Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2019 January 12: Difference between revisions
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==== Category:Israeli revolutionaries ====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's [[Help:Using talk pages|talk page]] or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''
:''The result of the discussion was:'' <!-- Template:Cfd top --> '''delete'''. Per {{U|John Pack Lambert}}, no merge is necessary. The rename suggestion of the target category is noted, but it would need its own nomination, as that category wasn't nominated. ~ [[User:BU Rob13|<b>Rob</b><small><sub>13</sub></small>]]<sup style="margin-left:-1.0ex;">[[User talk:BU Rob13|Talk]]</sup> 01:25, 7 March 2019 (UTC)
:* '''Propose merging''' [[:Category:Israeli revolutionaries]] to [[:Category:Jewish rebels]]
:'''Nominator's rationale:''' Only one entry - Menachem Begin. I'm not sure he'd be counted as a revolutionary, but even if he was, he and his associates were not Israelis when they were fighting, because it didnt exist then. [[User:Rathfelder|Rathfelder]] ([[User talk:Rathfelder|talk]]) 17:26, 12 January 2019 (UTC)
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* '''Rename to [[:Category:Jewish rebels in Mandatory Palestine]]''' or something similar. If the scope is Mandatory Palestine, we need to make this clear, not to include any Jew who has been a rebel or a revolutionary anywhere any time, such as Trotsky, the Maccabees and [[:fr:Jacob Pereira|Jacob Pereira]]. [[User:Place Clichy|Place Clichy]] ([[User talk:Place Clichy|talk]]) 20:50, 22 January 2019 (UTC)
:* Note that the one article in this category is already in [[:Category:Irgun members]]. [[User:Marcocapelle|Marcocapelle]] ([[User talk:Marcocapelle|talk]]) 07:24, 27 January 2019 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' the one article is already in a subcategory of the target.[[User:Johnpacklambert|John Pack Lambert]] ([[User talk:Johnpacklambert|talk]]) 20:07, 6 February 2019 (UTC)
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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's [[Help:Using talk pages|talk page]] or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>
==== Category:Elections not won by the popular vote winner ====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's [[Help:Using talk pages|talk page]] or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''
:''The result of the discussion was:'' <!-- Template:Cfd top --> '''delete'''. — [[User:JJMC89|JJMC89]] <small>([[User talk:JJMC89|T]]'''·'''[[Special:Contributions/JJMC89|C]])</small> 23:39, 18 February 2019 (UTC)
:* '''Propose deleting''' {{lc|Elections not won by the popular vote winner}}<br />
:** '''Propose deleting''' {{lc|Elections in Australia not won by the popular vote winner}}<br />
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::I also found the category useful but since everyone else disagreed I considered it better to delete. You are welcome to try to come up with a replacement that isn't ambiguous.--[[Special:Contributions/Obi2canibe|Obi2canibe]] ([[User talk:Obi2canibe|talk)]] 18:05, 20 January 2019 (UTC)
* '''Delete'''. These categories would imply that ''the popular vote winner'' is clear without a doubt for these elections, however this can, in fact, never be the case as it is open to many interpretations (e.g. plurality vs. majority). The only way to break this ambiguity would be for an official election authority to declare who the ''popular vote winner'' is, but that cannot be the case in most circumstances, precisely because they are in the business or declaring the actual winner. Also, the word ''not'' in a category title is usually a clue for problems coming, a bit like the word ''and''. [[User:Place Clichy|Place Clichy]] ([[User talk:Place Clichy|talk]]) 20:50, 22 January 2019 (UTC)
* '''Delete'''. Yes, this is a thing that happens sometimes, as an accidental or intentional byproduct of how electoral systems are actually organized — but it's not a [[WP:DEFINING|defining]] characteristic of the elections for the purposes of ''categorizing'' them, because the popular vote isn't necessarily always even ''intended'' to be the controlling factor in elections in the first place. List articles might be acceptable, but it's not a useful point of ''categorization''. [[User:Bearcat|Bearcat]] ([[User talk:Bearcat|talk]]) 17:46, 27 January 2019 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' in the US case which I understand, the problem is that before the US Civil War (1861-1865) South Carolina never had a popular vote, its electors were chosen by the state legislature. 1876 has the issue of major fraud and voter intimadation by the KKK which makes it next to impossible to say that anyone was a legitimate winner. In 1824 South Carolina was not the only state that lacked a popular vote, so talking about who won that popular vote really does not make sense. The nominations processes it makes even less sense.[[User:Johnpacklambert|John Pack Lambert]] ([[User talk:Johnpacklambert|talk]]) 20:10, 6 February 2019 (UTC)
*'''Delete'''. Too vague and subjective to be of any value as a category. [[User:Drdpw|Drdpw]] ([[User talk:Drdpw|talk]]) 01:58, 12 February 2019 (UTC)
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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's [[Help:Using talk pages|talk page]] or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>
==== Bridges by city in Ukraine ====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's [[Help:Using talk pages|talk page]] or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''
:''The result of the discussion was:'' <!-- Template:Cfd top --> '''keep'''. <small>[[Wikipedia:NACD|(non-admin closure)]]</small> [[User:B dash|B dash]] ([[User talk:B dash|talk]]) 03:21, 21 April 2019 (UTC)
:* '''Propose merging''' [[:Category:Bridges in Dnipro]] to [[:Category:Buildings and structures in Dnipro]]
:* '''Propose merging''' [[:Category:Railway bridges in Dnipro]] to [[:Category:Railway bridges in Ukraine]] and [[:Category:Rail infrastructure in Dnipro]]
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:::::@[[User:Marcocapelle|Marcocapelle]]: For me, the difference is that in these cases we have the data to see that expansion is readily possible. That's a big difference from the flurry of [[:Category:People from some tiny and declining town in Wyoming]] which William is so good at tackling.
:::::And I agree with {{yo|Dexdor|p=}} that it wasn't a good idea to create these categories just yet. But now that they are here, and since a degree of easy expansion is evidently posisble, why delete? Better to be eventualist about it. --[[User:BrownHairedGirl|<span style="color:#663200;">Brown</span>HairedGirl]] <small>[[User talk:BrownHairedGirl|(talk)]] • ([[Special:Contributions/BrownHairedGirl|contribs]])</small> 08:40, 15 January 2019 (UTC)
* '''Procedural comment''', request for closure of the discussion posted on the [[Wikipedia:Administrators%27_noticeboard/Requests_for_closure#Deletion_discussions|administrators noticeboard]]. [[User:Marcocapelle|Marcocapelle]] ([[User talk:Marcocapelle|talk]]) 22:42, 12 March 2019 (UTC)
*'''Keep''' [[:Category:Bridges in Dnipro]] as it has a list plus 3 articles (currently in sub-cats). '''Manually merge''' the others to all relevant parents, as [[WP:SOFTDELETE]] on the grounds that they are too small to be useful at the moment. This would be no bar to re-creating them if a few more categories are created. – [[User:Fayenatic london|Fayenatic]] [[User talk:Fayenatic london|'''<span style="color: #FF0000;">L</span>'''ondon]] 11:58, 13 March 2019 (UTC)
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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's [[Help:Using talk pages|talk page]] or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>
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[[File:Symbol move vote.svg|16px|link=|alt=]] '''Relisted''', see [[Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2019 March 9%23Buildings and structures by city]]<!-- Template:Cfd relisted -->
==== Category:Recreational sublabial drugs ====
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==== Architecture by country ====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's [[Help:Using talk pages|talk page]] or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''
:''The result of the discussion was:'' <!-- Template:Cfd top --> '''Rename per revised proposal'''. [[User:Timrollpickering|Timrollpickering]] ([[User talk:Timrollpickering|Talk]]) 11:37, 4 March 2019 (UTC)
'''Propose renaming:'''
* [[:Category:Albanian architecture]] to [[:Category:Architecture of Albania]]
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*'''Comment:''' I previously mentioned at the [[Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Architecture#Architecture by country categories|Architecture WikiProject talk page]] that the specific example that prompted my concern was how to categorise [[:Category:Chinese architecture in Thailand]]. Having [[:Category:Chinese architecture]] and [[:Category:Architecture of Thailand]] would solve the problem. I'm reconsidering, though, whether the distinction is necessary. Perhaps we could treat [[:Category:Architecture of China]] as covering both architecture geographically located in China and of a style originating in China. (The distinction would be needed if the proposal was to split between Chinese architecture and Architecture ''in'' China, but the proposal here uses the preposition ''of'', which could mean both.) This would best reflect how the categories are currently used, and help avoid the need to manually clean-up the whole tree. It's not "clean" in terms of categorisation, though, and doesn't address the opposition from the previous discussion. --[[User:Paul 012|Paul_012]] ([[User talk:Paul 012|talk]]) 19:16, 13 January 2019 (UTC)
*'''Support''' moving ''Fooian Architecture'' to ''Architecture of Foo.'' {{re|Paul 012}} Yes, I agree completely with the hybrid meaning of "of" in "Architecture '''of''' Foo", which is what you've proposed all along, and also what was proposed in 2010. And, indeed, these very points we're discussing were discussed then as well. Re-reading that thread just now, I really don't see any serious opposition to what you are proposing. The oppose !votes in the 2010 thread seem to oppose "Architecture '''in''' Foo" (they use the word "in" in their oppose !vote comments), not Architecture '''of''' Foo. Because "of" can mean "in" or "from", it's the right choice of word. And, it follows the formats of the article titles. Frankly I disagree with that 2010 close as being no consensus. Is it too late to delrev? :-D On the basis of this, I support the proposal. [[User:Levivich|Levivich]] ([[User talk:Levivich|talk]]) 00:33, 15 January 2019 (UTC)
*'''Support''' moving as proposed by original poster. '''''Comment:''''' Architecture belongs to a '''"style", "period" or "movement"''' not nations and states, not even to any of the ethno-religious groups. Therefor, I don't exactly understand why is this even a problem, as academia recognized this kind of differentiation since time immemorial ? However, one should be careful in moving every and all of the categories for two reasons: first, because sometimes styles are grouped and than named upon some social and/or political entity, not just movement, etc - "Ottoman", "Moorish", "Austria-Hungarian", "Persian", "Mughal", etc.; and second, although it is a true that, for example, "Bosnia and Herzegovina architecture" actually doesn't exists as a distinct style, we can still say that "Architecture of Bosnia and Herzegovina" include "Ottoman", "Austria-Hungarian", "Modern" and "Brutalist-Socialist", etc., and than be careful to understand that it also include "Bosnian traditional architecture", "Herzegovinian traditional architecture", "Dalmatian traditional architecture" and even "Illyrian traditional architecture", all of which don't belong to any artistic school or movement but are very distinct "vernacular architecture" still in use today, and more importantly for this issue, still nameed upon ethno-religious and/or geographical label. The "top" category should be "Architecture of ...nation/state..." and not "...nation/state... architecture". --[[User:Santasa99|<span style="color:maroon; text-shadow:#666362 0.2em 0.2em 0.4em;">'''౪ Santa ౪'''</span>]][[User talk:Santasa99|<span style="color:navy; text-shadow:#666362 0.2em 0.2em 0.4em;"><sup>'''''99°'''''</sup></span>]] 13:30, 12 February 2019 (UTC)
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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's [[Help:Using talk pages|talk page]] or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>
====Category:Georgian opera singers====
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==== Category:Portuguese-language Brazilian telenovelas ====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's [[Help:Using talk pages|talk page]] or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''
:''The result of the discussion was:'' '''merge''' to [[:Category:Brazilian telenovelas]]. --[[User:BrownHairedGirl|<span style="color:#663200;">Brown</span>HairedGirl]] <small>[[User talk:BrownHairedGirl|(talk)]] • ([[Special:Contributions/BrownHairedGirl|contribs]])</small> 02:26, 20 February 2019 (UTC)<!-- Template:Cfd top -->
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:* '''Propose deleting''' {{lc|Portuguese-language Brazilian telenovelas}}<br />
:'''Nominator's rationale:''' Redundant category; all Brazilian telenovelas are in Portuguese. [[User:Mvcg66b3r|Mvcg66b3r]] ([[User talk:Mvcg66b3r|talk]]) 01:54, 12 January 2019 (UTC)
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* '''Merge''' to [[:Category:Brazilian telenovelas]] (a subcat of [[:Category:Portuguese-language telenovelas]]) per Marcocapelle. [[User:Oculi|Oculi]] ([[User talk:Oculi|talk]]) 15:52, 13 January 2019 (UTC)
* '''Merge'''. [[:Category:Brazilian telenovelas]] is currently a subcategory of [[:Category:Portuguese-language telenovelas]], so it's a no-brainer. [[User:Place Clichy|Place Clichy]] ([[User talk:Place Clichy|talk]]) 20:50, 22 January 2019 (UTC)
*'''Merge''' to national cat. Even if that cat was not currently in the Portuguese-language cat, nothing would prevent adding.[[User:Johnpacklambert|John Pack Lambert]] ([[User talk:Johnpacklambert|talk]]) 20:13, 6 February 2019 (UTC)
* '''Support Merge''' - Portuguese is the offical langauge of Brazil, so this category is highly redundant. Merging is the best option. [[User:Inter&anthro|Inter&anthro]] ([[User talk:Inter&anthro|talk]]) 14:23, 12 February 2019 (UTC)
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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's [[Help:Using talk pages|talk page]] or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>
==== Category:Geologists from Germany ====
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