Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Sturmgrenadier (2nd nomination): Difference between revisions
Content deleted Content added
delete |
m Bot: Fixing lint errors, replacing obsolete HTML tags: <font> (8x) Tag: Fixed lint errors |
||
| (17 intermediate revisions by 13 users not shown) | |||
Line 1:
<div class="boilerplate metadata vfd" style="background-color: #F3F9FF; margin: 2em 0 0 0; padding: 0 10px 0 10px; border: 1px solid #AAAAAA;">
:''The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this page. ''
<!--
Note: If you are seeing this page as a result of an attempt to re-nominate an article for deletion, you must manually edit the AfD nomination links in order to create a new discussion page using the name format of [[Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/PAGENAME (2nd nomination)]]. When you create the new discussion page, please provide a link to this old discussion in your nomination. -->
The result of the debate was '''delete''', with mass-messaging for votes taken into consideration (well, I got it myself). - [[User:Mailer diablo|Mailer Diablo]] 02:47, 26 December 2005 (UTC)
'''''Vote count :''' 47 delete, 12 keep (approx. 80%)'' - [[User:Mailer diablo|Mailer Diablo]] 02:50, 26 December 2005 (UTC)
===[[Sturmgrenadier]]===
gaming clubs inherently non-notable. [[User:Zzzzz|Zzzzz]] 19:22, 20 December 2005 (UTC)
Line 6 ⟶ 14:
*'''Comment'''. This article was previously nominated for deletion. Result was ''no consensus''. See: [[Wikipedia:Votes for deletion/Sturmgrenadier]]. [[User:Aeverett|You can call me Al]] 19:42, 20 December 2005 (UTC)
*'''<s>Weak</s> Keep''' - per coverage in [[USA Today]] - but clean up the stupid unencyclopedic "elitist" bickering - here's a hint, nobody cares about stupid Gaming Clan Drama (tm) on Wikipedia. [[User:FCYTravis|FCYTravis]] 21:02, 20 December 2005 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per nomination. —[[User:Preost|<span style="color: green; font-family: Adobe Garamond Pro, Garamond, Georgia, Times New Roman; font-size: large;">Preost</span>]] <sup>[[User_talk:Preost|<span style="color: red;">talk</span>]]</sup> <small>[[Special:Contributions/Preost|<span style="color: black;">contribs</span>]]</small> 21:03, 20 December 2005 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per nomination. {{User:ASDamick/sig}} 21:03, 20 December 2005 (UTC)▼
*'''Delete''' per nomination. [[User:Flyboy Will|Flyboy Will]] 22:05, 20 December 2005 (UTC)
*'''Keep''', for the reasons listed here: [[Wikipedia:Votes for deletion/Sturmgrenadier]]. --[[User:Habap|Habap]] 22:51, 20 December 2005 (UTC)
Line 24 ⟶ 32:
**I'll change my vote to '''Delete'''. [[User:Aeverett|You can call me Al]] 13:54, 22 December 2005 (UTC)
*'''Keep''' Notability is not a deletion criterion, and even if it were, nothing could ever be "inherently" non-notable. --[[User:Ryan Delaney|Ryan Delaney]] [[User talk:Ryan Delaney|<sup><b>talk</b></sup>]] 15:48, 21 December 2005 (UTC)
**Don't be silly, notability has been a deletion criterion for ages. Judge articles on their merit please. Speaking of which, the size and age of this clan sound notable to me, so '''keep'''. [[User:Radiant!|R]][[User_talk:Radiant!|adiant]][[meta:mergist|_<
*'''Keep''' This is not some small, fly-by-night kiddie clan, but a LARGE, long-lasting and widespread organization. Which makes it a notable part of online gaming history and thus worthy of retaining.--[[User:R.D.H. (Ghost In The Machine)|R.D.H. (Ghost In The Machine)]] 17:14, 21 December 2005 (UTC)
**'''Comment''' so why has nobody ever heard of it? did this club ever win anything significant, like [[Ninjas in Pyjamas]]? if not, its non-notable, as there are thousands of other gaming clubs that have won more than this one. and 800 people is large? messageboards need 10000 members to be considered at least notable.
Line 55 ⟶ 63:
**** I think its perfectly acceptable to contact others who've one has made acquaintance with while working in this Wiki to take a look at a VfD and render their own opinion. The names Habap stated are the only ones I see on that list being SG, the rest being unassociated editors of Wikipedia. [[User:ChronoSphere|ChronoSphere]] 18:19, 21 December 2005 (UTC)
*****For the record, I have no affiliation with [[User:Habap]], and am not certain why he left me a message about this particular AfD - perhaps because I (like many others on that list) am an administrator. I am explicitly not going to vote on this AfD, not just because of the possibility of appearance of collusion, but also because I simply don't have time today to give the article-and-deletion-debate the attention they deserve. [[User:DragonflySixtyseven|DS]] 18:38, 21 December 2005 (UTC)
******Don't be absurd, I'm not a member and haven't even heard of this club. Assume good faith on other people's votes. Most of those people you mention are longstanding Wikipedians frequently active on AFD. [[User:Radiant!|R]][[User_talk:Radiant!|adiant]][[meta:mergist|_<
*I am not a member of that club, and I believe that I was only contacted as I had voted on a games-related subject before (which I was able to find verifiable evidence of notability for). Don't leap to conclusions. [[User:Average Earthman|Average Earthman]] 12:35, 22 December 2005 (UTC)
**Nor am I a SG member. I have my own gaming, mafia family-House Of Painful Enlightenment, thank you. But I have played Day Of Defeat with SG on their servers many moons ago. I found them to be a very together crew who ran a good, fun shop. I'm not easily impressed by online gaming groups in general, but they made a good impression on me. Habap merely asked me to come take a look and give my opinion. So I did. He did not ask me, nor any of us, to vote to keep. This article has already passed through the VFD gauntlet, putting it though again is a waste of time, space and bandwidth! --[[User:R.D.H. (Ghost In The Machine)|R.D.H. (Ghost In The Machine)]] 15:05, 22 December 2005 (UTC)
:::<sub>Note that Zzzz has taken me up on the suggestion to invite more users to comment, though his note his note implied I was hiding my membership in the group (evidenced in this discussion long before he sent the note, in the extensive discussions on the articles Talk page, in the prior VfD ''and'' on my own user page) --[[User:Habap|Habap]] 21:38, 21 December 2005 (UTC)</sub>
**'''No vote''' -- appearing here to '''comment''' that I am not, nor ever have been, a member of this or any other gaming clan. However, it appears clear to me that, once againb, the [[cabal]] are out in force and that (to borrow a word) "voting" on this will be singualrly useless, as any vote which doesn't suit the [[cabal]] line will be "pointed out" to the closing [[admin]] as a [[sockpuppet]], [[meatpuppet]], [[pseudonym]] or, as in this instance, "someone who has a vague interest in the subject, as opposed to the utterly altruistic people voting to kill off articles just because they don't fit Certain Criteria". '''Note to admins''': I do not consider this a [[personal attack]], for two reasons: 1) it is legitimate comment directed towards a class of people who use AfD as stalking ground for an exclusionist agenda; 2) it is a criticism based on what people do, not on who they are. Thank you and Merry Christmas --[[User:Simoncursitor|Simon Cursitor]] 13:36, 23 December 2005 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' this page and any like it; WP:NOT a place to promote your gaming club. [[User:PaulHanson|Paul]] 20:56, 21 December 2005 (UTC)
*'''Delete.''' [[User:Ambi|Ambi]] 21:00, 21 December 2005 (UTC)
Line 102 ⟶ 111:
*'''Delete''' No claim to notability. Regards, [[User:BenAveling|Ben Aveling]] 02:57, 22 December 2005 (UTC)
*'''Delete'''. Clubs generally aren't notable. One article in USA Today, especially without an external link, doesn't make this club any exception, and neither does all of the incivility that has been going on in this AfD. --[[User:Idont havaname|Idont Havaname]] 03:52, 22 December 2005 (UTC)
*'''Frag'''. This doesn't meet [[WP:WEB]] with ~800 members, and even very large clans are generally non-notable, unless they are particularly newsworthy or influential outside of the rarefied air of the games in which they exist. - [[User:A Man In Black|A Man In <
*'''Delete''' This article is non-notable and unencyclopedic. There is nothing remarkable to separate this gaming clan from any other, USAToday mention notwithstanding. [[User:Zunaid|Zunaid]] 07:29, 22 December 2005 (UTC)
*'''Delete.''' Gaming clans need to be several orders of magnitude greater to qualify. [[User:Jfdwolff|JFW]] | [[User_talk:Jfdwolff|<small>T@lk</small>]] 08:25, 22 December 2005 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' 1. not notable, 2. there is no german word "Sturmgrenadier", its just a made stupid word with no sense in it. There ist a [[:de:Grenadier]], but there is no "Sturmgrenadier". We watched too much [[:de:Guido Knopp]], didn´t we?!? [[User:Dickbauch|Dickbauch]] 10:36, 22 December 2005 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' as per all of the deletion arguments foregoing. Gaming clans ''are'' inherently non-notable, and need something else to raise them to notability. A three-line mention in an article about gaming in general does not notability make. Wake me up when USA Today writes an article focusing exclusively on this gaming clan, and then maybe we'll have a decent argument for notability. → [[User:Extreme Unction|<
*'''Delete''', all gaming clans please. [[User:AN(Ger)|AN]] 11:41, 22 December 2005 (UTC)
*'''Delete'''; in fact, '''speedy delete''' under CSD A7 as an article about a club that does not assert its significance or importance. A ''mention'' in a newspaper article is far from enough. [[User:Postdlf|Postdlf]] 14:08, 22 December 2005 (UTC)
*My summary '''Comment''': On the one hand, I'm disappointed that the article is considered unworthy. On the other hand, it's good to see that normal users who know nothing about it (the original VfD was due to "Gaming Club Drama" <sup>TM</sup> as noted early on in this process) sat down, read the article, checked Google, looked for information and considered whether it was worthy. That (removing my sometimes emotional nonsense) gives me faith in Wikipedia. I think the balance is that notability is not established. If at some time down the road, verifiable notability can be established, someone will probably write a new article. I'm just glad that I decided against posting any responses last night and slept on it. --[[User:Habap|Habap]] 14:32, 22 December 2005 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' as per idonthaveaname, though I don't like how I was made aware of this. There's a lot of passionate discussion here that should be taking place in the talk space for this article and not cluttering up the project page with all of this juvenile infighting. Zzzzz was in error by campaigning for votes on this article, but the end result is that many people took a hard look at this entry and found that it wasn't as notable as some thought. Ahimè. [[User:RasputinAXP|<
*'''Delete''' - Gaming clans are not notable. --'''[[User:Cyde|Cyde Weys]]''' <sub>[[User_talk:Cyde|talk]]</sub><sup><span style="position: relative; left: -16px; margin-right: -16px;">[[Special:Contributions/Cyde|contribs]]</span></sup> 20:13, 22 December 2005 (UTC)
*'''keep''' please maybe not all clubs are notable but this is [[User:Yuckfoo|Yuckfoo]] 21:13, 22 December 2005 (UTC)
Line 117 ⟶ 126:
*'''Strong delete'''. [[WP:POINT]]. [[User:Harro5|Harro]]<b>[[User talk:Harro5|5]]</b> 00:42, 23 December 2005 (UTC)
*'''Keep It''' I completely understand what the game is all about, and it seems to be well-written. Just leave it and move on. Perhaps some of you should join an online game rather than spending your free time trying to have articles deleted from Wikipedia. It would certainly do you alot more good. [[User:Mahalia56|Mahalia56]] 04:05, 23 December 2005 (UTC)
*
**'''Comment'''—user's 30th edit, the rest to their own talk page, [[Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Urapopstar]], and the articles listed for deletion there. [[User:Postdlf|Postdlf]] 14:08, 23 December 2005 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' gamer guild vanity. — <b><i>[[User:Freakofnurture/|<font color="006000" title="User:Freakofnurture">F<small>REAK OF</small> N<small>UR<sub>x</sub>TURE</small></font>]]</i> <small>(<span class="plainlinks">[http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=User_talk:Freakofnurture&action=edit§ion=new <font color="006000" title="User talk:Freakofnurture">TALK</font>]</span>)</small></b> <small>11:19, Dec. 23, 2005</small>▼
*'''Delete'''. -- [[User:Scott Burley|Scott]] [[User talk:Scott Burley|<span style="color: black;"><small>''e<sup>iπ</sup>''</small></span>]] 07:02, 23 December 2005 (UTC)
▲*'''Delete''' gamer guild vanity. — <b><i>[[User:Freakofnurture/|<
*'''Delete''' - There is no need for the existence of caming clans in the wikipedia. --[[User:Herrick|Herrick]] 13:03, 23 December 2005 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' - Wikipedia is not a personal web page. [[User:Endomion|Endomion]] 13:37, 23 December 2005 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per nom [[User:Naconkantari|--NaconKantari]] 23:14, 23 December 2005 (UTC)
▲*'''Delete'''
*'''Delete''' - Per nom. --[[User:Kilo-Lima|Kilo-Lima]] 14:18, 24 December 2005 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' - Hehe, where's Mel Ettis now? Delete, I've strongly campaigned for the deletion of this article for months now, but I backed off because Ettis was defending this article with a strong bias. Nice to see it got revived. All I can say is just because it's in USA Today does not mean it's notable. Also, due to the fact you have to pay to be in this group, this can be considered a Commercial Advertisement. --[[User:Tykell|Tykell]] 21:07, 24 December 2005 (UTC)
:''The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this page.''</div>
| |||