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#REDIRECT [[Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Military history]]
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== Banner image ==
I've used [[Image:FrAnc.gif|40x40px]] for now, but it's not really a military history image per se. I'd like to avoid using a Napoleonic one, in order to avoid confusion with that task force; does anyone have better ideas for an image? [[User:Kirill Lokshin|Kirill Lokshin]] 17:44, 21 May 2006 (UTC)
:An icon of an infantryman wearing ''le pantalon rouge?'' Then again, we are focusing on different eras. [[User:Andres C.|Andrés C.]] 23:07, 21 May 2006 (UTC)
::That might work, actually, if we can find one that's still recognizable at a small size. Do you know of any good images offhand? [[User:Kirill Lokshin|Kirill Lokshin]] 23:52, 21 May 2006 (UTC)
:::Not at this moment, sorry. Was just thinking out loud. [[User:Andres C.|Andrés C.]] 03:15, 22 May 2006 (UTC)
::I took the liberty to replace it with a better, high-quality, non-gif version, in accordance with other ''shield'' icons. Take a look at [[Talk:Józef Antoni Poniatowski]] to see how it looks. ''<font color="#990011">//</font>''[[User:Halibutt|Halibu]][[User talk:Halibutt|tt]] 22:36, 29 May 2006 (UTC)
:::Until we come up with a definitive image, I propose we use the French flag rather than the Fleur de Lys. On the one hand, it's easily recognizable by anyone out there; on the other hand, it'll help us reduce the size of the banner. What do you think? [[User:Andres C.|Andrés C.]] 14:04, 30 May 2006 (UTC)
::::The recognizability point may be a valid one; I don't know that reducing the image by a few pixels will really make a difference, considering the size of all the other images. (But it may be worthwhile to consider whether we should make ''all'' the task force images short and wide, rather than tall and narrow.) [[User:Kirill Lokshin|Kirill Lokshin]] 14:10, 30 May 2006 (UTC)
::I must say I liked the fleur de lys as the symbol is pretty much recognized in Europe - and the symbol is clearly associated with French history rather than modern France as such. It may however be a tad different on the other side of the pond. BTW, if you really insist on using the tricoleur rather than the fleur de lys, then there's also [[:Image:PB France CoA.png]] ready :) ''<font color="#990011">//</font>''[[User:Halibutt|Halibu]][[User talk:Halibutt|tt]] 23:36, 30 May 2006 (UTC)
:::I like it too - and of course is as French as the petanque :) - but to be honest, I still would go with the ''Tricoleur''(by the way, the CoA is an excellent suggestion!) mainly for the sake of familiarity/recognizability to the eyes of the contemporary reader. Perhaps we should continue looking for something more ''neutral''? I know that the ''tricoleur'' is so awkward an image for tagging an article about the Battle of Crécy, as the ''Fleur de Lys'' is for another about the Battle of Verdun. [[User:Andres C.|Andrés C.]] 00:14, 31 May 2006 (UTC)
::::The real problem is that the small size limits us to fairly simplistic images; anything too complicated just won't be recognizable. Aside from the tricoleur and the fleur de lys, are there any more-or-less commonly known symbols we could adopt? [[User:Kirill Lokshin|Kirill Lokshin]] 00:19, 31 May 2006 (UTC)
::Marianne would be too big, same goes for the cock, [[Great Seal of France|Grand Seal]] and the emblem they use on the passports. The latter one is completely unsuitable for a CoA (AAMoF it was designed to break all the heraldic rules; you know, the Republic cannot follow an aristocratic rule of heraldry) and is simply not recognizable. In fact it could be (and is) confused with the lictor's fasces, used by the Romans and then the fascists of Italy, not to mention the usage in the US. I'd say there's pretty little choice outside of the Tricoleur and the lilies. ''<font color="#990011">//</font>''[[User:Halibutt|Halibu]][[User talk:Halibutt|tt]] 01:13, 31 May 2006 (UTC)
:::Funny thing...I had also thought about Marianne myself, and had been tinkering with [[:Image:Liberty Leading the People.jpg|Delacroix's version]], trying to crop it so she could be distinguishable in an icon...to no avail :) There are a couple of good, public ___domain images of French soldiers from the Napoleonic era at [http://digitalgallery.nypl.org/nypldigital/dgtitle_tree.cfm?level=1&title_id=269277 NYPL digital gallery] in case anyone wants to take a look. [[User:Andres C.|Andrés C.]] 01:53, 31 May 2006 (UTC)
:::: To reply a little bit to everything :
<gallery>
Image:Musee-de-lArmee-IMG 0981.jpg|French uniform of the First World War with red trousers (needs a little of a cleanup)
Image:Liberty-CeCILL.jpg|Croped and resized version of Delacroix's ''Liberty guiding the People''
</gallery>
:::: I could also drop a few random ideas like
<gallery>
Image:Musee-de-lArmee-IMG 1050.jpg|General's kepi (or an [Image:Musee-de-lArmee-IMG 1051.jpg Adrian helmet] if you prefer...) ?
Image:Drapeau-Old-Dean-IMG 0935.jpg|flag of the FFL ? Its design is inspired of flags of the French Revolution, and similar ones are still used, so it is a quite "era-free" (though clearly Republican)
Image:Legion-dHonneur-IMG 0937.jpg|''Légion d'honneur'' ? (same as above)
</gallery>
:::: Anyway.. many more available at [Category:Musée de l'armée] and [Category:Military of France]. [[User:Rama|Rama]] 12:16, 19 July 2006 (UTC)
== What about stubs? ==
While we are tagging articles, it would be good if we could identify related stubs (there are quite a few of them out there) in a way so we can come up with a nice to-do list. Perhaps a specific tag for stubs? [[User:Andres C.|Andrés C.]] 23:07, 21 May 2006 (UTC)
:I think there are a couple of topical stub tags (e.g {{tl|France-battle-stub}}) that are already usable. As far as grabbing a complete list from the tags, I think someone put together a category intersect feature that could be useful; I'll try to see if I can find it. [[User:Kirill Lokshin|Kirill Lokshin]] 23:49, 21 May 2006 (UTC)
::Okay, found it. Assuming we manage to correctly tag all the related stubs with class=Stub (which is not-trivial in itself, but something that's getting done anyways), and once the database lag gets fixed, we could use the [http://tools.wikimedia.de/~daniel/WikiSense/CategoryIntersect.php CategoryIntersect tool] to find everything in both [[:Category:Stub-Class military history articles]] and [[:Category:French military history task force articles]]. See [http://tools.wikimedia.de/~daniel/WikiSense/CategoryIntersect.php?wikilang=en&wikifam=.wikipedia.org&basecat=Stub-Class+military+history+articles&basedeep=1&mode=cs&tagcat=British+military+history+task+force+articles&tagdeep=1&go=Scan&userlang=en this], for example. [[User:Kirill Lokshin|Kirill Lokshin]] 00:08, 22 May 2006 (UTC)
::Nice. As you said, though, a trivial task it isn't. [[User:Andres C.|Andrés C.]] 03:05, 22 May 2006 (UTC)
== Categorizations ==
Ok, so I was ''bold'' :) and went on to create [[:Category:Military people from France]]. We can always change the prepositions, or go with "French", as you prefer. For now, what we need is some parent category to begin to sort out this mess. If it's ok with everybody, let's just dump everything in here, so we can get a clear picture of what we are facing at this moment. Any thoughts before I get kicked out of the Task Force :) ? [[User:Andres C.|Andrés C.]] 04:17, 23 May 2006 (UTC)
:Being bold is good! I do think we ought to wait a little bit before settling on a name, in hopes of getting a project-wide decision to the various naming issues with these categories; otherwise, we'll be stuck with renaming everything later. In the meantime, though, collecting the various categories together will probably work as a good test case; if we can figure out a good way of organizing things, we can propose that the scheme be copied across the entire category tree. [[User:Kirill Lokshin|Kirill Lokshin]] 04:21, 23 May 2006 (UTC)
::Yes, I agree completely. In the meantime, though, I guess going with the ''from France'' solution seemed to me kind of a halfway temporary solution between ''French'' and ''of France''. Another reason for me to go with the noun was the fact that, from the perspective of the task force, me might want the categories to look similar: wars of ''France'', battles of ''France'', military equipment of/from ''France'', and so on. As I said, we can change the name of this particular cat once we all reach a consensus for the entire Project. [[User:Andres C.|Andrés C.]] 04:42, 23 May 2006 (UTC)
== Opération Daguet ==
Had a go at creating an article on [[Opération Daguet]], France in the first Gulf War. Hope it's OK. [[User:Chwyatt|Chwyatt]] 15:04, 4 July 2006 (UTC)
:Looks good. [[User:Kirill Lokshin|Kirill Lokshin]] 16:13, 4 July 2006 (UTC)
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