Talk:Seventh-day Adventist Church: Difference between revisions

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# [[Talk:Seventh-day Adventist Church/Archive 1|April 2004 &ndash; 5 March 2006]]

# [[Talk:Seventh-day Adventist Church/Graham Maxwell|Discussion regarding Graham Maxwell]]

# [[Talk:Seventh-day Adventist Church/Archive 2|15 February 2006 &ndash; 21 March 2006]]

# [[Talk:Seventh-day Adventist Church/Archive 3|26 March 2006 &ndash; 2 April 2006]]

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== SectNPOV tag on intro ==

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What is the part of the introduction that is clearly not NPOV? [[User:Ansell|<span style="color:#0000FF;">Ans</span>]][[User:Ansell/Esperanza|<span style="color:#009000;">e</span>]][[User talk:Ansell|<span style="color:#0000FF;">ll</span>]] 00:14, 19 April 2006 (UTC)

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== DMOZ forum links ==

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Wikipedia is not meant to provide a way for adventists to feel like they are a community by directing them to forums that they can use. Removing directory link again until a consensus is reached on this. [[User:Ansell|<span style="color:#0000FF;">Ans</span>]][[User:Ansell/Esperanza|<span style="color:#009000;">e</span>]][[User talk:Ansell|<span style="color:#0000FF;">ll</span>]] 00:14, 19 April 2006 (UTC)

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{{Archives|bot=Lowercase sigmabot III |age=60 |auto=long|[[Talk:Seventh-day Adventist Church/Graham Maxwell|Discussion regarding Graham Maxwell]]}}

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== Who trumps who ==

I don't see why there should be more than one screenful of links, which is how many are currently there. I tried to remove the least notable links, however, there may be others that can be put back in or still more that can be taken out if they are sufficiently notable. I think that having an equal number of links pointing out issues in the church, and links rebutting the sites which point out the issues is a good idea. It is as close to the NPOV that is desired for wikipedia as we will be able to get. After trawling through the section in response to the sectNPOV accusation which doesn't seem to be formally discussed here, I didn't see why the tag still needed to be there, so I removed it. [[User:Ansell|<span style="color:#0000FF;">Ans</span>]][[User:Ansell/Esperanza|<span style="color:#009000;">e</span>]][[User talk:Ansell|<span style="color:#0000FF;">ll</span>]] 00:42, 19 April 2006 (UTC)

Indiana University Press and Oxford University Press trump the General Conference of the SDA Church. Yup, here at Wikipedia they do. [[WP:NOTTHEOCRACY]].

: I don't see how Good News Unlimited is an opposing church position. [[User:MyNameIsNotBob|MyNam]][[User:MyNameIsNotBob/Esperanza|<font color="green">e</font>]][[User talk:MyNameIsNotBob|<font color="blue">'''IsNotBob'''</font>]] 00:57, 19 April 2006 (UTC)

If [[Ellen G. White]] were Nicene Trinitarian, [[James Springer White]] would have repudiated her.

::Feel free to rearrange, large changes wont be perfect. Maybe we need to figure out an acceptable structure that wont be prone to bloat like the one I replaced was. There was a different category for everything you could possibly want to see and I didn't see a way to keep the total number under control with such a system. [[User:Ansell|<span style="color:#0000FF;">Ans</span>]][[User:Ansell/Esperanza|<span style="color:#009000;">e</span>]][[User talk:Ansell|<span style="color:#0000FF;">ll</span>]] 01:09, 19 April 2006 (UTC)

{{blockquote|Strictly speaking, very seldom did Ellen White “do theology.” That is, she did not ordinarily do what professional theologians typically do. She did not produce a book of or about theology. She did not think, speak, and write in theological language. ... She did not elaborate a particular doctrine of the Trinity, atonement, God and time, or free will. She did not explain the precise meaning and broader implications of her own language and ideas, nor did she always use her theological vocabulary consistently. She did not endeavor to explain verbal or conceptual inconsistencies—either those of Scripture or her own—or to reduce the tensions inherent in her overall theological understanding. |Guy, p. 144-145}}

== What is the NPOV dispute? ==

At the risk of inflaming things again, may I ask why there is an NPOV tag on this article? As a neutral observer I see nothing egregiously unbalanced about this article. Can we get rid of some of those tags, or am I being too optimistic? --[[User:Rhombus|Rhombus]] 01:13, 20 April 2006 (UTC)

{{blockquote|With Adventism's most articulate spokesmen so implacably opposed to the doctrine of the Trinity, it is unsurprising that one researcher was forced to conclude that he was "unable to discover any evidence that 'many were Trinitarians' before 1898, nor has there been found any Trinitarian declaration written, prior to that date, by an Adventist writer other than Ellen G. White."⁴⁶ But even this is an overstatement. Although not actively anti-Trinitarian, Ellen White always carefully avoided using the term "Trinity," and her husband stated categorically that her visions did not support the Trinitarian creed.⁴⁷|Bull and Lockhart, p. 75}}

: I have removed the tag primarily due to lack of explanation as to its existence. The article remains poorly referenced however. [[User:MyNameIsNotBob|MyNam]][[User:MyNameIsNotBob/Esperanza|<font color="green">e</font>]][[User talk:MyNameIsNotBob|<font color="blue">'''IsNotBob'''</font>]] 01:47, 20 April 2006 (UTC)

There is no smoking gun that she ever endorsed Trinitarianism.

==External Links==

Here are some links I have removed from the main page for a variety of reasons in an attempt to make the external links more manageable. They are placed here mainly to keep track of what links where there.

{{blockquote|but in her version of the event that destroyed the unity of the divine realm—the rebellion of Satan. As White related in the ''Spirit of Prophecy,'' the devil's revolt against divine law came about precisely because Satan was unwilling to accept Jesus' position in the heavenly hierarchy. At that time Satan, who was then known as Lucifer, was "a high and exalted angel, next in honor to God's dear Son."¹³ It was an arrangement with which he had been happy, according to White, until a primordial ceremony formalized the supremacy of Jesus: "The Father then made known that it was ordained by himself that Christ, his Son, should be equal with himself."¹⁴ However, Satan believed that this decision had been taken without prior consultation, and he convened a meeting of the angels to air his grievances. A ruler had now been appointed over them, he said, and "he would no longer submit to this invasion of his rights and theirs."¹⁵|Bull and Lockhart, p. 72}}

* [http://www.pacificpress.com/ Pacific Press Publishing Association]

* [http://www.rhpa.org/ Review & Herald]

* [http://www.adventistbookcenter.com/ AdventistBookCenter.com]

See? She did not think that Jesus was ''born'' equal to the Father, but only later ''made so'' (i.e. promoted to such office). In her view, Jesus being promoted to equality with the Father was the cause of Lucifer's rebellion. So, her book does not make sense if Jesus was born equal to the Father. Which does not mean born by Mary about 4 BCE, but born by God in eternity past. Well, I'm still trying to make sense of her writings... Lucifer could not have been offended of something he knew for ages and had willingly accepted for ages. Lucifer could only be offended by a sudden change of roles. At least according to her story.

Moved to [[Independent ministries of the Seventh-day Adventist Church]]

<h3>Non-official ministries and entities<h3>

* [http://www.asiministries.org/ ASI Ministries] Adventist-Layman's Services and Industries

* [http://www.generalyouthconference.org/ General Youth Conference] Annual youth conference

* [http://www.prophecycode.org/ The Prophecy Code (Net 2005)] 2005 evangelism program hosted by Pastor Doug Bachelor

* [http://www.amazingfacts.org Amazing Facts]

* [http://www.truthaboutdeath.com/ TruthAboutDeath.com]

* [http://www.thequiethour.org/ The Quiet Hour]

* [http://www.adventistpulpit.com AdventistPulpit website]

{{blockquote|47. James White, "Mutual Obligation," ''Review'', 13 June 1871, 204.|Footnote 47 at p. 387 to Bull and Lockhart, p. 75}}

Moved to [[Criticism of the Seventh-day Adventist Church]]

<h3>Sites opposed to Seventh-day Adventism<h3>

* [http://www.formeradventist.com/ Former Adventist Fellowship]

* [http://www.lifeassuranceministries.org/ Life Assurance Ministries]

* [http://www.ellenwhite.org/ The Ellen White Research Project]

* [http://www.truthorfables.com/ Truth or Fables]

* [http://www.sdaoutreach.org/ SDA Outreach.org]

* [http://www.catholic.com/library/Seventh_Day_Adventism.asp Catholic.com article on Seventh-day Adventism]

* [http://www.goodnewsunlimited.org Good News Unlimited] ''not on criticism, but on GNU article''

* [http://www.missioncatalyst.org Mission Catalyst]

* [http://www.creationsda.org/ Creation Seventh Day Adventist Church]

If you'd ask me why she did not speak about the Trinity, either to assert it or to oppose it, a plausible reason is that she either did not understand or did not care for such abstractions.

<h3>Sites addressing anti-Adventist claims or intra-Adventist issues<h3>

* [http://www.sdaoutreach.com/ SDA Outreach.com] - Rebuttal of SDA Outreach.org

* [http://www.greatcontroversy.org/ GreatControversy.org]

* [http://www.pickle-publishing.com/papers/jeremiah-films/video-1.htm Pickle Publishing] - A critique of the [[Jeremiah Films]] Video: Seventh-day Adventism - The Spirit Behind the Church

Fritz Guy is a professor of theological studies at La Sierra University, Riverside, California. I.e. an Adventist university.

Not sure what to do with these

Malcolm Bull is professor of art and history of ideas at Ruskin School of Art from Oxford University. His BA is in theology.

<h3>Church Corruption Related links<h3>

* [http://www.steps2life.org/php/view_article.php?article_id=218 The Merikay McLeod Silver Case]

* [http://www.adventistreview.org/article.php?id=92 Adventist Leadership in Nazi Germany]

* [http://www.lightministries.com/SDA/id616.htm Organizational Practices]

* [http://www.history.ucsb.edu/projects/holocaust/Research/Proseminar/corrieschroder.htm The German Adventist compromise with the Nazi regime]

So, yeah, an Adventist professor of theology, a man, confessed that she neither spoke nor wrote as a theologian.

Cheers -[[User:Fermion|Fermion]] 07:21, 21 April 2006 (UTC)

And that obnoxious [[WP:SOCK]] has accused me of being crazy for doubting her Trinitarianism, an issue which is now settled by citing these professors (one of them being an Adventist professor). And I was insulted by someone who has solemnly declared {{tq|I'm pretty certain that most SDAs, aside from some liberal academics, would not assent to the Nicene Trinitarianism.}} So, I was insulted for doubting her Trinitarianism by an Adventist who does not buy into traditional Trinitarianism either. What's this, ''The Comedy of Errors''? Why would anyone insult somebody else who has just bolstered their own POV?

== To-do's for this article - "Can you help?" ==

So, answering the charge of the [[WP:SOCK]], according to Ellen White God the Son wasn't co-equal with God the Father since eternity past, but was promoted to co-equal with God the Father at a certain moment, this was a change of roles which offended Lucifer and caused his rebellion. At least as far as sense can be made of such convoluted story. Of course, there is also the possibility that it is an erratic, absurd story. [[User:tgeorgescu|tgeorgescu]] ([[User talk:tgeorgescu|talk]]) 04:52, 8 March 2022 (UTC)

Lets try to continue working towards a featured article, if possible. Currently the content is still rather weak and is also poorly referenced. Here are my suggestions on what need to be improved, feel free to add your own points: [[User:MyNameIsNotBob|MyNam]][[User:MyNameIsNotBob/Esperanza|<font color="green">e</font>]][[User talk:MyNameIsNotBob|<font color="blue">'''IsNotBob'''</font>]] 00:55, 24 April 2006 (UTC)

* '''Beliefs section.''' Currently this is a very brief summary, apart from the Sabbath section. One would almost be better off just reading the Fundamental Beliefs statements for themselves. The sections that are there currently need to be expanded and referenced from a number of sources. Currently the only two sources that are used in that section are the "Fundamental Beliefs" and "What we believe..." Adding some context and insight to each of these statements would be of great benefit. The section also lacks an explanation of the Adventist belief in "Investigative Judgment". Is there someone brave enough to write that?

And, to answer another charge: Fritz Guy tells it as it is, but there is no evidence that he has fallen from his faith. Through claiming that Guy would be an apostate, the obnoxious [[WP:SOCK]] has engaged in serious [[WP:BLP]] violations (their claim is libelous). Of course, this isn't a legal threat, just a statement that the sock has engaged in defamatory lies in order to dismiss [[WP:RS]] they do not like. Their defamatory statement is {{tq|The two books you quote from are by liberal academics and former SDAs who have an axe to grind about White and SDAism, as a result they are extremely unreliable sources.}} I don't think that the SDA Church him taught them to defame their fellow believers when they cannot win a rational dispute.

::Hi, I'm fairly new here, but I've made quite a few changes. I thought it would be a good idea to start a separate [[Seventh-day Adventist doctrine]] article which can go into more depth about a range of doctrinal issues (including the SDA distinctives). That way we can keep this article's doctrine section brief. I've also been "brave" enough to expand the [[investigative judgment]] article :-) [[User:Tonicthebrown|Tonicthebrown]] 12:07, 20 September 2006 (UTC)

So, the sock had oddly attacked me for bolstering their own POV, and hoped to bluff their way through telling patent lies about their fellow believers. No wonder that they got banned form Wikipedia. They wholly deserve it, since they have no respect for [[WP:SCHOLARSHIP]] and no respect for truth. They behaved like a caricature of the Christian apologist from the propaganda of New Atheism, attacking anyone who does not toe the line of their own prejudices. [[User:tgeorgescu|tgeorgescu]] ([[User talk:tgeorgescu|talk]]) 08:32, 24 June 2022 (UTC)

: I think that the section should be brief. The last time I touched that section my intention was to consider Adventists as adherring to mainstream evangelical theology, except diverging on three significant issues: state of the dead, sanctuary, and Sabbath. The only other thing worth clarifying is Adventists pre-millenial stance. -[[User:Fermion|Fermion]] 07:42, 24 April 2006 (UTC)

== References ==

:: SDAs also diverge from mainstream theology with the "great controversy" and "remnant" doctrines. I've expanded the "Second coming" section to include a clarification of the premillennial position. (Now moved to the [[Seventh-day Adventist doctrine]] article.) I've also created a new article - [[Eschatology (Adventist)]] which explains SDA end-times teaching in more detail, and what SDAs believe about the millennium.[[User:Tonicthebrown|Tonicthebrown]] 12:07, 20 September 2006 (UTC)

I counted that this article has 165 Seventh-day Adventist references and references that aren't Seventh-day Adventist are 53. [[User:Catfurball|Catfurball]] ([[User talk:Catfurball|talk]]) 21:33, 29 September 2022 (UTC)

:: Well what deserves inclusion, is what I did to the Sabbath part too much? Its hard to tell, there is no standard to go by. It strikes me as odd though that nothing is said about our sanctuary doctrine. [[User:MyNameIsNotBob|MyNam]][[User:MyNameIsNotBob/Esperanza|<font color="green">e</font>]][[User talk:MyNameIsNotBob|<font color="blue">'''IsNotBob'''</font>]] 07:56, 24 April 2006 (UTC)

== Protection request ==

::: I've added some material on the sanctuary, but perhaps it could be expanded further. May even deserve a separate article, if someone is inclined to do the work. [[User:Tonicthebrown|Tonicthebrown]] 12:07, 20 September 2006 (UTC)

{{reply to|78.26}} Can you please protect this article it has been persistantly been vandalized since October and it hasn't stopped. [[User:Catfurball|Catfurball]] ([[User talk:Catfurball|talk]]) 19:24, 10 November 2022 (UTC)

* '''Images.''' Currently the article is only text apart from the logo at the top. I am not sure the fair use tag on the image is properly justified either, I believe it can be and I have an email from the church verifying that. Is there someone familiar with fair use who can verify what needs to be done with that logo. Also another image or two might be nice to improve the asthetics of the aticle. Does someone have a camera with which they can go photograph a church building?

:What about an image of White or Bates? Or a classic second coming illustration?

:: I have put the photo of the Whites in there. Would like a church building as well, and maybe one other. [[User:MyNameIsNotBob|MyNam]][[User:MyNameIsNotBob/Esperanza|<font color="green">e</font>]][[User talk:MyNameIsNotBob|<font color="blue">'''IsNotBob'''</font>]] 07:56, 24 April 2006 (UTC)

* '''Origins section.''' This section is seriously lopsided, and not much help comes from the [[History of the Seventh-day Adventist Church]] page. Is there someone else interested in history research who can help me expand this? My main inhibition is lack of resources. Currently I am working off my brother's college textbooks and resources, which I have to steal to use :-).

:You might try and find "Lightbearers", as it is a very effective Seventh-day Adventist history book. [[User:MilquetoastCJW]]

::As in Schwarz and Greenleaf? [[User:Ansell|<span style="color:#0000FF;">Ans</span>]][[User:Ansell/Esperanza|<span style="color:#009000;">e</span>]][[User talk:Ansell|<span style="color:#0000FF;">ll</span>]] 04:44, 5 June 2006 (UTC)

:::I think thats what Milque is refering to. Thats one of my brothers textbooks that I steal when i get the chance. I have used it on [[History of the Seventh-day Adventist Church]]. [[User:MyNameIsNotBob|MyNam]][[User:MyNameIsNotBob/Esperanza|<font color="green">e</font>]][[User talk:MyNameIsNotBob|<font color="blue">'''IsNotBob'''</font>]] 08:41, 5 June 2006 (UTC)

== Requested protection ==

==Anabaptist tradition & present truth==

I've moved this from the main page, because I don't think these statements really fit at the opening of the "doctrine" section. Any ideas? Where would statements like this be more suitable? [[User:Tonicthebrown|Tonicthebrown]] 11:16, 17 September 2006 (UTC)

This article needs protection for a long time it constantly keeps being persecuted by stupid sockpuppet vandals, enough is enough. [[User:Catfurball|Catfurball]] ([[User talk:Catfurball|talk]]) 22:17, 10 May 2023 (UTC)

Seventh-day Adventist doctrine is based on the [[Anabaptist]] [[Protestant]] tradition. The Protestant understanding of the "priesthood of all believers" is so central to the thinking of Seventh-day Adventists that members have always been encouraged to study the Bible to discover "present truth" for themselves guided of the Holy Spirit.

:The best way to get a timely response is [[WP:RPP]] [[User:78.26|<span style="border:1px solid black;color:red; padding:1px;background:1h5h1h; color: #008B8B;"><b>78.26</b></span>]] _{([[User talk:78.26|spin me]] / [[Special:Contributions/78.26|revolutions]])} 02:15, 11 May 2023 (UTC)

== States all over the world ==

In witch states in our world are living some adventists? Perhabs in Central-Asia (Kazakhstan, Kyrgyzstan, Tajikistan, Usbekistan, Turkmenistan), Israel. In the Former USSR are living a lot of Germans. They are Mennonite and Baptists, but are there Seventh-Day-Adventists, too? Shalom, Simon. {{unsigned2|04:45, 29 April 2006| 84.169.215.238}}

:Have fun with the [http://www.adventistyearbook.org yearbook]. {{unsigned2|11:49, 27 May 2006| 69.241.140.121}}

== John Harvey Kellogg's religion. ==

== Creation Seventh Day Adventist Church ==

Although this article addresses that [[John Harvey Kellogg]]'s lifestyle beliefs align with the Seventh-day Adventists and that breakfast habits in the USA were fundamentally changed by him, it does not specifically say that he was a member like his own bio does (until he was ex-communicated, anyway). Somebody might want to sharpen the focus a little. Pointing this out was my job. Thank you for your time, [[User:Wordreader|Wordreader]] ([[User talk:Wordreader|talk]]) 15:21, 5 July 2024 (UTC)

[[Image:CSDASeal.jpg|thumb|right|The Official CSDA Logo]]

Persapicious recently deleted the CSDA (Creation Seventh Day Adventist) link from this article and vandalized the main CSDA article, but I want to clear up that the CSDA Church ''does'' have several members (there are around 100 overseas in Africa). Eugene (Persapicious) loathes the CSDA group because they preach against the SDA Church (not to mention Eugene's talked to some of the CSDAs and doesn't like them).

:Is 100 members really notable enough for a mention in the main article. There have to be more notable organisations that have split off. The main article is not the place to put every congregation which have ever split from the church, it outlines the major splits. If you have evidence to show that the split is not just a small scale thing, having a few members overseas doesn't seem to be enough here, then bring the evidence and we can decide whether it fits or not. [[User:Ansell|<span style="color:#0000FF;">Ans</span>]][[User:Ansell/Esperanza|<span style="color:#009000;">e</span>]][[User talk:Ansell|<span style="color:#0000FF;">ll</span>]] [[Wikipedia:Editor review/Ansell|Review my progress!]] 00:45, 29 May 2006 (UTC)

There are adventists in Latin America and in Africa and also in the Pacific.

[[Image:CSDALoc1.jpg|thumb|347px|left|Church House in Guys, TN]]

It seems to me that Walter McGill, a.k.a [[Creation Seventh Day Adventist Church]], tends to exaggerate. McGill's business address is listed as [http://www.yellowbook.com/Listings/Listing/88258989 Creation Seventh Day Adventist Church and Academy] and public records indicate that his academy only has three students.

http://www.state.tn.us/education/support/approval/doc/2006-07PrivateSchoolList.xls. http://www.state.tn.us/education/support/approval/doc/05_06privateschoollist_alpha.xls.

http://www.state.tn.us/education/ps2004_2005.xls. I wonder if there's any false reporting going on there. We're just talking about his own kids, right? The picture of his church prominently displays a big flashy sign but it's doubtful that his church and side business is larger than the average repair area at a typical gas station. McGill claims to have a sister church in Canada but his website there http://creationseventhdayadventistchurch.ca/ has no pictures of a church or even a Canadian church address and phone number, just a bunch of links to his main website http://csda.us/. Sure, McGill says that he also has church members in Africa and Australia, but they all live in the bush and it's virtually impossible to verify their existence. --[[User:E.Shubee|E.Shubee]] 20:36, 13 October 2006 (UTC)

Check out crossseach.com's listing for [http://www.crosssearch.com/Churches_and_Denominations/Denominations/Seventh-day_Adventist/7217.php The Association of Creation 7th Day Adventists]. It says, "The unity of this voluntary association of sister churches in the United States demonstrates to mankind that God so loved them that He sent His only Son into the world." Who was motivated to lie like that for Walter McGill? CSDA has no association of sister churches. --[[User:E.Shubee|E.Shubee]] 22:03, 13 October 2006 (UTC)

==Promoted to GA==

Why? It was fascinating to read, the prose is really good. The only thing that it misses in my opinion is inline citations (and I mean a bunch of them) to reach FA status because it is near it. [[User:Lincher|Lincher]] 03:35, 5 June 2006 (UTC)

==Quick question==

Is this true? "They believe that Protestants and Catholics will unite to enforce Sunday legislation, and that those who observe Sunday will receive the mark of the beast. They believe that violaters of this law will be given the death penalty." [[User:Adambiswanger1|Adambiswanger1]] 19:36, 6 June 2006 (UTC)

:I don't know myself. I havn't seen evidence of someone saying that. It is highly possible however that [[Ellen G. White]] said something like that but I would not know where to look. We are planning a big drive very soon to reference the article majorly, so after that we can be more justified in removing non-referenced material like that. [[User:Ansell|<span style="color:#0000FF;">Ans</span>]][[User:Ansell/Esperanza|<span style="color:#009000;">e</span>]][[User talk:Ansell|<span style="color:#0000FF;">ll</span>]] 00:40, 7 June 2006 (UTC)

I'm SDA. There are a couple of old SDA publications that say that. The belief is taught in prophecy classes, with those publications used as references. If only I could remember which ones. There are some things here I could shed some light on. But I forgot the publications they were in :(

I myself have come to believe that the mark is not Sunday, but a system where the government dictates to the church or the church to the state.

I was reading this page cause I saw something on the main that seemed biased statement against Ellen White. And I felt that someone should note it was not a NPOV entry. Particularly the opening paragraph to the entry in question. I could reword to make it more neutral. Something like "Adventists believe Ellen G. White is a prophetess. But some non adventist groups decrie her as a false prophet." I think that would be more in line with NPOV but I didn't want to alter your work since it looks like you are putting a good attempt at this. I'd just like to see a more of NPOV in some sections than there is. {{unsigned2|20:09, 1 July 2006| Vetobob}}

:Yes, you will hear it taught in prophecy seminars, in Sabbath school lessons, and from the pulpit. I think though, you will hear Adventist scholars present a more cautious approach which expresses ideas similar to what you believe. -[[User:Fermion|Fermion]] 01:04, 4 July 2006 (UTC)

I'm just curious. I've checked this page regularly. Two days ago, the artical oped with "is a christian denomonation" now it say "a christian cult" I'd like to know what and why the change was made. It's a very srtong change that one word makes.

Kaje

== Adventist hospital articles ==

People who edit this article may be interested in [[Accusations against Adventist Hospitals]] and [[Criticism of adventist hospitals]]. --[[User:Fang Aili|F]][[User:Fang Aili/Esperanza|<font color="green">a</font>]][[User:Fang Aili|ng Aili]] ^{[[User talk:Fang Aili|<font color="green">talk</font>]]} 17:02, 14 June 2006 (UTC)

:Thanks. It may have been left undiscovered for a while due to its lack of categorisation and lack of wikilinks to the topics it is describing. [[User:Ansell|<span style="color:#0000FF;">Ans</span>]][[User:Ansell/Esperanza|<span style="color:#009000;">e</span>]][[User talk:Ansell|<span style="color:#0000FF;">ll</span>]] 07:12, 15 June 2006 (UTC)

== Criticisms ==

I have commented out the criticisms section as it was being edited in an unproductive manner, leading to an increasingly POV result. I suggest a summary of [[Criticism of the Seventh-day Adventist Church]] be made, making use of the references used there. [[User:MyNameIsNotBob|MyNam]][[User:MyNameIsNotBob/Esperanza|<font color="green">e</font>]][[User talk:MyNameIsNotBob|<font color="blue">'''IsNotBob'''</font>]] 13:30, 22 July 2006 (UTC)

:Having an empty section does not help. I uncommented it and will hopefully be able to watch it to see if it develops, will try to get references from the main article as it is relatively well referenced. [[User:Ansell/Esperanza|<span style="color:#0000FF;">Ans<span style="color:#009000;">e</span>ll</span>]] 07:19, 23 August 2006 (UTC)

== GA Re-Review and In-line citations ==

''Note: This article has a very small number of in-line citations for an article of its size and currently would not pass criteria 2b.''<br>

Members of the [[Wikipedia:WikiProject Good articles]] are in the process of doing a re-review of current [[WP:GA|Good Article]] listings to ensure compliance with the standards of the [[WP:WIAGA|Good Article Criteria]]. (Discussion of the changes and re-review can be found [[Wikipedia talk:Good article candidates|here]]). A significant change to the GA criteria is the mandatory use of some sort of in-line citation (In accordance to [[WP:CITE]]) to be used in order for an article to pass the [[WP:V|verification]] and reference criteria. It is recommended that the article's editors take a look at the inclusion of in-line citations as well as how the article stacks up against the rest of the Good Article criteria. GA reviewers will give you at least a week's time from the date of this notice to work on the in-line citations before doing a full re-review and deciding if the article still merits being considered a Good Article or would need to be de-listed. If you have any questions, please don't hesitate to contact us on the Good Article project [[Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Good articles|talk page]] or you may contact me personally. On behalf of the Good Articles Project, I want to thank you for all the time and effort that you have put into working on this article and improving the overall quality of the Wikipedia project. [[User:Agne27|Agne]] 22:34, 25 September 2006 (UTC)

== Subcultures section ==

I can see the idea behind the new section however I am concerned about how encyclopedic it actually is. Our biggest problem on this article at this point in time is its '''severe''' lack of references. This needs to be addressed ASAP, and adding more unreferenced material just makes the problem worse. [[User:MyNameIsNotBob|MyNam]][[User:MyNameIsNotBob/Esperanza|<font color="green">e</font>]][[User talk:MyNameIsNotBob|<font color="blue">'''IsNotBob'''</font>]] 09:46, 5 October 2006 (UTC)

: I agree that the material is OR as is. Focusing on references is a definite first step. No time here right now, sorry bout that. [[User:Ansell/Esperanza|<span style="color:#0000FF;">Ans<span style="color:#009000;">e</span>ll</span>]] 21:38, 7 October 2006 (UTC)

== operates six international channels... ==

Could someone substantiate the recent [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Seventh-day_Adventist_Church&diff=80029729&oldid=79964991 edits] which refer to the church as operating six international channels. Not sure about it. [[User:Ansell/Esperanza|<span style="color:#0000FF;">Ans<span style="color:#009000;">e</span>ll</span>]] 21:38, 7 October 2006 (UTC)