Talk:National University of San Marcos: Difference between revisions

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Latest revision as of 14:20, 26 May 2024

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saint mark??? I dont think the name should be translated.

{{Connected contributor|User1=Marco Carrasco|U1-EH=yes|U1-declared = 1070668999|U1-otherlinks=|User2=Michael junior obregon pozo|U2-EH=yes}}

the most prestigious school in Lima, Peru? I highly doubt. (anon)

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==Questions==

{{WikiProject Higher education}}

*What is the (unnamed) fifth faculty founded in Spanish times? -- [[User:Jmabel|Jmabel]] | [[User talk:Jmabel|Talk]] 07:06, Mar 23, 2005 (UTC)

{{WikiProject Peru|importance=top|needs-infobox=}}

*When was "National" added to the name of the university? -- [[User:Jmabel|Jmabel]] | [[User talk:Jmabel|Talk]] 07:06, Mar 23, 2005 (UTC)

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*Is there a citation not connected to the university itself for the university being the most prestigious in Peru? -- [[User:Jmabel|Jmabel]] | [[User talk:Jmabel|Talk]] 07:06, Mar 23, 2005 (UTC)

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*"Fray Thomas of Saint Martin" seems unlikely English. My guess is that this is an effort to translate the untranslatable, and should be "Fray Tomás de San Martín". -- [[User:Jmabel|Jmabel]] | [[User talk:Jmabel|Talk]]

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{{Translated page|es|Universidad Nacional Mayor de San Marcos|version=46335739|insertversion=428789987|section=name}}

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==Base version==

It will be best to converge first towards a readable, correct, well-organized and relatively brief version. Then, taking that version as our basis,

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Glad to help, and I would make some changes on the page soon. [[User:Messhermit|Messhermit]] 21:02, 23 Mar 2005 (UTC)

== Latest updates ==

I am being impartial on the updates on this article regarding of the university in which i study.

*The information belonging to the number of faculties and each academic group it deserves to be mentioned, as same as it is on articles from the following universities.

**[[National Taiwan University]]

**[[Jagiellonian University]]

**[[Warsaw University of Technology]]

Among others.[[User:HappyApple|HappyApple]] 03:12, 24 Mar 2005 (UTC)

*I tend to agree with HappyApple here. Most of the more comprehensive articles about colleges and universities list the faculties/departments. -- [[User:Jmabel|Jmabel]] | [[User talk:Jmabel|Talk]] 05:56, Mar 24, 2005 (UTC)

*I agree that a list of faculties would be noteworthy. I am still not sure that a listing of departments is necessary, though, of course, it is perfectly harmless. In Peruvian usage, the word "facultad" is closer to "department" than to "faculty". [[User:Hasdrubal|Hasdrubal]] 18:37, 24 Mar 2005 (UTC)

Oh, and regarding "strongest", "finest", etc.; the current wording ("academically prominent") is fine and probably should stay. Of course, these are just

relative terms.

Just to give outsiders an idea: in science x (where x will not be mentioned so as not to ruffle more feathers than are already ruffled), no

university in Peru can be called a research centre; however,

(a) San Marcos, la Catolica and la UNI all have some talented people who have published a couple of papers in recognized international journals;

(b) they have one reasonable research library on the subject, in common, at least as far as books are concerned; obvious financial constraints limit

them when it comes to journals;

(c) they try to keep up links with researchers abroad, and to place their better BA's in graduate schools elsewhere (as there are no real graduate

schools in the subject in Peru, and there couldn't be at the present).

The newer private universities make a fair amount of income "teaching" x to the cognitively impaired children of financially gifted parents, but are

not really serious at all about research in the matter, and would probably not recognize it if it bit them.

In general, among the universities with a wide range of departments in the sciences, San Marcos, la Catolica and la UNI are each an earnest attempt

at what people elsewhere would call a research university. As I said, there are financial constraints.

All of the above is very POV, of course - this is a talk page. No offense is meant to specialized institutions (e.g., la Agraria) for which x falls

outside the natural radius of interest, or, least of all, to the three universities praised above. [[User:Hasdrubal|Hasdrubal]] 18:49, 24 Mar 2005 (UTC)

:The UNMSM is recognise as one of the best universities on Lima. Medicine and Law are two of its most prominents colleges (even though there is a extrange campaing to give the "San Martín" this category). I don't think that any peruvian (or at least the people on Lima) need a citation to known this. About Private Universities, well, Its relevant to the page, so no further disscussion is needed. [[User:Messhermit|Messhermit]] 20:15, 24 Mar 2005 (UTC)

Dear Messhermit -

as you can tell from the above, I am in complete agreement. I don't think there is anybody here who doubts that San Marcos is one of the best

three or four in Peru in just about any given specialty. [[User:Hasdrubal|Hasdrubal]] 21:54, 24 Mar 2005 (UTC)

... anybody, that is, except for that silly anonymous person who wrote the first remark. [[User:Hasdrubal|Hasdrubal]] 21:55, 24 Mar 2005 (UTC)

::

Following changes:

*Added Copyright sign to university name.

*Added Motto to University table.

Copyright sign was added becase seal is already registered and its part of intellectual property of the university.

Motto is different then Latin name, However in the beginning the latin name was the official motto, nowadays it's different. [[User:HappyApple|HappyApple]] 22:06, 24 Mar 2005 (UTC)

:The use of a copyright symbol is a claim on the part of a copyright holder that it holds a copyright on a given item. There is no reason or need for us, as non-copyright holders, to participate in this particular game. -- [[User:Viajero|Viajero]] 23:05, 24 Mar 2005 (UTC)

== Article protection ==

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Lets work for San Marcos, please? the oldest University of South America doesn't deserve this stub. [[User:Messhermit|Messhermit]] 02:32, 28 Mar 2005 (UTC)

:From [[Wikipedia:Village_pump_(policy)/Archive F#Voting]]:

::'''''Decision''': After 3 days of voting, the majority has voted in favor of the university's original name and against the anglicized version. Thus, this is the only way the university should be called on wikipedia. --Tuomas hello 00:46, Mar 27, 2005 (UTC)''

:Wikipedia is based on an elaborate structure of agreed-upon conventions for the sake of unity and consistency. Inevitably some people disagree with them, even I oppose a few, but we have to respect the communal decision-making process, as imperfect as it may be. We can't have editors unilaterally insisting on their own way of doing things. Wikipedia may be a "free" encyclopedia, but with that freedom comes a certain responsibility, and that is to respect its fundamental collaborative spirit of the project. In other words, Wikipedia is "free" in the sense that ''anyone'' may contribute, but it is not free in the sense that a user is at libety to contribute ''anything''; contributions, no matter how insignificant, must adhere to our editorial standards. The sooner HappyApple learns to appreciate this, the better. -- [[User:Viajero|Viajero]] 10:31, 28 Mar 2005 (UTC)

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:Clean, yes; brief, no. It is perfectly normal for an article to start with some short, highly readable sections, then go into whatever level of detail further down the page. -- [[User:Jmabel|Jmabel]] | [[User talk:Jmabel|Talk]] 21:01, Mar 28, 2005 (UTC)

My main point is that the process of going from a first draft to an agreed-upon first stable version may involve deletions. [[User:Hasdrubal|Hasdrubal]] 22:53, 28 Mar 2005 (UTC)

== For later... ==

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The entire second paragraph of the "History" section is written in poor English. That should be fixed. Also - the "Convent of Del Rosario" should be

"Convento del Rosario"; it is redundant and ugly to have "of" and "Del" following each other ("Convent of of the Rosary"). [[User:Hasdrubal|Hasdrubal]] 18:17, 28 Mar 2005 (UTC)

== Unprotect ==

I've unprotected the article. Thanks. [[User:Fuzheado|Fuzheado]] | [[User talk:Fuzheado|Talk]] 00:07, 3 Apr 2005 (UTC)

== Law/Jurisprudence ==

Do I understand from a recent edit that "Law" and "Jurisprudence" are two different departments? Really? What are these respectively called in Spanish as departments at this university? I would expect a "facultad de Jurisprudencia" to be precisely a faculty of law. -- [[User:Jmabel|Jmabel]] | [[User talk:Jmabel|Talk]] July 3, 2005 23:32 (UTC)

::[[Laws]] and [[Jurisprudence]] are not the same, hence there were two different faculties on San Marcos.

::The [[Faculty (university)|Faculty]] of Law and Jurisprudence were merged later in the mid [[20th century]], nowadays there is not a "Faculty of Jurisprudence", and the official name for that department is ''Facultad de Derecho y Ciencias Politicas".[[User:HappyApple|HappyApple]] 4 July 2005 03:29 (UTC)

::: Clearly the words "laws" and "jurisprudence" are not identical ''words'' but normally they do refere to the identical academic curriculum. (1) You still haven't answered my question as to what the two faculties were called, respectively, in Spanish. (2) You haven't given any clue what the difference was between the curricula of the two faculties. -- [[User:Jmabel|Jmabel]] | [[User talk:Jmabel|Talk]] July 4, 2005 17:13 (UTC)

::::The spanish name for each one were ''Facultad de Derecho'', ''Facultad de Jurisprudencia''. The difference between the curricula were study of Philosophy, [[legal history]], [[hermeneutics]] and [[historiography]] for the Faculty of Jurisprudence.[[User:HappyApple|HappyApple]] 5 July 2005 01:18 (UTC)

== Comment ==

I would like to add one more comment to user:Graña 'n' Montero's; this article has a lot of details that should be deleted (not even the [[Harvard University|Harvard]] article has so many intricate details). [[Special:Contributions/2001:1388:1640:2D5:189C:FAB9:9685:628D|2001:1388:1640:2D5:189C:FAB9:9685:628D]] ([[User talk:2001:1388:1640:2D5:189C:FAB9:9685:628D|talk]]) 00:36, 26 May 2024 (UTC)