|talk page]] or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''
:''The result of the discussion was:'' <!-- Template:Cfd top --> '''Delete'''. [[User:Timrollpickering|Timrollpickering]] ([[User talk:Timrollpickering|Talk]]) 14:30, 27 February 2019 (UTC)
:* '''Propose deleting''' {{lc|Districts of Balochistan Province}}<br />
:'''Nominator's rationale:''' A recently created category that duplicates [[:Category:Districts of Balochistan, Pakistan]]. – [[User talk:Uanfala|Uanfala (talk)]] 14:18, 2 February 2019 (UTC)
* '''Support''' per nom. [[User:Marcocapelle|Marcocapelle]] ([[User talk:Marcocapelle|talk]]) 07:00, 17 February 2019 (UTC)
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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's [[Help:Using talk pages|talk page]] or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>
==== Category:Cold War II ====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's [[Help:Using talk pages|talk page]] or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''
:''The result of the discussion was:'' <!-- Template:Cfd top --> '''Delete'''. [[User:Timrollpickering|Timrollpickering]] ([[User talk:Timrollpickering|Talk]]) 14:32, 27 February 2019 (UTC)
:* '''Propose deleting''' {{lc|Cold War II}}<br />
:'''Nominator's rationale:''' This category is used for events relating to Russian–US tensions. However, the whole article "[[Cold War II]]" ([https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Cold_War_II&oldid=881379118 diff]) currently does not mention any events categorized as part of "Cold War II". Also, very few or no reliable sources mention the connection between "Cold War II" and the categorized events, like "[[Annexation of Crimea by the Russian Federation]]", "[[Group of Two]]" (which is treated as a mere "see also" link in the parent article) and [[war in Donbass]]. The "Cold War II" article briefly mentions the [[poisoning of Sergei and Yulia Skripal]] but not in substantial detail and does not connect the term and the event. I fear that the category would be misused to (mis)categorize other events that no reliable sources would connect to. [[User:George Ho|George Ho]] ([[User talk:George Ho|talk]]) 07:17, 2 February 2019 (UTC)
* '''Delete''', almost nothing in this category is ''specifically'' about the ''tensions between'' Russia and the US. There is some content about Russian foreign policy and there is some other content about American (or NATO) foreign policy, but linking any of that to Cold War II remains a matter of subjective interpretation. [[User:Marcocapelle|Marcocapelle]] ([[User talk:Marcocapelle|talk]]) 14:19, 2 February 2019 (UTC)
*'''Keep''': Stated rationale for deletion does not make any sense at all, even at second or third reading. Could you please clarify on your fears of miscategorization and subjective interpretation? [[User:Ceannlann gorm|Ceannlann gorm]] ([[User talk:Ceannlann gorm|talk]]) 09:03, 3 February 2019 (UTC)
:: {{ping|Ceannlann gorm}} To me the "Cold War II" has been mistaken to be actually happening. Well, no sources at this time refer it as a "hoax" or nonexistent; indeed, many news articles refer it to either tensions between Russia and the West or tensions between China and the US. However, we can't be certain whether the categorized events are part of "Cold War II". I believe they are (mis)categorized just because they are part of either tensions between the US and Russia or foreign policies of Russia. To clarify my "fears of mis-categorization", I shall say that Russia-related events were (mis)categorized just because Russia was part of the original Cold War when it was part of the Soviet Union and just to re-heighten fears of Russians. Maybe I'm wrong. Why couldn't China-related events be categorized? For sure I don't know. However, I can see that reliable sources haven't yet categorized the events as part of "Cold War II". [[User:George Ho|George Ho]] ([[User talk:George Ho|talk]]) 21:04, 3 February 2019 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' as overcategorization. For example, [[2019 Venezuelan presidential crisis]] is well categorized by [[:Category:2019 in Venezuela]], [[:Category:Political history of Venezuela]] etc, but does not belong in [[:Category:Russia–European Union relations]] etc. <b>[[User:DexDor|DexDor]]</b><sup> [[User talk:DexDor|(talk)]]</sup> 06:44, 4 February 2019 (UTC)
*'''Delete'''. Overcategorization.--[[User:Darwinek|Darwinek]] ([[User talk:Darwinek|talk]]) 19:16, 6 February 2019 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' -- No doubt some commentators have referred to "a new cold war", but its scope and such like are too vague to make a useful category. [[User:Peterkingiron|Peterkingiron]] ([[User talk:Peterkingiron|talk]]) 13:20, 9 February 2019 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' – The category and article seem to be [[WP:CRYSTALBALL]] and [[WP:SYNTH]].----[[User:ZiaLater|<i style="text-shadow:#C0C0C0 0.2em 0.2em 0.2em; color: ForestGreen">ZiaLater</i>]] ([[User talk:ZiaLater|<span style="color: ForestGreen">talk</span>]]) 07:19, 22 February 2019 (UTC)
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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's [[Help:Using talk pages|talk page]] or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>
==== Category:Textile mills in Saratoga County, New York ====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's [[Help:Using talk pages|talk page]] or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''
:''The result of the discussion was:'' <!-- Template:Cfd top --> '''rename''' <small>([[Wikipedia:Non-admin closure|non-admin closure]])</small>. [[User:Marcocapelle|Marcocapelle]] ([[User talk:Marcocapelle|talk]]) 06:48, 10 February 2019 (UTC)
:* '''Propose Renaming & Expanding''' [[:Category:Textile mills in Saratoga County, New York]] to [[:Category:Textile mills in New York (state)]]
:'''Nominator's rationale:''' Per [[WP:OCLOCATION]]
:Much of the [[Mohawk River]] is almost lined with former mill sites, including the stretch through [[Saratoga County, New York|Saratoga County]], so there may be growth potential here. But we don't categorize any other US mills by county, these mills are defined by river not county, and the expanded category could pull a number of articles from [[:Category:Textile mills in the United States]] including [[Globe Woolen Company Mills]], [[Harmony Mills]], [[West Brothers Knitting Company]] and [[Wild's Mill Complex]]. - [[User:RevelationDirect|RevelationDirect]] ([[User talk:RevelationDirect|talk]]) 02:28, 2 February 2019 (UTC)
*'''Support''' -- The present category is too specific. If they are all water-powered, the next split would probably be by river catchment, of we need to split. [[User:Peterkingiron|Peterkingiron]] ([[User talk:Peterkingiron|talk]]) 13:23, 9 February 2019 (UTC)
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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's [[Help:Using talk pages|talk page]] or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>
==== Category:Lists of fictional gangs ====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's [[Help:Using talk pages|talk page]] or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''
:''The result of the discussion was:'' <!-- Template:Cfd top --> '''delete''' <small>([[Wikipedia:Non-admin closure|non-admin closure]])</small>. [[User:Marcocapelle|Marcocapelle]] ([[User talk:Marcocapelle|talk]]) 06:54, 10 February 2019 (UTC)
:* '''Propose Deleting''' [[:Category:Lists of fictional gangs]]
:'''Nominator's rationale:''' Per [[WP:NARROWCAT]] and [[WP:SMALLCAT]]
: We have '''one''' list article for fictional gangs unsurprisingly named [[List of fictional gangs]] and that's the only thing in this narrow category. That article is already well categorized under [[:Category:Fictional gangs]], [[:Category:Lists of fictional organizations]] and [[:Category:Lists of gangs]] and the category has limited room for growth. - [[User:RevelationDirect|RevelationDirect]] ([[User talk:RevelationDirect|talk]]) 02:26, 2 February 2019 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per nom. [[User:Brandmeister|Brandmeister]]<sup>[[User talk:Brandmeister|talk]]</sup> 18:07, 7 February 2019 (UTC)
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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's [[Help:Using talk pages|talk page]] or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>
==== Category:Male guitarists ====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's [[Help:Using talk pages|talk page]] or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''
:''The result of the discussion was:'' <!-- Template:Cfd top --> '''keep'''. There is no support for deleting these specific categories. The more general issue of occupation-based categories split by genders is beyond the scope of this single CfD, but an RfC about their usefulness may be in order. Regardless, there is consensus to keep these categories. <small>[[Wikipedia:NACD|(non-admin closure)]]</small> [[User:DannyS712|DannyS712]] ([[User talk:DannyS712|talk]]) 00:53, 10 February 2019 (UTC)
:* '''Propose deleting''' {{lc|Male guitarists}}<br />
:* '''Propose deleting''' {{lc|American male guitarists}}<br />
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*'''Keep''', music artists are often split by gender and discussed in that context. It's useful for encyclopedic, specifically historical and research purposes. [[User:Brandmeister|Brandmeister]]<sup>[[User talk:Brandmeister|talk]]</sup> 20:28, 2 February 2019 (UTC)
<!-- Please add the newest nominations to the top -->
*'''Keep''' So I what I have to write? [[User:Lucifero4]]
* Presumably ''just'' deleting guitarists by gender does not make too much sense. However, I really wonder why we would distinguish musicians by gender at all, except we should of course distinguish singers as (mezzo-)sopranos, tenors, baritones, basses, which usually coincides with gender. [[User:Marcocapelle|Marcocapelle]] ([[User talk:Marcocapelle|talk]]) 18:05, 5 February 2019 (UTC)
**Distinguishing is useful in some encyclopedic fields, particularly history, [[music history]], [[gender studies]] and [[cultural anthropology]]. For Wikipedia which, as a general reference work, combines these fields it's equally useful. [[User:Brandmeister|Brandmeister]]<sup>[[User talk:Brandmeister|talk]]</sup> 17:34, 6 February 2019 (UTC)
*** On the other hand we also have [[WP:EGRS]] which - translated to this case - says that we shouldn't categorize by gender unless the intersection by gender is a notable topic in its own right. [[User:Marcocapelle|Marcocapelle]] ([[User talk:Marcocapelle|talk]]) 22:07, 6 February 2019 (UTC)
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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's [[Help:Using talk pages|talk page]] or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>
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