Wikipedia:Votes for deletion/archive May 2004: Difference between revisions

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Latest revision as of 20:07, 14 October 2024

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[[de:Wikipedia:Seiten, die gelöscht werden sollten]]

[[es:Wikipedia:Páginas para borrar]]

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[[ja:Wikipedia:削除依頼]]

[[nl:Wikipedia:Te verwijderen pagina's]]

[[simple:Votes_for_deletion]]

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<big>'''PleaseThis read andpage understandcontains the page history of [[Wikipedia:DeletionVotes policy|Wikipediafor deletion policy]] beforefrom editing22:22, this15 page'''</big>May 2002 (UTC) to 06:24, 28 May 2004 (UTC).

<i><b>This is an archived copy of VfD. Please see [[Wikipedia:Votes for deletion]] for the current active version.</b></i>

VFD subpages: [[Wikipedia:Votes for deletion/copyvio|copyright violations]] -- [[Wikipedia:Votes for deletion/foreign language|foreign language]] -- [[wikipedia:images for deletion|images]]

<div style="float:right;border-style:dashed;border-color:blue;border-width:1px;text-align:center;padding:2px;">

'''[[Wikipedia:Deletion guidelines for administrators|Deletion guidelines for administrators]]''' -- [[Wikipedia:Deletion log|deletion log]] -- [[Wikipedia:Archived delete debates|archived delete debates]] -- [[Wikipedia:Votes for undeletion|undeletion]] -- [[Wikipedia:Personal subpages to be deleted|personal subpages]] -- [[Wikipedia:Blankpages|blankpages]] -- [[Wikipedia:Shortpages|shortpages]] -- [[Wikipedia:Things to be moved to Wiktionary|move to Wiktionary]] -- [[Wikipedia:Bad jokes and other deleted nonsense|Bad jokes]] -- [[Wikipedia:Pages needing attention|pages needing attention]] -- [[m:deletionism]] -- [[m:deletion management redesign]] -- [[Wikipedia:Cleanup]]

[[Wikipedia:WP|Shorthand:]]<br>

[[WP:VFD]]

</div>

{{VfD_header}}

[[Wikipedia:Votes for deletion#May 28|28^th]]

- [[Wikipedia:Votes for deletion#May 27|27^th]]

- [[Wikipedia:Votes for deletion#May 26|26^th]]

- [[Wikipedia:Votes for deletion#May 25|25^th]]

- [[Wikipedia:Votes for deletion#May 24|24^th]]

- [[Wikipedia:Votes for deletion#May 23|23^rd]] <!--

It appears the self-reference i added is not needed after all;

i or someone can convert to the shorter form by tomorrow night, and save a few hundred bytes, if indeed no problem. -->

- ''[[/Old#May 22|22^nd]]''

- ''[[Wikipedia:Votes for deletion/Old#May 22|22^nd]]''

- ''[[Wikipedia:Votes for deletion/Old#May 21|21^st]]''

- ''[[Wikipedia:Votes for deletion/Old#May 20|20^th]]''

- ''[[Wikipedia:Votes for deletion/Old#May 19|19^th]]''

- ''[[Wikipedia:Votes for deletion/Old#May 18|18^th]]''

- ''[[Wikipedia:Votes for deletion/Old#May 17|17^th]]''

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- ''[[Wikipedia:Votes for deletion/Old#April 1|1^th]]'' -->

{{tl|VfD_frontmatter}}

== Decisions in progress ==

Note that listings more than five days old should now be moved to [[Wikipedia:Votes for deletion/Old]].

=== May 23 ===

====[[Kimberley Katherine Smith]]====

[http://en.wikipedia.org/w/wiki.phtml?title=MediaWiki:VfD-KKSmith&action=edit add to this deletion debate]

{{tl|VfD-KKSmith}}

====[[Hanyô]], [[Hanyou]], [[Hanyo]], [[Hanyoo]]====

[http://en.wikipedia.org/w/wiki.phtml?title=MediaWiki:VfD-Hanyo&action=edit add to this deletion debate]

{{tl|VfD-Hanyo}}

====[[Circumfetishism]]====

== October 28 ==

'''-->>>>>> [[MediaWiki:VfD-Circumfetishism|Deletion debate]]'''

====[[Glad]]====

*[[Hard new]]. Besides a wrong title, the article is hardly, dare I say it, encyclopedic. [[User:RickK|RickK]]

[http://en.wikipedia.org/w/wiki.phtml?title=MediaWiki:VfD-Glad&action=edit add to this deletion debate]

**If "Hard New" [sic] is deleted, "Soft News" (just created) should be deleted as well. However, my vote is to keep them both, fix the obvious error on the first, and label them as stubs. The terms are certainly relevant, and are used both in and by the media. No, I am not the author of either of the entries.

***Well, I worked on soft news, and I don't want the article deleted. There's a lot that can be said about both topics, and they certainly belong in an encyclopedia. Maybe if we all work together we can fix up the language. Oh yeah, and Hard "New" should definitely have the title changed. [[User:Macarenaman|Macarenaman]] 06:57, 28 Oct 2003 (UTC)

** I've moved Hard new to [[Hard news]], and both should stay if they can be elaborated upon a bit more. [[User:Fuzheado|Fuzheado]] 07:03, 28 Oct 2003 (UTC)

{{tl|VfD-Glad}}

*[[Military of Niue]] - there's not much more to be said here. All the relevant info has been made into a section of the main [[Niue]] article. --[[User:Jiang|Jiang]] 05:54, 28 Oct 2003 (UTC)

** I've turned this into a redirect. Keep, for consistency with [[Military of France]] etc. [[User:Onebyone|Onebyone]] 11:06, 28 Oct 2003 (UTC)

***How is it "consistent with Military of France"? France has a military and Niue doesn't. It's like having an article called [[Alps of Saudi Arabia]] and then going to the [[Saudi Arabia]] article to find that there are no alps. The redirect is pointless and misleading. I still think it should be deleted. --[[User:Jiang|Jiang]]

** Consistent in the sense that the countries then have articles following the same conventions. If the page simply isn't there, then anyone trying to follow the pattern has no way of knowing whether the military of Niue doesn't exist, or merely doesn't have an article yet. If the link points to something which explains the military situation in Niue (especially the bit about NZ), then they get some information. My redirect link points to the relevant section of the Niue article, but apparently the automatic redirect code takes you to the top of [[Niue]] instead. That's a pain, and if it's considered harmful then I vote "keep the article as an article, not a redirect". Your alp analogy is broken, because very few (if any) countries have an "alps of X" page. Closer would be [[Mountains of Saudi Arabia]], of which there are several. In any case it's moot since there is no [[Mountains of France]]. [[User:Onebyone|Onebyone]] 00:14, 29 Oct 2003 (UTC)

***Niue is not an independent state. It is considered a dependency of New Zealand. There is no such standard to keep. It is unlikely anyone would be looking for the military of a subnational entity. As a standard, we should delete the military articles of all dependencies. --[[User:Jiang|Jiang]]

**This is factually inaccurate. The government of Niue is sovereign. (Well, technically Queen Elizabeth II is sovereign, but the point is that the New Zealand government is not sovereign). So while Niue is not fully independent, it is a sovereign nation. [[User:Onebyone|Onebyone]] 10:07, 29 Oct 2003 (UTC)

***Queen Elizabeth II is sovereign in her right as "Queen of New Zealand", not as "Queen of Niue". Niue is not independent. It just has a right to become independent if it requested. --[[User:Jiang|Jiang]]

**Delete. What's the point in having the redirect, as currently there are no articles which link to it except for [[Votes for deletion]] and [[Niue/Military]] which doesn't need to exist either. Seems stupid to me. [[User:Dgrant|dave]] 06:21, 29 Oct 2003 (UTC)

====[[Kyb IE GetEmAll]]====

*[[User:Invictus]] is no longer a registered user; content was originally at [[Talk:Invictus]] (apparently from the UseModWiki days) --[[User:Jiang|Jiang]] 06:01, 28 Oct 2003 (UTC)

[http://en.wikipedia.org/w/wiki.phtml?title=MediaWiki:VfD-Kyb_IE_GetEmAll&action=edit add to this deletion debate]

{{tl|VfD-Kyb_IE_GetEmAll}}

* [[Anamorphic gear]] is sort of confusing, and not real written. Plus, the contents are describing "involute profiles"; what does that have to do with "Anamorphic gears"? -- [[User:Khym Chanur|Khym Chanur]] 07:52, Oct 28, 2003 (UTC)

** Keep. It is missing a connection between the two, but I'd wait and see if someone can finish the article to a useful point - [[User:Marshman|Marshman]]

**Keep and rename. As a gear maker myself I agree the title is wrong for the text it needs changing to "Involute Gear" and the article could do with fleshing out a bit e.g. a french mathematician invented the curve in the 14-1700 ? but its application to gearing was not understood until the 18xx also there are other gear forms etc. The title seems to be refering to a particular gear in an anamorphic movie camera lens but the article is not. [[User:Archivist|Archivist]] 00:18, Oct 31, 2003 (UTC)

** This article is fine for an encyclopedia. And with all the [[Wikipedia:Why Wikipedia is not so great|complaints of 'geek priorities']], I'm sure there's someone here who knows enough about them to complete this article. [[User:Wiwaxia|Wiwaxia]] 02:04, 3 Nov 2003 (UTC)

====[[AberSeeSaw]]====

*[[Pseudo]] dictionary. [[User:DJ Clayworth|DJ Clayworth]] 17:51, 28 Oct 2003 (UTC)

[http://en.wikipedia.org/w/wiki.phtml?title=MediaWiki:VfD-AberSeeSaw&action=edit add to this deletion debate]

**Move to the Wiktionary. Delete here - [[User:Marshman|Marshman]] 17:19, 29 Oct 2003 (UTC)

**If someone understands the business about equations, perhaps more could be said here. If not, then move to Wiktionary. Was here in an earlier form. - [[User:Ihcoyc|Smerdis of Tlön]] 16:43, 30 Oct 2003 (UTC)

**I don't understand the enthusiasm to delete this. A ''lot'' of terms have ''pseudo-'' in the name, and so an explanation of the prefix, its history, how it's used, and examples, and maybe a list of pseudo- terms, would be very helpful. That seems like much more than a dictionary entry to me. -- [[User:VeryVerily|VV]] 06:33, 31 Oct 2003 (UTC)

**Lots of words have "non" in them, lots of words start with "re". These are not reason to keep them here, but exactly what Wiktionary is about. There is nothing mystical or special about "pseudo" other than lots of words have "pseudo" in them. Certainly not worth an article here. - [[User:Marshman|Marshman]] 17:00, 31 Oct 2003 (UTC)

***Yeah some suffixes are more trivial than others; I don't think even ''non-'' or ''re-'' would be totally unreasonable for entries, but ''pseudo-'', ''meta-'', ''crypto-'' seem very reasonable, having interesting histories and a variety of usages, some controversial (e.g., ''pseudoscience''). ''Pseudo-'' is also used productively all the time, which I think strengthens the case. Also, wouldn't it be nice to have a list of all the in-use ''pseudo''s? Well, my two cents. -- [[User:VeryVerily|VV]] 11:11, 2 Nov 2003 (UTC)

{{tl|VfD-AberSeeSaw}}

==October 29==

====[[Ben Wilson]]====

*[[Friendliness Theory]]. Only 40 Google hits. <s>Article doesn't really say anything.</s> [[User:Angela|Angela]] 00:00, Oct 29, 2003 (UTC)

[http://en.wikipedia.org/w/wiki.phtml?title=MediaWiki:VfD-BenWilson&action=edit add to this deletion debate]

** It would be more appropriate, in my opinion, to put a stub marker on it than to delete it. It seems to be a real theory in Singularity talk as well as Artificial intelligence. [[User:Xknight|Xknight]] 00:30, 29 Oct 2003 (UTC)

**Delete. Perhaps merge content into [[Technological singularity]] from which the author has linked the above page. The article as written is very poor and the sentence: ''Do not ask for a short definition. Even after you read CFAI it is very likely that you will only begin to understand Friendliness.'' should set off alarm bells for non-encyclopedic content. --[[User:Lexor|Lexor]] 00:35, 29 Oct 2003 (UTC)

** 40 hits is pretty good for a specialized topic. reconsider improving the definition. [[User:Waveguy|Waveguy]] 01:51, 29 Oct 2003 (UTC)

** Perhaps should be relabeled "Friendly artificial intelligence?" But even the seminal paper "Creating Friendly AI 1.0: The Analysis and Design of Benevolent Goal Architectures" doesn't label it Friendliness Theory. [[User:Fuzheado|Fuzheado]] 06:47, 29 Oct 2003 (UTC)

** With the later edits a sure 'keep' vote. [[User:Andre Engels|Andre Engels]] 11:58, 29 Oct 2003 (UTC)

** Content is improving, so deletion is probably not necessary, however I would suggest a rename as suggested by Fuzheado, as "Friendliness Theory" implies something more general about "friendliness" than it delivers. I think "Theory" is also a little grandiose given the speculative nature of the subject. --[[User:Lexor|Lexor]] 21:59, 29 Oct 2003 (UTC)

*** It seems that ''friendliness theory'' differs from ''friendly AI'' in the important respect that it is about the value of being friendly toward an AI, rather than about the AI itself being friendly. [[User:Waveguy|Waveguy]] 04:34, 30 Oct 2003 (UTC)

**Keep. Friendly AI is a specialized topic of research. [[User:At18|At18]] 21:14, 1 Nov 2003 (UTC)

{{tl|VfD-BenWilson}}

*[[Different-like]] - sounds like a nonsense term [[User:Dysprosia|Dysprosia]] 02:11, 29 Oct 2003 (UTC)

** Delete, nonsense. [[User:Fuzheado|Fuzheado]] 06:47, 29 Oct 2003 (UTC)

** Even if it were not nonsense, it would still be dictionary rather than encyclopedia information. [[User:Andre Engels|Andre Engels]] 11:58, 29 Oct 2003 (UTC)

** Delet. [[User:David Stapleton|David Stapleton]] 15:55, Oct 29, 2003 (UTC)

** Delete. Plus, this is the only page that links to it. &mdash;[[User:Frecklefoot|Frecklefoot]] 16:09, 29 Oct 2003 (UTC)

** This contributor has vandalized other pages, and this is not a serious contribution. Delete - [[User:Marshman|Marshman]] 17:26, 29 Oct 2003 (UTC)

====[[Metarmorphosis]]====

*[[Valencia, Venezuela]] is poorly written and hard to read; gah! -- [[User:Khym Chanur|Khym Chanur]] 02:34, Oct 29, 2003 (UTC)

[http://en.wikipedia.org/w/wiki.phtml?title=MediaWiki:VfD-Metarmorphosis&action=edit add to this deletion debate]

{{tl|VfD-Metarmorphosis}}

**Seems passable now; keep and improve. --[[User:Delirium|Delirium]] 04:45, Oct 29, 2003 (UTC)

**Keep. [[User:Onebyone|Onebyone]] 10:03, 29 Oct 2003 (UTC)

**With the new changes, definitely keep. [[User:Andre Engels|Andre Engels]] 11:58, 29 Oct 2003 (UTC)

**Keep. --[[User:Gboy|FallingInLoveWithPitoc]] 01:38, 2 Nov 2003 (UTC)

====[[Weston Lullingfields]]====

*[[Dora Menchaca]] - page on a sep11 victim reading "she was my mother's friend and still is." --[[User:Delirium|Delirium]] 04:43, Oct 29, 2003 (UTC)

[http://en.wikipedia.org/w/wiki.phtml?title=MediaWiki:VfD-WestonLullingfields&action=edit add to this deletion debate]

**Also [[Paul Innella]], which has been moved to the sep11 wiki. There's dozens of others still on Wikipedia as well. --[[User:Delirium|Delirium]] 04:44, Oct 29, 2003 (UTC)

***Not that it's necessarily relevant, but Paul has ''two'' entries on the sep11 wiki, [[sep11:Paul Innella]] and [[sep11:Paul W. Innella]]. The former is protected for some reason. -- [[User:VeryVerily|VV]] 07:40, 29 Oct 2003 (UTC)

**Axe it before I do so! [[User:Andre Engels|Andre Engels]] 11:58, 29 Oct 2003 (UTC)

{{tl|VfD-WestonLullingfields}}

*[[Military of Saint Pierre and Miquelon]]

**Delete, useless article. It has no military of its own, and the article says this. I propose to NOT have a re-direct to the Military of France. This would be mis-leading. People would want to click on the Military of Saint Pierre and Miquelon and then would subsequently be disapointed by following the re-direct and discovering that they have no military. This is a waste of a click, and a waste of bandwidth/time. [[User:Dgrant|dave]] 05:02, 29 Oct 2003 (UTC)

** Delete, agree. [[User:Fuzheado|Fuzheado]] 06:47, 29 Oct 2003 (UTC)

** Delete --[[User:Jiang|Jiang]]

** <s>Keep</s>. It's more of a waste of time (and more clicks) to find a broken link and start looking around for another source of information than it is to find a live link that answers the question. It is ''notable'' for a nation not to have a military. [[User:Onebyone|Onebyone]] 10:01, 29 Oct 2003 (UTC)

*** On second thoughts, since in this case the territory in question is not independent, I don't have any particular opinion, so I cancel my vote. [[User:Onebyone|Onebyone]] 10:12, 29 Oct 2003 (UTC)

** I have integrated the info from this page into the main article, recommend keep and use as a redirect.[[User:2toise|2toise]] 10:15, 29 Oct 2003 (UTC)

** Delete as a Redirect. If these small islands do not have a military, then why clutter the wiki with nonsense links that will show up in a search effort (I believe). If I'm wrong about the search, then nonsense redirects do not matter. Can someone clarify? - [[User:Marshman|Marshman]] 17:33, 29 Oct 2003 (UTC)

**Misleading redirects should be deleted. [[User:Angela|Angela]] 21:31, Oct 29, 2003 (UTC)

**Sigh. If this article isn't worth a redirect, then '''delete''' it. A lot of political entities around the world lack military power, the reason why should be explained in the body of the main article (e.g., Costa Rica). But to only state "This country has no military" is not worth an article. [[User:Llywrch|llywrch]] 01:41, 30 Oct 2003 (UTC)

** Agreed that 'This country has no military' is not worth an article, that's why I moved that statement into the military category of the main article, but why delete the redirect? Out of symetry, if nothing else, there is no harm in having it, and, if someone should enter "Military Saint Pierre and Miquelon" into Google, they will at least be directed to the page that tells them that this isn't one. Otherwise, someone could assume that there is simply no information about it.[[User:2toise|2toise]] 11:50, 1 Nov 2003 (UTC)

====[[College Road]]====

*[[Wherever you go, there you are]] - some POV philosophizing about the meaning of a saying, as well as a [[Richard Burton]] quote claimed as a variation on the saying that's actually saying something completely different. I was going to trim this down into a stub, but it would end up being a stub that just said "''Wherever you go, there you are'' is a folk saying.", because there's not much else NPOV you can say about how to interpret it. --[[User:Delirium|Delirium]] 11:19, Oct 29, 2003 (UTC)

[http://en.wikipedia.org/w/wiki.phtml?title=MediaWiki:VfD-CollegeRoad&action=edit add to this deletion debate]

**Delete. [[User:Andre Engels|Andre Engels]] 11:58, 29 Oct 2003 (UTC)

**Delete [[User:DJ Clayworth|DJ Clayworth]] 15:49, 29 Oct 2003 (UTC)

**Delete. [[User:David Stapleton|David Stapleton]] 15:52, Oct 29, 2003 (UTC)

**Delete. Text rambles around without saying anything - [[User:Marshman|Marshman]] 17:38, 29 Oct 2003 (UTC)

**How about [[List of aphorisms]] or [[List of folk sayings]]? Then we could move this and the cat skinning thing (see a few days above) there along with all those other &quot;clever&quot; sayings. It could even be multi-linguistic... surely every language has their own aphorisms that would be worth recording. --[[User:Dante Alighieri|Dante Alighieri]] 00:39, 31 Oct 2003 (UTC)

{{tl|VfD-CollegeRoad}}

*[[Theo de Raadt]]. Entire article text is "'''Theo de Raadt''', living in Calgary, Alberta, Canada, is the leader of the [[OpenBSD]] project." The [[OpenBSD]] project reads in part "OpenBSD, lead by Theo de Raadt, was originally derived ..." Is the fact that Theo lives Calgary enough to justify a separate article? [[User:David Stapleton|David Stapleton]] 16:14, Oct 29, 2003 (UTC)

** Delete. Lots of people live in Calgary - [[User:Marshman|Marshman]] 17:30, 29 Oct 2003 (UTC)

** Keep. Added some info. The article is kind of stubbish, but his name gets numerous Google hits. My guess is he's notable enough for an article. &mdash;[[User:Frecklefoot|Frecklefoot]] 17:43, 29 Oct 2003 (UTC)

** Keep. Theo De Raadt is a significant personality in the history of OpenBSD/NetBSD. Article needs help though. --[[User:Nohat|Nohat]] 19:42, 2003 Oct 29 (UTC)

** Keep, decent stub, just needs info. [[User:Dysprosia|Dysprosia]] 22:21, 29 Oct 2003 (UTC)

**Keep. Theo De Raadt is a well-known programmer & UNIX authority. [[User:Llywrch|llywrch]] 01:41, 30 Oct 2003 (UTC)

** Keep. Although this article is super-stubby, there is a lot that can be put in an article on Theo. [[User:Ckape|Ckape]] 04:11, 31 Oct 2003 (UTC)

** Keep. Noted ubergeek, and 47000 google hits. -- [[User:Finlay McWalter|Finlay McWalter]] 22:48, 1 Nov 2003 (UTC)

*** (full disclosure: I improved the stub a teensy bit. Still needs work. -- [[User:Finlay McWalter|Finlay McWalter]] 23:10, 1 Nov 2003 (UTC))

====[[Nutty Norman]]====

*[[Marina Gonzales]] - seems to be vanity page. Only education listed, but absolutely no achievements. No Google hits for name + birth year. [[User:Ahoerstemeier|andy]] 20:19, 29 Oct 2003 (UTC)

[http://en.wikipedia.org/w/wiki.phtml?title=MediaWiki:VfD-NuttyNorman&action=edit add to this deletion debate]

** Delete. Should also probably remove the name from the "Famous people from Canton" list on [[Canton, Ohio]]. &mdash;[[User:Frecklefoot|Frecklefoot]] 20:41, 29 Oct 2003 (UTC)

** Delete. [[User:David Stapleton|David Stapleton]] 22:35, Oct 29, 2003 (UTC)

** She "went on to the North Canton Middle School" . . . "only to follow up at North Canton's Hoover High School"! (Gasp!) Wow! Some adventurous life there! She really sounds as if she's accomplished some remarkable stuff. As for her exact claim to fame, we learn on [[1976]] that Marina Gonzales is a "hottie sweetheart". Oh. So ''that's'' how she got famous. [[User:Wiwaxia|Wiwaxia]] 04:35, 30 Oct 2003 (UTC)

** The magnificence of Ms. Gonzales' achievements leaves me flabbergasted and gaspingly speechless. (Nevertheless, I vote for deletion, as Wikipedia is just to small and mean for such a biography). [[User:Kosebamse|Kosebamse]] 16:34, 31 Oct 2003 (UTC)

** Delete. I removed the [[1976]] entry too. [[User:At18|At18]] 21:27, 1 Nov 2003 (UTC)

{{tl|VfD-NuttyNorman}}

*[[Comics]] - Orphan page. Its a redirect to a disambiguation page. I've relocated all links to the appropriate final destination. [[User:Skeetch|Skeetch]] 20:39, Oct 29, 2003 (UTC)

**Keep. There may be references to it made in the future. &mdash;[[User:Frecklefoot|Frecklefoot]]

====[[David Barker]]====

** Keep. Frequently used term. -- [[User:Oliver Pereira|Oliver P.]] 03:44, 30 Oct 2003 (UTC)

[http://en.wikipedia.org/w/wiki.phtml?title=MediaWiki:VfD-DavidBarker&action=edit add to this deletion debate]

**Why not just redirect to [[Comic strip]]? [[User:RickK|RickK]] 04:17, 30 Oct 2003 (UTC)

{{tl|VfD-DavidBarker}}

*[[Brad Walsh]] & [[Brad Walsh (musician)]] - This was apparently added by [[Easter Bradford]] himself, and it seems that the Easter Bradford page is worthy enough to have an article (at least from the discussion there). They both seem kind of unencyclopedic to me, though, so I thought I'd mention it here. Also, [[Consummate Professional Relationship Destruction Machine]]. [[User:Adam Bishop|Adam Bishop]] 20:56, 29 Oct 2003 (UTC)

** Easter Bradford says on [[Talk:Brad Walsh]], "I know for a fact that Mr. Walsh copied that text from his own page and posted it here." However, I think we need more than a person's own word that information about them is true. If none of this can be verified from published sources (and I can't find anything relevant using Google) then it can be deleted as [[Wikipedia:Verifiability|unverifiable]]. -- [[User:Oliver Pereira|Oliver P.]] 03:44, 30 Oct 2003 (UTC)

**Keep the page. I've added 3 other (?) Brad Walsh people to this article. The coverage of the lst , original, one seems excessive, though. [[User:JamesDay|JamesDay]] 16:40, 1 Nov 2003 (UTC)

*I tried to disambiguate the blasted thing....and created [[Brad Walsh (musician)]]....but i couldn't save it. delete both of them. [[User:Kingturtle|Kingturtle]] 06:57, 3 Nov 2003 (UTC)

====[[CheShA]]====

[http://en.wikipedia.org/w/wiki.phtml?title=MediaWiki:VfD-CheShA&action=edit add to this deletion debate]

{{tl|VfD-CheShA}}

''The debate on [[Prime Minister of the United States]] has been moved to [[Talk:Prime Minister of the United States/Delete]]. Please continue the debate there.''

====[[Alt.tv.simpsons]]====

[http://en.wikipedia.org/w/wiki.phtml?title=MediaWiki:VfD-Alt_tv_simpsons&action=edit add to this deletion debate]

{{tl|VfD-Alt_tv_simpsons}}

*[[Moll Flanders]] and [[A Journal of the Plague Year]] - both just a quote and a

link to Project Gutenberg. [[User:TwoOneTwo|TwoOneTwo]] 22:17, 29 Oct 2003 (UTC)

**Well, with '''seven''' pages linking to ''[[Moll Flanders]]'' this will happen again and again and again. We encourage newbies to write stubs, and then we want to delete rather than improve them. Keep. And write a few lines about the book, those of you who have recently read it. --[[User:KF|KF]] 19:21, 30 Oct 2003 (UTC)

*** If that's the case, we should stop encouraging it. If we encourage people to write something, and then find the product not worth keeping, it's an argument to stop the encouraging more than to stop the deletion. I vote for deletion. [[User:Andre Engels|Andre Engels]] 06:28, 31 Oct 2003 (UTC)

**This is what it says at [[Wikipedia:Contributing to Wikipedia]] (and there are several other passages with similar content directly linked to the "Welcome newcomers" section: "<u>If you like, you can enter just a paragraph or two of text for an entry. It's a start. Full-blown articles are not required. Adding any (accurate, helpful) information to Wikipedia is welcome!</u> Of course, if you can write more, that's all the better. See [[The perfect stub article]]." Nipping such an article in the bud is surely the best way to frighten off both newbies and hardened Wikipedians. I would have written a few lines about that bloody book myself but it just happens that I don't remember anything about it. Also, why pick on '''this''' article? What about, say, ''[[Ann Veronica]]'' (just a random example really)? I've said this several times before, and, astonishingly, I'm not yet tired of repeating it. --[[User:KF|KF]] 07:40, 31 Oct 2003 (UTC)

** Keep, they're both stubs. [[User:Onebyone|Onebyone]] 10:32, 31 Oct 2003 (UTC)

** As newcomer, I really feel that points made by KF need to be taken on board quickly if this project is to continue as an open one. I'm also thinking of discussions over the last few days re users who have left in despair. If you come across a stub by a newbie, why list it on this page? Would it not be more appropriate to discuss what needs to be/could be added with the author and then collaborate on a better article? Or maybe sometimes accept that a good paragraph is better than a bad essay? And if you read an article you do not understand on a subject you know nothing about, maybe the fault is not with the article and asking for its deletion is not a great idea? It just seems sometime like a smallish group of experienced users use VfD as a way of saying 'I don't like this, so it should go.' This is (or could be) a great place, but I feel it can only benefit from a shift to greater cooperation and less confrontation. Or am I missing something? [[User:Bmills|Bmills]] 12:18, 31 Oct 2003 (UTC)

** Those are not stubs. They are just quotes and links. The [[A Journal of the Plague Year]] page doesn't even tell me what A Journal of the Plague Year is. This is not useful and below the level of what is allowed, so the listing for deletion is completely appropriate in my opinion. [[User:Angela|Angela]] 12:25, Oct 31, 2003 (UTC)

** This is not a stub and unless someone makes it one, it should be deleted. [[User:Tiles|Tiles]] 02:20, 2 Nov 2003 (UTC)

====[[Dumbarton Harp F.C.]]====

==October 30==

[http://en.wikipedia.org/w/wiki.phtml?title=MediaWiki:VfD-DumbartonHarpFC&action=edit add to this deletion debate]

{{tl|VfD-DumbartonHarpFC}}

*[[Controls the attitude of the aircraft by relying on what can be seen out the window]] - what kind of title is that? --[[User:Wik|Wik]] 02:19, Oct 30, 2003 (UTC)

** as the wording of a web link, it's very good; Wiki is differnt to general good practice when wording links. [[User:Pigsonthewing|Andy Mabbett]] 12:20, 1 Nov 2003 (UTC)

**The contents of this page have been moved to [[Visual flight]], which makes sense for pilots and Wikipedians.:)

**Along with that ants thing, obviously a contender for the [[Wikipedia:Worst title award|Worst title award]]. [[User:Angela|Angela]] 02:24, Oct 30, 2003 (UTC)

**This too: [[Attitude of the aircraft]]. Someone needs to tell [[User:24.156.18.116]] what words are proper to [[wikify]]. -- [[User:Minesweeper|Minesweeper]] 02:50, Oct 30, 2003 (UTC)

**Ugh. The title alone makes it worth deleting. [[User:RickK|RickK]] 03:29, 30 Oct 2003 (UTC)

** Having a bad title is not by itself a reason for a page to be deleted. I've moved it to [[aircraft control]]. I have no opnion on the content, though; I'm just making the point that titles are easy to change. Now that [[Controls the attitude of the aircraft by relying on what can be seen out the window]] is a redirect with no history, I expect it can be deleted. -- [[User:Oliver Pereira|Oliver P.]] 03:56, 30 Oct 2003 (UTC)

** Boy what a nice welcome ! :/ I just found out about this site from an aviation discussion site, and thought that the whole concept was very cool, and I was excited too try to contribute. But after the "weclome" I'm receiving, i.e. my contributions being deleted and replaced by a "redirect", or people getting all upset about "naming conventions", instead of content, makes me think I might not waste my time here. The reason I "wikified" the longer phrases were so were for a couple of reasons. 1) In the first article, the author "threw out" the phrase "controlling the aircraft by looking out the window". Since the article was explaining what "Visual Flight Rules" means, it's a good bet that someone reading does not know what that means, and probably has no idea of how an aircraft is controlled just by "looking out the window". 2) When the "wikify" definition is being read by the user, it's nice to be able to read the heading/name to see what the definition is referring to.

*** Sorry if you think it was a rough welcome. I don't even have to read your long justification for the article. It's moot. What encyclopdia has titles that are 16 words long? It's not a heading. It's a sentence which describes something, like a definition. It should be in the body and you should put the thing it is describing as the heading. [[User:Dgrant|dave]] 08:52, 30 Oct 2003 (UTC)

** Changing that title to "aircraft control" is *not* the same thing, as there is a big difference between "aircraft control" under IFR or VFR. Perhaps "attitude flying" would be a better title, and might make everyone here happy.

** Putting a redirect from "Controls the attitude ..." back to the original article makes absolutely no sense ! The original article was "Visual Flight Rules", which gave a very summarized version of what VFR is all about. I added the link to expand on *how* an aircraft is controlled under VFR as opposed to IFR. The techiques are VERY different.

***Hopefully "Visual flight" will go nicely with "Instrument flight" and "Attitude flying" may be needed to give more details of that technique if it seems too large to be included in Visual flight. And yes, some Wikipedians are very intolerant of new pages, pages written by those using IP addresses or those not aware of Wikipedia conventions. It's not usually as bad as the rough handling you're received indicates. Really. BTW, are you on avsig? [[User:JamesDay|JamesDay]] 17:47, 30 Oct 2003 (UTC)

** I was going add explanations for what the different flight attitudes are, but I see that my original page has had all the links removed that I was going to add definitions for. I don't think I'll bother now.

*** Please consider keeping at it. Wikipedians are notoriously bad at dealing with works-in-progress on subjects which they don't know about. The trick is to keep plugging away - if someone removes a link to an article you haven't written yet, you can put it back once you've written the article, and no harm is done. They are correct that the long title above is no good, hopefully you will decide to stick around, and it won't take long to get a feel for what is expected. Note that the link text doesn't have to be the same as the title of the article - <nowiki>[[title|You can call me sir]]</nowiki> produces [[title|You can call me sir]]. [[User:Onebyone|Onebyone]] 11:08, 30 Oct 2003 (UTC)

** Delete. [[User:Dgrant|dave]] 08:52, 30 Oct 2003 (UTC)

**The page contents have been moved to [[Visual flight]]. The long title version can be deleted, keep Visual flight. Note for non-pilots: visual flight rules and how to fly visually are entirely different concepts. You can be doing one while not doing the other. [[User:JamesDay|JamesDay]] 17:34, 30 Oct 2003 (UTC)

**Shall we take this to [[Talk:Visual flight]]? [[User:DJ Clayworth|DJ Clayworth]] 16:17, 30 Oct 2003 (UTC)

====[[Sean Flowers]]====

* [[Independent Commission Against Corruption]] only states the year in which the Commission was founded, and nothing else. -- [[User:Khym Chanur|Khym Chanur]] 06:40, Oct 30, 2003 (UTC)

[http://en.wikipedia.org/w/wiki.phtml?title=MediaWiki:VfD-Sean_Flowers&action=edit add to this deletion debate]

**Delete. It tried to fix this, but there seems to be at least two countries with an ICAC, Australia and Hong Kong. Seems to be a ex-British colony thing. I decided I didn't care enough to sort through it.[[User:David Stapleton|David Stapleton]] 07:17, Oct 30, 2003 (UTC)

**Keep, turn into a disambiguation page. You don't delete in cases like this. [[User:Fuzheado|Fuzheado]] 07:21, 30 Oct 2003 (UTC)

**Keep, improve in other ways - disambiguation or more content. [[User:JamesDay|JamesDay]] 14:27, 31 Oct 2003 (UTC)

{{tl|VfD-Sean_Flowers}}

*[[Battle of the Dunes]]. The entire text is " The '''Battle of the Dunes''' was a [[Spanish]]-[[French]] war which occured on [[June 14th]], [[1658]]". There exists a good article: [[Battle of the Dunes (1658)]]. [[Battle of the Dunes]] should not be used as a redirect as [[List of battles (alphabetical)]] also lists [[Battle of the Dunes (430)]], which I am sure will be written some day. (That is the point of all these lists isn't it?). In addition, I found evidence on Google of yet a third Battle of the Dunes, in 1600 in about the same ___location as the 1658 battle. I suppose [[Battle of the Dunes]] could be a disambiguation page.[[User:David Stapleton|David Stapleton]] 07:43, Oct 30, 2003 (UTC)

** Keep. It's a disambiguation page. [[User:Onebyone|Onebyone]] 10:57, 30 Oct 2003 (UTC)

**Keep. You've just explained why it's needed as a disambiguation page. [[User:JamesDay|JamesDay]] 14:27, 31 Oct 2003 (UTC)

====[[The Black and White Space Marine on the Black and White Bike]]====

*[[Electron spin resonance]] - It goes on to talk about Continuous Wave EPR and Electron Paramagnetic Resonance, and link to somebody's site. I'm not a scientifically inclined person, but I know this is just an ad. - [[user:zanimum]]

[http://en.wikipedia.org/w/wiki.phtml?title=MediaWiki:VfD-The_Black_and_White_Space_Marine_on_the_Black_and_White_Bike&action=edit add to this deletion debate]

** The link is an ad, but electron spin resonance is a genuine technique. [[User:Onebyone|Onebyone]] 15:38, 30 Oct 2003 (UTC)

**Keep, in spite of the link the author probably happened to know about. [[User:JamesDay|JamesDay]] 14:27, 31 Oct 2003 (UTC)

** Yes, its a geniune technique, but doesn't this article discuss another topic? - [[user:zanimum]]

** Keep and improve [[User:Lir|Lirath Q. Pynnor]]

{{tl|VfD-The_Black_and_White_Space_Marine_on_the_Black_and_White_Bike}}

*[[Kingman Reef/Transnational issues]], [[Kingman Reef/Military]], [[Kingman Reef/Economy]], [[Kingman Reef/People]], [[Kingman Reef/Transportation]], [[Kingman Reef/Government]], [[Kingman Reef/Geography]] - the content of these pages (or lack thereof) before they were redirected to the main article says it all. All the info has been incorporated into the main [[Kingman Reef]] article. I don't think people will be looking for the military of an uninhabited island. --[[User:Jiang|Jiang]] 22:59, 30 Oct 2003 (UTC)

**Delete, reason in listing. [[User:JamesDay|JamesDay]] 14:27, 31 Oct 2003 (UTC)

**Delete --[[User:Gboy|FallingInLoveWithPitoc]] 04:44, 1 Nov 2003 (UTC)

====[[Ambiversion]]====

==October 31==

[http://en.wikipedia.org/w/wiki.phtml?title=MediaWiki:VfD-Ambiversion&action=edit add to this deletion debate]

{{WP:Votes for deletion/Ambiversion}}

*[[Pop Goes The Weasel]] - contextless review of some album, seems to have been copied from another source diretly. [[User:Jheijmans|Jeronimo]] 07:51, 31 Oct 2003 (UTC)

** Keep. It's only "contextless" because it doesn't have Wiki-links. If it's copied from another source, I can't find it through Google. If anyone can find a suspected source, it would belong on [[Wikipedia:Copyvio]] rather than here. [[User:Onebyone|Onebyone]] 10:38, 31 Oct 2003 (UTC)

**Keep unless it's copyvio. It's a well known nursery rhyme and a book.[[User:JamesDay|JamesDay]] 18:37, 31 Oct 2003 (UTC)

====[[Nalgene]]====

*[[2004 California Candidate]] - improperly and ambiguously named article created to list an extremely obscure Presidential candidate who happens to be from California. -- [[User:Minesweeper|Minesweeper]] 10:41, Oct 31, 2003 (UTC)

[http://en.wikipedia.org/w/wiki.phtml?title=MediaWiki:VfD-Nalgene&action=edit add to this deletion debate]

**Also [[U.S. Senate election, 2004]], and [[Edie Bukewihge]] by the same IP. I've removed their publicitly from [[United States Republican Party]], but left it in [[U.S. presidential election, 2004]]. [[User:Morwen|Morwen]] 17:39, 31 Oct 2003 (UTC)

**Delete them. Now have more accurate content for the duration of this listing. [[User:JamesDay|JamesDay]] 19:32, 31 Oct 2003 (UTC)

{{tl|VfD-Nalgene}}

*[[Bongle]] (hardware key realized on a CD) I'm not too happy about this page for two reasons. First, I think Bongle is the name of a specific commercial product from Hide & Seek Technologies. (They don't seem to have a website so it's not easy to tell whether the name is a trademark). Second, unlike "Dongle," I don't believe the word "Bongle" is in general parlance. Since I see that a couple of experienced Wikipedians have edited this page, I'd assume that they think it's a legitimate and valid entry, so quite possibly I'm wrong about this. I'm not going to say it ''should'' be deleted, but I'd like to see some positive ''justification'' or explanation for keeping it. (For example, prove me wrong when I say it's not in general parlance). The results of Googling for "Bongle" on the Web or in Groups are not very convincing. [[User:Dpbsmith|Dpbsmith]] 17:41, 31 Oct 2003 (UTC)

====[[Elena Filatova]]====

* [[SIOR]] - looks like an add [[User:Muriel Gottrop|Muriel Gottrop]] 21:31, 31 Oct 2003 (UTC)

[http://en.wikipedia.org/w/wiki.phtml?title=MediaWiki:VfD-Elena_Filatova&action=edit add to this deletion debate]

* Keep if it is an important industry recognition.

{{tl|VfD-Elena_Filatova}}

*[[Isluiq]] - i believe this was deleted once before. Google retrieves ZERO articles. [[User:Kingturtle|Kingturtle]] 21:33, 31 Oct 2003 (UTC)

** can't verify the correctnes of this article. No google hit. Seems to be related to [[Tsesungun]], a rare, near extinct dialect of a Chilean language (about 8 google hits). So it might pretty good be that this is correct but still not mentioned in the WWW yet. Or it is better known with some diacritics added? -- [[User:JeLuF|JeLuF]] 21:35, 31 Oct 2003 (UTC)

**I see no reason to distrust the submitter; but, on the other hand, its pretty obscure information, without reference. [[User:Lir|Lirath Q. Pynnor]]

**This is only one of a series of articles created by [[User:SmartBee]] that are simply make believe. They all relate to a kingdom created by some Canadian in Chile in 1973 which General Pinochet has "supressed all records of" so that no one has ever heard of it. Other articles that should go are [[Canada and the Chilean Tsesungun People]], [[Tsesungunille]], - [[User:SimonP|SimonP]] 18:54, Nov 2, 2003 (UTC)

**Del. --[[User:Wik|Wik]] 04:05, Nov 3, 2003 (UTC)

====[[Call of Duty: United Offensive]]====

*[[Last edit by Ruhrjung]] - obsolete old version of [[Silesia]]. --[[User:Wik|Wik]] 21:53, Oct 31, 2003 (UTC)

[http://en.wikipedia.org/w/wiki.phtml?title=MediaWiki:VfD-Call_of_Duty_United_Offensive&action=edit add to this deletion debate]

**Delete. At least, the title is bad. --[[User:Gboy|FallingInLoveWithPitoc]] 01:31, 2 Nov 2003 (UTC)

{{tl|VfD-Call_of_Duty_United_Offensive}}

*[[:Image:Next.bmp]] - 1,153,850 bytes. Replaced with [[:Image:Next.jpg]]. - [[User:Hephaestos|Hephaestos]] 22:56, 31 Oct 2003 (UTC)

====[[Political terrorism]]====

''the start of the following item has been moved by me ([[User:Camembert|Camembert]]) from [[Wikipedia:Votes for deletion/foreign language]], since these pages aren't actually in a foreign language''

[http://en.wikipedia.org/w/wiki.phtml?title=MediaWiki:VfD-Political_terrorism&action=edit add to this deletion debate]

{{tl|VfD-Political_terrorism}}

*[[Greek names of states]]/Greek names of nations - i dont think it belongs in this wiki. [[User:Muriel Gottrop|Muriel Gottrop]] 21:24, 31 Oct 2003 (UTC)

**And [[Greek names of islands]] - [[Greek names of European cities]]

**Keep. Reference tables are acceptable. [[User:Lir|Lirath Q. Pynnor]]

**This will be kept. There is going to be a list of Arabic and European language forms of cities. This discussion is on hold. It will not be removed from other non-English wikis like Greek-French names of European cities on fr.wikipedia.org and Greek-Spanish names on es.wikipedia.org [[User:Pumpie|Pumpie]]

***I'm sorry, but french/latin/etc are readable by english speaking wikipedians. Unfortunately, for 99% of them greek characters are just symbols... jeia hara [[User:Muriel Gottrop|Muriel Gottrop]] 21:53, 31 Oct 2003 (UTC)

***Think again, click on [[Greek alphabet]]s to know the alphabet. I'm the expert on this alphabet. I'll will put the Latin Alphabet beside it.

****So? About 1/4 of the Greek symbol column in that table is blank squares. That is not very useful - [[User:Marshman|Marshman]] 02:14, 1 Nov 2003 (UTC)

****Dear expert 67: in wiki good maners are essential whatever the language. Please bear this in mind... You can sign with four ~. And lets wait for other opinions Ok? [[User:Muriel Gottrop|Muriel Gottrop]] 22:03, 31 Oct 2003 (UTC)

*****A page consisting only of translations is not appropriate for Wikipedia. Maybe Wiktionary would like it? They do translations. This is no more useful than something like [[Greek names of fruit]] or whatever. It doesn't provide any encyclopedic information. [[User:Angela|Angela]] 22:12, Oct 31, 2003 (UTC)

**It looks like the "Greek names" of these nations are mostly are just transliterations of the nations name into the Greek alphabet. I don't see much use to this page -- and it's certainly not a good encyclopedia topic. [[User:Maximus Rex|Maximus Rex]] 22:17, 31 Oct 2003 (UTC)

**Keep, this is a reference table as Lir said. [[User:Aplank|Aplank]] 22:22, 31 Oct 2003 (UTC)

**What if it is a reference table? Lists of foreign words still have no place here. [[User:Angela|Angela]]

***Whats the harm? [[User:Lir|Lirath Q. Pynnor]]

**I found it interesting. ''Some'' are just transliterations. The one for Finland actually looks as if it came from English! A&gamma;&gamma;&lambda;&iota;&alpha; was interesting. I know just enough of Greek to know that the double "g" corresponds to "ng", but this particular instance would not have occurred to me if I hadn't seen this list. [[User:Michael Hardy|Michael Hardy]] 00:01, 1 Nov 2003 (UTC) Interesting that the Greeks call France "Gallia"; if that's just a transliteration, it's from Latin. [[User:Michael Hardy|Michael Hardy]] 00:02, 1 Nov 2003 (UTC)

**If these really are the names of these places in Greek (as opposed to transliterations), then I think these pages are useful and good (could be useful when consulting maps, for example). --[[User:Camembert|Camembert]] 00:53, 1 Nov 2003 (UTC)

** These are indeed the actual names used in (modern) Greek, not transliterations. Where they are transliterations (as in Finland) it's just because that's what Greeks actually call Finland. --[[User:Delirium|Delirium]] 09:06, Nov 3, 2003 (UTC)

*This is similar to the problem with the various lists of Latin names of things. Sometimes those ones are just an interesting academic exercise...seeing if &quot;Kansas&quot; or whatever can be made to fit Latin forms, even if Latin would never have had a word for such places. One justification is that modern ecclesiastical Latin uses them (but that's kind of sketchy I think...). I think it is the same case here, except that Greek is still a normally spoken language. I'm not sure whether I want to keep or delete these lists, but they do seem kind of useless overall. [[User:Adam Bishop|Adam Bishop]] 01:41, 1 Nov 2003 (UTC)

* Wiktionary. --[[User:Menchi|Menchi]] 02:48, 1 Nov 2003 (UTC)

* Delete. But if it is decided that Wikipedia is the right place for a list like this, I'll be happy to provide a list of [[Dutch names of countries]]. [[User:Eugene van der Pijll|Eugene van der Pijll]] 11:32, 2 Nov 2003 (UTC)

====[[Alphabetical List of Hoboken streets]]====

==November 1==

[http://en.wikipedia.org/w/wiki.phtml?title=MediaWiki:VfD-Alphabetical_List_of_Hoboken_streets&action=edit add to this deletion debate]

*[[Bill Gates/Criminal record]]

**Discuss at [[Talk:Bill Gates/Criminal record/Delete]]

{{tl|VfD-Alphabetical_List_of_Hoboken_streets}}

*[[Lactobaccillus]] It is spelt [[lactobacillus]] [[User:jll|--Jll]] 15:36, 1 Nov 2003 (UTC)

**redir? [[User:Dysprosia|Dysprosia]] 15:48, 1 Nov 2003 (UTC)

**Redirect. 450 Google hits for the wrong spelling. [[User:JamesDay|JamesDay]] 16:05, 1 Nov 2003 (UTC)

===May 24===

*[[Nothing to do with Cheese]] and [[Ignacio Lopez]] - Google returns no relevant hits for either. appears to be self-promotion. [[User:Maximus Rex|Maximus Rex]] 19:27, 1 Nov 2003 (UTC)

====[[Social surplus]]====

** Delete. [[User:Pigsonthewing|Andy Mabbett]] 19:33, 1 Nov 2003 (UTC)

[http://en.wikipedia.org/w/wiki.phtml?title=MediaWiki:VfD-Social_surplus&action=edit add to this deletion debate]

**They have also been deleted before (well, NtdwC has). [[User:Adam Bishop|Adam Bishop]] 19:36, 1 Nov 2003 (UTC)

** Don't Delete. I wrote it, I don't see why it should be deleted. It isn't "self-promotion" considering that I am neither "Ignacio Lopez" or "Nathan Carvell". I merely read their comic and liked it. Vincent.

*** Was this something that was actually published? Wondering simply, -- [[User:Infrogmation|Ifrog]]

**** as opposed to ''simply wondering''? ;-) [[User:Pigsonthewing|Andy Mabbett]] 10:34, 3 Nov 2003 (UTC)

** Unverifiable. [[User:Angela|Angela]] 23:17, Nov 1, 2003 (UTC)

**Delete. No google hits for the title + writer together. No evidence yet that this was ever actually commercially published or availible. -- [[User:Infrogmation|Infrogmation]] 23:44, 1 Nov 2003 (UTC)

**Del. --[[User:Wik|Wik]] 04:05, Nov 3, 2003 (UTC)

{{tl|VfD-Social_surplus}}

==November 2==

====[[Expression engine]]====

*[[LARP history sweden]]. What is this? [[User:RickK|RickK]] 05:14, 2 Nov 2003 (UTC)

[http://en.wikipedia.org/w/wiki.phtml?title=MediaWiki:VfD-Expression_engine&action=edit add to this deletion debate]

**Delete. Sounds like a topics about [[RPG]] or something. See [[LARP]]. But the title may be inappropriate. --[[User:Gboy|FallingInLoveWithPitoc]] 05:27, 2 Nov 2003 (UTC)

**Delete. Silly. [[User:Daniel Quinlan|Daniel Quinlan]] 02:55, Nov 3, 2003 (UTC)

{{tl|VfD-Expression_engine}}

*[[Viviparous]], [[Oviparous]], [[Ovoviparous]] no sententences, articles refer only to sharks, but should cover all animals. Probably retrievable, but not by me. [[User:Jimfbleak|jimfbleak]] 08:19, 2 Nov 2003 (UTC)

** Tried to update, did not know this was common for other animals than sharks. never heard it mentioned for anything but sharks. For my info what other type of animals 'use' Ovoviviparous reproduction? Anyway delet if you wish, just trying to help. [[User:Stefan|Stefan]] 08:37, 2 Nov 2003 (UTC)

** These stubs are under one hour old! Please allow some time for their development. [[User:Pigsonthewing|Andy Mabbett]] 08:33, 2 Nov 2003 (UTC)

** Wouldn't be better for [[Wikitionary]]? --[[User:Gboy|FallingInLoveWithPitoc]] 09:56, 2 Nov 2003 (UTC)

** probably OK now, keep in Wkipedia, can be developed further, or perhaps merged as a suitable topic [[User:Jimfbleak|jimfbleak]] 10:29, 2 Nov 2003 (UTC)

** Keep for now. [[User:Daniel Quinlan|Daniel Quinlan]] 02:55, Nov 3, 2003 (UTC)

====[[The egg and the chicken problem]]====

*[[September 11, 2001 Terrorist Attack opportunists]] - There's not much useful content. "Some people" doesn't say much. Gasoline price gouging is the only useful fact I see on there. --[[User:Jiang|Jiang]] 10:38, 2 Nov 2003 (UTC)

[http://en.wikipedia.org/w/wiki.phtml?title=MediaWiki:VfD-The_egg_and_the_chicken_problem&action=edit add to this deletion debate]

** Delete as hopelessly POV. [[User:Daniel Quinlan|Daniel Quinlan]] 02:55, Nov 3, 2003 (UTC)

** Delete. Although it's hard to believe, we already have a page on [[Gasoline price gouging following the September 11, 2001 Terrorist Attack]]. [[User:Maximus Rex|Maximus Rex]] 05:00, 3 Nov 2003 (UTC)

** Delete, as should the "Gasoline price gouging" page. [[User:Fuzheado|Fuzheado]]

{{tl|VfD-The_egg_and_the_chicken_problem}}

*[[List of countries involved in World War IV]] not entirely sure what this is, seems to be someone's opinion. [[User:Maximus Rex|Maximus Rex]] 17:15, 2 Nov 2003 (UTC)

** Delete. A POV list on a POV topic. One person creating a term doesn't justify one article let alone two. [[User:MK|MK]] 12:24 (EST) 2 November 2003

** Delete. Irredemably subjective. -- [[User:Finlay McWalter|Finlay McWalter]] 17:30, 2 Nov 2003 (UTC)

** Delete...should there even be a [[World War IV]] article? [[User:Adam Bishop|Adam Bishop]] 18:22, 2 Nov 2003 (UTC)

** Delete. But i dont think is subjective. A country either supports or not USA policies - this is very objective. (Mine does, unfortunately.) I just think that WWIV was a term which is not widespread invented by some especialist. I think the WWIV should go to. [[User:Muriel Gottrop|Muriel Gottrop]] 18:37, 2 Nov 2003 (UTC)

**Merge with parent article. [[User:Lir|Lirath Q. Pynnor]]

** Delete, no good basis for the list. [[User:Fuzheado|Fuzheado]]

*** On second thought, merge with [[Coalition of the willing]] since that page does not have a list of "willing" countries. [[User:Fuzheado|Fuzheado]]

**** Delete completely. The list isn't even very accurate. Canada, for instance, did not support the war in Iraq. - [[User:SimonP|SimonP]] 01:33, Nov 3, 2003 (UTC)

**** Canada supported the invasion of Afghanistan though...being involved in WW4 presumably refers to more than just Iraq. But, still delete :) [[User:Adam Bishop|Adam Bishop]] 02:50, 3 Nov 2003 (UTC)

***** Yes, delete this entry completely, and put a ''correct'' list of countries into [[Coalition of the willing]]. [[User:Fuzheado|Fuzheado]]

** Delete. [[User:Daniel Quinlan|Daniel Quinlan]] 02:55, Nov 3, 2003 (UTC)

** Del. --[[User:Wik|Wik]] 04:05, Nov 3, 2003 (UTC)

** Delete. This is an (over-)simplification of information which belongs in [[War on Terrorism]]. [[User:Onebyone|Onebyone]] 11:17, 3 Nov 2003 (UTC)

====[[Vince_Buffalo]]====

*[[Tsesungunille]]

[http://en.wikipedia.org/w/wiki.phtml?title=MediaWiki:VfD-Vince_Buffalo&action=edit add to this deletion debate]

**Unless any evidence can be found to support this, it should be deleted. [[User:Lir|Lirath Q. Pynnor]]

**Delete. Somebody's fantasy. [[User:RickK|RickK]] 02:17, 3 Nov 2003 (UTC

**Delete. [[User:Daniel Quinlan|Daniel Quinlan]] 02:55, Nov 3, 2003 (UTC)

**Del. --[[User:Wik|Wik]] 04:05, Nov 3, 2003 (UTC)

{{tl|VfD-Vince_Buffalo}}

*[[Talossan language]]. A stub about the fictional language of a fictional place. [[User:RickK|RickK]] 02:33, 3 Nov 2003 (UTC)

**That's a ''very'' popular and famous conlang. It's spoken for a large micronation, with many members who create words for it. Talossan is perhaps best known for having probably the largest vocabulary of any non-auxiliary conlang -- well over 10,000 words, perhaps 15,000 if I remember correctly, all based on Romance language word roots. It's well-respected and aspired to across the conlang community for its large vocabulary, and is probably also the best-known example of the [[micronational language]] genre of conlang. Keep. [[User:Wiwaxia|Wiwaxia]] 02:43, 3 Nov 2003 (UTC)

**Perhaps this information (including the fact that it's a conlang, which isn't even mentioned) could be added to the article? [[User:RickK|RickK]] 02:45, 3 Nov 2003 (UTC)

**Delete. Only 2,130 hits on Google, barely even shows up on the net. [[User:Daniel Quinlan|Daniel Quinlan]] 02:55, Nov 3, 2003 (UTC)

**Keep [[User:Lir|Lirath Q. Pynnor]]

**Del. --[[User:Wik|Wik]] 04:05, Nov 3, 2003 (UTC)

**I've bumped into this numerous times over my web-surfing years. It's a real and prominent artificial language, probably more so than [[Toki Pona]]. No reason to delete. -- [[User:VeryVerily|VV]] 05:49, 3 Nov 2003 (UTC)

====[[...The Press!]]====

==November 3==

[http://en.wikipedia.org/w/wiki.phtml?title=MediaWiki:VfD-ThePress&action=edit add to this deletion debate]

{{tl|VfD-ThePress}}

*[[Bush dynasty]] -- all guessing, little basis in fact, no references. -- [[User:Mattworld|Mattworld]] 03:07, 3 Nov 2003 (UTC)

**Delete. The consensus on the talk page seems to be the same as well. [[User:Daniel Quinlan|Daniel Quinlan]] 03:14, Nov 3, 2003 (UTC)

**Delete, we already have [[Bush family conspiracy theory]], FWIW. [[User:Fuzheado|Fuzheado]]

*** I don't think that's the right reason to keep or delete this article. The two articles are quite unrelated except that they are about Bush, a favorite target of some. [[User:Daniel Quinlan|Daniel Quinlan]] 04:55, Nov 3, 2003 (UTC)

**** You're right, of course. It was more to say, "We've already got one runaway article as dumping ground for anti-Bush comments, so let's keep it at one." Or, as you've proposed below, less than one. :) [[User:Fuzheado|Fuzheado]]

**Merge with Bush family conspiracy theory [[User:Lir|Lirath Q. Pynnor]]

**For me, whether this should stay hinges on whether it's true that commentators use this phrase. If it really is used by pundits and columnists, it's reasonable to have an entry on the term. If not, not. It's not the same as the conspiracy theory, either. -- [[User:VeryVerily|VV]] 05:58, 3 Nov 2003 (UTC)

**Delete. Unnecessary article about something that doesn't exist. [[User:Maximus Rex|Maximus Rex]] 06:24, 3 Nov 2003 (UTC)

====[[Guff]]====

*[[Old Granny Sweat Weed]] -- this item completely fails the google test (no hits whatsoever) as does the name of the person the unspecified species of nettle is allegedly called after. Also, there are no Wikipedia links to this page.[[User:Vicki Rosenzweig|Vicki Rosenzweig]] 04:12, 3 Nov 2003 (UTC)

[http://en.wikipedia.org/w/wiki.phtml?title=MediaWiki:VfD-Guff&action=edit add to this deletion debate]

**Delete -- unverifiable. [[User:Maximus Rex|Maximus Rex]] 06:24, 3 Nov 2003 (UTC)

**Delete, no Google hits. [[User:Fuzheado|Fuzheado]] 09:04, 3 Nov 2003 (UTC)

{{WP:Votes for deletion/Guff}}

* [[Bush family conspiracy theory]] -- this article, it's existence, how it is written, etc. is hopelessly non-NPOV. Lists of accusations and unconnected facts can be compiled about nearly anyone and made to look suspicious. [[User:Daniel Quinlan|Daniel Quinlan]] 04:48, Nov 3, 2003 (UTC)

**Yes, such facts can be compiled about anyone &mdash; and in Bush's case, ''they are''. I've seen so many "analysts" throw together these scraps into frivolous allegations against the Bush family, that it seems we should have an entry on this recurring accusation, just as we do for the JFK conspiracy allegations. I think the entry does now (and could more in the future) do a good job of laying out the whole, pathetic case and listing counterpoints. -- [[User:VeryVerily|VV]] 05:58, 3 Nov 2003 (UTC)

***I just read my comment again and thought the tone sounded kind of harsh. Sorry if it seemed that way, I didn't mean it to. I understand your concern but think this is a "real" conspiracy theory (so to speak). -- [[User:VeryVerily|VV]] 06:17, 3 Nov 2003 (UTC)

**I strongly object. Yes at one time this article was really bad but several Wikipedians other than the original author have spent ''many'' hours working on improving this entry. Do ''not'' delete - it is a valid topic and given enough time it will be NPOV. --[[User:Maveric149|mav]] 08:32, 3 Nov 2003 (UTC)

**Keep. non-NPOV isn't a reason to list it here anyway, and it seems a lot of work has gone in NPOVing it since it was created. [[User:Angela|Angela]] 08:44, Nov 3, 2003 (UTC)

**Keep, not only a widely held conspiracy theory; but a true one as well! [[User:Lir|Lirath Q. Pynnor]]

**Keep. The article is documenting a reasonably common belief. That the subject matter involves personal opinions and disputed arguments is irrelevant - I'm not going to propose [[Apollo moon landing conspiracy theory]] or [[creationism]] for deletion just because I happen to believe that those theories are false. [[User:Onebyone|Onebyone]] 15:21, 3 Nov 2003 (UTC)

====[[Chung Ling Record]]====

* [[Bush regime]] - YA page on Bush, whether this page is considered "encyclopedic" or not, I don't think it can stand alone as ever being much more than a definition that cites its usage. [[User:Maximus Rex|Maximus Rex]] 06:32, 3 Nov 2003 (UTC)

[http://en.wikipedia.org/w/wiki.phtml?title=MediaWiki:VfD-Chung_Ling_Record&action=edit add to this deletion debate]

** Delete. Every leader's rule is called the "X regime" at one time or another, so this is non-notable. If the [[Ted Rall]] piece mentioned in the article is notable, move that mention to Ted Rall's article. [[User:Onebyone|Onebyone]] 10:45, 3 Nov 2003 (UTC)

** Delete. We could just as easily have ''Thatcher regime'', ''Reagan regime'', ''Putin regime'', ''Kohl regime'', ''Nixon regime'', etc. --[[User:Delirium|Delirium]] 11:37, Nov 3, 2003 (UTC)

**Merge with Bush family conspiracy theory. [[User:Lir|Lirath Q. Pynnor]]

**I agree with Lir - merge and redirect. --[[User:Maveric149|mav]]

{{WP:Votes for deletion/Chung_Ling_Record}}

* [[Presidential trivia]] - trivial. sometimes unfounded. [[User:Kingturtle|Kingturtle]] 06:36, 3 Nov 2003 (UTC)

**Keep. I suggest that you read the cites in the article talk and the wiki source. Looks as though you object to the Clinton one you removed, saying that the source was inaccurate. Can you support the claim that the author was inaccurate? If you can, I agree that it shouldn't be there. Surprised that you thought the Reagan quote was interesting enough to merit staying in the article on him but the article containing curiosities about the presidents, which is where it came from, isn't worth having around. Thinking the quote worth keeping around seems to suggest the opposite. [[User:JamesDay|JamesDay]] 09:25, 3 Nov 2003 (UTC)

**Unattributed oddities makes this article seem ripe for misinformation. Any other articles in this type of format in Wikipedia? [[User:Fuzheado|Fuzheado]]

====[[Chinese cannibalism]]====

* [[Gator]] - is that the only thing GATOR should redirect to? ''Gator'' should either be a disambiguating page, or deleted. [[User:Kingturtle|Kingturtle]] 06:47, 3 Nov 2003 (UTC)

[http://en.wikipedia.org/w/wiki.phtml?title=MediaWiki:VfD-Chinese_cannibalism&action=edit add to this deletion debate]

** Keep. [[User:Onebyone|Onebyone]] 10:47, 3 Nov 2003 (UTC)

{{tl|VfD-Chinese_cannibalism}}

* [[Closings and cancellations following the September 11, 2001 Terrorist Attacks]] - wikipedia is not a newspaper; the article is hopelessly outdated: "Reagan airport (in Washington, D.C.) is still closed one week after the attack." --[[User:Jiang|Jiang]]

** Delete, merge if information still interesting. [[User:Fuzheado|Fuzheado]]

====[[Iraq Liberation Act]]====

* [[Relief funds created in reaction to the September 11, 2001 Terrorist Attacks]] - maybe the sentence "Many relief funds were immediately set up to assist victims (personally and economically) of the attacks." is worth merging w/ the main article, but otherwise, the article is useless. Page was created 23 Sep 2001. We're no longer donating. --[[User:Jiang|Jiang]]

[http://en.wikipedia.org/w/wiki.phtml?title=MediaWiki:VfD-Iraq_Liberation_Act&action=edit add to this deletion debate]

** Delete, agree. Merge and delete. [[User:Fuzheado|Fuzheado]]

** Keep or merge and redirect. It is a valid collection of information about the response to a huge terrorist event. The closings and cancellations caused by 9/11 is unprecedented in US history. The article is also a daughter article of the 9/11 article. Thus it naturally is more focused. ''Do not delete!'' --[[User:Maveric149|mav]] 16:10, 3 Nov 2003 (UTC)

{{tl|VfD-Iraq_Liberation_Act}}

* [[Schlesien]] It seems to me, that we have 2 different articles abot the same ([[Silesia]] and [[Schlesien]] are the same.! I think we should merged them together and redirect [[Schlesien]] to [[Silesia]] or delete. [[User:GH|GH]]

** They most likely should be merged, but I see no case for deletion of anything, so [[Wikipedia:Duplicate articles]] seems like a better place for this. --[[User:Delirium|Delirium]] 09:46, Nov 3, 2003 (UTC)

** "Schlesien" definitely does not have a place in the English Wikipedia since it's not the English name for the place and never has been (unlike Danzig/Gdansk!). Merge it with [[Silesia]]. -- [[User:Arwel Parry|Arwel]] 10:36, 3 Nov 2003 (UTC)

** Merge with [[Silesia]], but with care since Silesia is currently protected due to a neutrality dispute. Keep as a redirect. [[User:Onebyone|Onebyone]] 11:00, 3 Nov 2003 (UTC)

**Delete. No need of merge, since it seems just that someone get irritated over discussion over Silesia and wrote his own article basde on older version of Silesia article instead. [[user::szopen|szopen]].

====[[SchneersonQuotes]]====

*[[Silesian language]] As far as I am concerned, Silesian is a dialect of Polish, unlike Kashubian that is a separate language. It was treated as Polish, even when Silesia was a part of Germany. There is no reason to put separate article. Other solution is to create article Silesian dialect, that would deal with Silesians dialects of Polish and German. [[User:GH|GH]]

[http://en.wikipedia.org/w/wiki.phtml?title=MediaWiki:VfD-SchneersonQuotes&action=edit add to this deletion debate]

**Ethnologue lists two Silesian languages - Lower Silesian (which it considers to be a separate language, and Upper Silesian which it says is a dialect of Polish. See [http://www.ethnologue.com/show_language.asp?code=SLI] for lower selesian language. [[User:Secretlondon|Secretlondon]] 11:33, Nov 3, 2003 (UTC)

** As far as I am concerned, LowerSilesian is dialect of German (probably extinct), while UpperSilesian is a dialect of Polish.

**There are two concept about Silesian ethnolect:

***separate Western Slavonic language (similar to Polish and Czech with some German influences) or just

***a regional dialect of Polish. As the linguists say there ae no strict definiton of what is a language, what is a dialect (both are called ethnolects). <b>I am a native Polish speaker, and when my friends from Silesia speak, I don't understand anything except a few words, that are sililar to Polish. </b>. The same applies to Czech, Slovak, Russian, Ukrainian and Kashubian. Kashubian and Silesian are sometimes clasified as dialects of Polish. The Silesian people consired themselves to be a separate nation and their speak to be a separate language. And the Polish nationalists deny them this status. This is a political not lingusitic(scientific) debate. Silesian language should stay [[User:caius2ga|Grzes of Poznan(caius2ga)]] 11:55, 3 Nov 2003 (UTC)

**Keep. Even if it was a 'mere' dialect of polish, the article wouldn't want deleting, just renaming. [[User:Morwen|Morwen]] 12:11, 3 Nov 2003 (UTC)

**Rename. IIRC current agreement that Kashubian is separate language, while Silesian is Polish dialect - in fact I've heard that it keeps many features of old-Polish much better than Modern Polish. It's just mixed with German. I bet caius2ga that you wouldn't be able to udnerstand medieval Polish too :).

**In that case, rename to [[Silesian dialect]] and discuss origin and controversy. --[[User:Delirium|Delirium]] 12:48, Nov 3, 2003 (UTC)

** Keep. There is no clear-cut, objective definition for the common-use meaning of "language". Wikipedia should not delete the "X language" page just because (in the opinion of some, many or most), X is not really a distinct language but a dialect of something else. Even if a rigorous linguist's definition of "language" exists, it's counter-intuitive to remove pages because of a definition that most users won't even understand. Only delete if the argument for X being a distinct language is particularly weak or clearly perverse. [[User:Onebyone|Onebyone]] 15:11, 3 Nov 2003 (UTC)

{{tl|VfD-SchneersonQuotes}}

*[[Cognitics]] and [[cognition theory]]. Cognitics appears to be a neologism for [[cognition]], I only get 37 Google hits, The cognition theory article may have some useful information, but should probably be merged with [[cognition]] or [[cognitive science]], and we already have about 5-6 articles that begin with the prefix "cognit*", I don't think we need another pair. --[[User:Lexor|Lexor]] 11:52, 3 Nov 2003 (UTC)

**One of these were ''just'' listed on Cleanup. Can we give em a few more days? -- [[User:Viajero|Viajero]] 12:03, 3 Nov 2003 (UTC)

====[[Yayhooray]]====

** Cognitics is VERY different from Cognition: it relates to AUTOMATED cognition. This field will surely develop very much as machine-based systems expand and concepts including knowledge, learning or abstraction for example will apply in this context. It is already pushing for more formal definitions and novel metric units for cognition.-- [[User:Dessimoz|Dessimoz]] 13:59, 3 Nov 2003 (UTC)

[http://en.wikipedia.org/w/wiki.phtml?title=MediaWiki:VfD-Yayhooray&action=edit add to this deletion debate]

*** I understand what you are saying, but automated cognition simply sounds to me like [[artificial intelligence]]. Feel free to add the information there, but Wikipedia is supposed to be an encyclopedia and we should use standard terminology wherever possible. From my research on the term cognitics (Google lists only 37 links most of which are citations from a JD Dessimoz), it seems one J.-D. Dessimoz, is one of the few authors who use this term, in fact about 9 refs were just added on [[Cognition theory]] that ''only'' cite this author. --[[User:Lexor|Lexor]] 13:11, 3 Nov 2003 (UTC)

{{WP:Votes for deletion/Yayhooray}}

====[[Uppercase Day]]====

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====[[Wikipedia:Who]]====

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====[[Canadian gun registry]]====

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{{tl|VfD-Canadian_gun_registry}}

=== May 25 ===

====[[Jason_Richey]]====

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====[[CCITT X.409 '84]]====

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{{tl|VfD-debate_CCITT_X_409_84}}

==== [[Bandwagon Oklahoma Music]] and [[BandwagonOK]] ====

[http://en.wikipedia.org/w/wiki.phtml?title=MediaWiki:VfD-Bandwagon_Oklahoma_Music&action=edit add to this deletion debate]

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====[[Tom Jackson]]====

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====[[Windermere Real Estate]]====

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====[[Robert Kyle Wilson]]====

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====[[Massage_Therapy_School_-_NMSNT]]====

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====[[Jetsam]]====

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====[[Knut_Lyngar]]====

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====[[True Magic]]====

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====[[Stepping-stone democrat]]====

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====[[Cap N1ne]]====

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====[[Phartcore_metal]]====

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====[[User:195.93.34.12/message]]====

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====[[Kevin_Anderson]]====

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====[[Stuffology]]====

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====[[Trosh]]====

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====[[Toas]]====

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====[[Jerome War Relocation Center]]====

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====[[Tarppy]]====

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====[[Ulrike Köhler]] and [[Jochen Köhler]]====

[http://en.wikipedia.org/w/wiki.phtml?title=MediaWiki:VfD-Jochen_Köhler&action=edit add to this deletion debate]

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=== May 26 ===

====[[White nationalist FAQ]]====

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====[[Sexdecillion]], [[Quattuordecillion]], [[Quindecillion]], [[Tredecillion]], [[Undecillion]]====

[http://en.wikipedia.org/w/wiki.phtml?title=MediaWiki:VfD-Sexdecillion&action=edit add to this deletion debate]

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====[[footjob]]====

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====[[Star of the County Down]]====

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====[[William Guzzardi]]====

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====[[David Pearce]]====

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====[[Hedonistic imperative]]====

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====[[Nick Bostrom]]====

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====[[World Transhumanist Association]]====

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==== [[Michael H. Hart]] ====

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====[[Haifa Linux Club]]====

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====[[Paul_McKeever]]====

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====[[Poof]] and [[Pouffe]]====

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====[[Natural Hygiene]]====

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====[[Chelation therapy]]====

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====[[Karmann]]====

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====[[Thinkism]]====

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====[[LUX]]====

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====[[Arab Khamula]]====

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====[[Partit Nacionalista Liberal de Catalunya]]====

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====[[UNaXcess]]====

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====[[Cairns State High School]]====

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=== May 27 ===

====[[Very large numbers]]====

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====[[Guánica Bay]]====

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====[[Vollis]]====

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====[[Disassociate]]====

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====[[Mr.Bits]]====

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{{WP:Votes for deletion/MrBits}}

====[[Quantum phase transition]]====

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====[[List of people who have not committed suicide]]====

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====[[Kassandra Hiroshima]] and [[Kassandra HiroshimA]]====

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====[[A. Smith]]====

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====[[Digivolve]]====

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====[[Nothlit (Animorphs)]]====

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=== May 28 ===

====[[Heck]]====

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====[[Mudgik]]====

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{{tl|VfD-Mudgik}}

Apologies, was not logged in.

I do not expect you to understand the importance a mutable archive of Mudgik would provide the Mudgik community. The remark is blunderous; importance is relative.

It is not a [[website]] it was a [[MUD]].

It exists today in two forms (I am still researching them).

For more MUDs that aren't 'that important' please see:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MUD#Popular_MU*s

Keepers. [[User:Yeago|Yeago]] 04:09, 28 May 2004 (UTC)

====[[Claire Chow]]====

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====[[Bikeshed]]====

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====[[Advanet]]====

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====[[Template:Top seeds for French Open 2004]]====

Is there going to be one of these for every Grand Slam in every year? By the end of the year, will there be four of these on the [[Serena Williams]] page with eighty names listed? At the end of five years, will there be twenty of them on her page? [[User:RickK|Rick]][[User talk:RickK|'''K''']] 04:03, 28 May 2004 (UTC)

====[[Miscible]]====

[http://en.wikipedia.org/w/wiki.phtml?title=MediaWiki:VfD-debate_miscible&action=edit add to this deletion debate]

{{WP:Votes for deletion/Miscible}}

==VfD Footer section==

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