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MiszaBot II (talk | contribs) m Archiving 3 thread(s) from Template talk:WPBannerMeta. |
MiszaBot II (talk | contribs) m Archiving 3 thread(s) from Template talk:WPBannerMeta. |
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:The reason it doesn't work is because if the value is blank, for AUTO_ASSESS_CAT or ATTENTION_CAT, WPBannerMeta uses the default value. What you have to do instead is pass through "none". I've edited the sandbox to do that. -- [[User:WOSlinker|WOSlinker]] ([[User talk:WOSlinker|talk]]) 18:17, 24 September 2009 (UTC)
::Ah, OK. Thanks for that. :) [[User:PC78|PC78]] ([[User talk:PC78|talk]]) 19:36, 24 September 2009 (UTC)
== Class → class ==
<small>I have placed a notification on [[Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Council]] about this proposal. — Martin <small>([[User:MSGJ|MSGJ]] · [[User talk:MSGJ|talk]])</small> 11:45, 9 September 2009 (UTC)</small>
Renaming thousands of categories may never happen, but we can at least change '''XXX-Class''' to '''XXX-class''' in all the text in the banner, and continue to link to the same categories, can't we? This will make it consistent with importance/priority which use a lowercase initial letter. — Martin <small>([[User:MSGJ|MSGJ]] · [[User talk:MSGJ|talk]])</small> 15:08, 7 September 2009 (UTC)
:Is this "think big" week? <tt>:D</tt> I can't see any real downsides with doing this. [[User:Happy-melon|<span style="color:forestgreen">'''Happy'''</span>]]‑[[User talk:Happy-melon|<span style="color:darkorange">'''melon'''</span>]] 15:59, 7 September 2009 (UTC)
::I'm not so keen. Simply changing it here would make things more ''in''consistant, with the categories (as noted above), with other non-WPBM banners, with the [[WP:1.0]] logs, and wherever else '''XXX-Class''' is commonly used. I'm certainly not against a capitalisation change, but would prefer it to be done across the board. [[User:PC78|PC78]] ([[User talk:PC78|talk]]) 16:14, 7 September 2009 (UTC)
:::Yes, but we have to start somewhere, and it makes sense to start on the most widely-used template. I don't mind tracking down other templates and changing them. — Martin <small>([[User:MSGJ|MSGJ]] · [[User talk:MSGJ|talk]])</small> 17:00, 7 September 2009 (UTC)
:::: In fact, things are pretty consistent... they use capitalization to refer to the classifications as proper nouns. Not sure the change is even worth all the work that would accompany it, so I'm edging it on not doing it. [[User:Titoxd|Tito<span style="color:#008000;">xd</span>]]<sup>([[User talk:Titoxd|?!?]] - [[WP:FAC|cool stuff]])</sup> 17:36, 9 September 2009 (UTC)
:::::The change is very easy. I will just change some "C"s to "c". As I said, I am ''not'' proposing to rename any categories; that would indeed be a lot of work. The inconsistency is between the capital C for Class and the little i for importance. Thus we have things like
{{WPBS|{{WPCHICAGO|category=no|importance=mid|class=stub}}}}
:::::and there is no reason the two should not be capitalised the same. — Martin <small>([[User:MSGJ|MSGJ]] · [[User talk:MSGJ|talk]])</small> 17:47, 9 September 2009 (UTC)
::::::Here's my problem: I'm all for switching to a lower-case "c", but not if it's just going to be a mere cosmetic change implemented here only. I would expect the categories to be dealt with as well, otherwise you're just trading one inconsistancy for another. [[User:PC78|PC78]] ([[User talk:PC78|talk]]) 17:56, 9 September 2009 (UTC)
:::::::What about capitalizing "importance" instead? [[User:Headbomb|Headbomb]] {<sup>[[User talk:Headbomb|ταλκ]]</sup><sub style="margin-left:-4.0ex;">[[Special:Contributions/Headbomb|κοντριβς]]</sub> – [[WP:PHYS|WP Physics]]} 09:25, 10 September 2009 (UTC)
::::::::Only marginally less work. There are 21,300 subcats of [[:Category:Articles by quality|Articles by quality]], and 6,500 subcats of [[:Category:Articles by importance|Articles by importance]]. In the general scheme of things, both numbers representa task of a similar magnitude. [[User:Happy-melon|<span style="color:forestgreen">'''Happy'''</span>]]‑[[User talk:Happy-melon|<span style="color:darkorange">'''melon'''</span>]] 11:58, 10 September 2009 (UTC)
::::::::This is certainly an alternative idea, but having them both lowercase would seem more correct to me personally. — Martin <small>([[User:MSGJ|MSGJ]] · [[User talk:MSGJ|talk]])</small> 09:23, 11 September 2009 (UTC)
:::::::I understand your point, and we can certainly talk about migrating the categories (and you should talk to [[User:Dinoguy1000|Dinoguy]] about that because he was interested). However, you have probably noticed that making sweeping changes is often pretty difficult here, and they are much more likely to succeed if they can be accomplished as a series of small steps. That is why I am suggesting this as an initial small step, as it would be trivial to implement. After using a lowercase c for several months, it would be much easier to make similar changes elsewhere or to make the case to move categories. — Martin <small>([[User:MSGJ|MSGJ]] · [[User talk:MSGJ|talk]])</small> 09:23, 11 September 2009 (UTC)
::::::::[[User talk:Dinoguy1000#Class -> class|Did somebody call me?]] =D I'd agree with this change, but personally, I'd rather see it made incrementally, as MSGJ and Happy-melon are recommending. The problem with making a sweeping change of simultaneously converting all instances of "Class" to "class", is that this is only one facet of the inconsistencies in the current system. Such a change would require a decent amount of planning and preparation, to make sure the change gets done reasonably quickly, without a lot of breakage or inconvenience for end-users and bots and the like. All this planning would, frankly, be a pain to do separately for every single such inconsistency (not to mention the large degree of duplication of effort), so if a sweeping change is to be made, I'd rather see [[User:Dinoguy1000/Assessment category RfC|everything discussed first]], with the whole community, and an agreement reached on exactly what to change and how to change it. This way, we have a central plan of action for all such changes, we can use the same resources for the entire thing, and we can get all of it done at once. On the other hand, if we're changing one system at a time (or even just changing *one* system, period, as has been tentatively suggested here), incremental steps mean we only have to deal with far more localized problems, and the different steps can be more easily parceled out to different users and done at different times, with little more planning than just making sure everyone is kept up-to-speed with what any one person is planning to do. <span style=white-space:nowrap>「[[User:Dinoguy1000|<span style=color:#00f>ダイノ<span style=color:#080>ガイ]][[Special:Contributions/Dinoguy1000|<span style=color:#F90>千？！]]」<sup>[[Help:IJP|?]] · [[User talk:Dinoguy1000#top|Talk⇒Dinoguy1000]]</sup></span> 19:09, 22 September 2009 (UTC)
:::::::::So, you support doing things "incrementally", but you also want to "get all of it done at once". Can you clarify what you mean because these seem to be opposite ;) — Martin <small>([[User:MSGJ|MSGJ]] · [[User talk:MSGJ|talk]])</small> 12:58, 29 September 2009 (UTC)
::::::::::Yes, I suppose my above comment ''was'' a bit confusing... Let me see if I can clarify (with extreme summarization; all my reasoning is already above): if we're only looking at changing "Class" to "class" for now, I'd prefer to see it done incrementally. If we want everything done at once, though, I would rather have [[User:Dinoguy1000/Assessment category RfC|'''everything''']] done at once. Does that resolve the apparent contradiction? =) <span style=white-space:nowrap>「[[User:Dinoguy1000|<span style=color:#00f>ダイノ<span style=color:#080>ガイ]][[Special:Contributions/Dinoguy1000|<span style=color:#F90>千？！]]」<sup>[[Help:IJP|?]] · [[User talk:Dinoguy1000#top|Talk⇒Dinoguy1000]]</sup></span> 18:38, 29 September 2009 (UTC)
:::::::::::Okay, so I will take your response as '''support''' for this small proposal, and I look forward to taking part in your RfC whenever you get round to it. — Martin <small>([[User:MSGJ|MSGJ]] · [[User talk:MSGJ|talk]])</small> 19:46, 29 September 2009 (UTC)
== Comments: revisting on old idea ==
Taken from [[Template talk:WPBannerMeta/Archive 3]]:
{{hidden archive top}}
I think the "edit · history · watch · purge" text looks a little bit clunky where it currently is. Might I suggest the following:
<pre style="overflow:auto; width:70em;"><td style="text-align:left; padding:0px; background-color:white; border:1px solid #c0c090; padding:5px; margin-top:5px;"><sup class=plainlinks><center>[{{fullurl:{{FULLPAGENAME}}/Comments|action=edit}} edit]{{·}} [{{fullurl:{{FULLPAGENAME}}/Comments|action=history}} history]{{·}} [{{fullurl:{{FULLPAGENAME}}/Comments|action=watch}} watch]{{·}} [{{fullurl:{{FULLPAGENAME}}|action=purge}} purge]</center></sup><br />{{{{FULLPAGENAME}}/Comments}}</td></pre>
which would move this into a centralised position within the actual comments box? In either case, note the unnecessary extra space preceeding the {{tlx|·}} templates. [[User:PC78|PC78]] ([[User talk:PC78|talk]]) 19:33, 3 January 2009 (UTC)
:IMO, it was better before (apart from the spaces before {{tlx|·}}). —[[User:Ms2ger|Ms2ger]] ([[User talk:Ms2ger|talk]]) 20:18, 3 January 2009 (UTC)
::Reverted. What does everyone else think? <font color="forestgreen">[[User:Happy-melon|'''Happy''']]</font>‑<font color="darkorange">[[User talk:Happy-melon|'''melon''']]</font> 22:58, 3 January 2009 (UTC)
:::Could we see the two options side by side? [[User talk:Msgj|Martin]] 09:18, 4 January 2009 (UTC)
This should give you a rough idea...
Current:
<table class="collapsible" style="background:transparent" width="100%">
<tr><th style="background:#F8EABA; text-align:left; padding:0px;">'''Comments:''' <sup class=plainlinks>[{{fullurl:{{FULLPAGENAME}}/Comments|action=edit}} edit] {{·}} [{{fullurl:{{FULLPAGENAME}}/Comments|action=history}} history] {{·}} [{{fullurl:{{FULLPAGENAME}}/Comments|action=watch}} watch] {{·}} [{{fullurl:{{FULLPAGENAME}}|action=purge}} purge]</sup></th></tr>
<tr><td style="text-align:left; padding:0px; background-color:white; border:1px solid #c0c090; padding:5px; margin-top:5px;">{{{{FULLPAGENAME}}/Comments}}</td>
</tr></table>
Proposed:
<table class="collapsible" style="background:transparent" width="100%">
<tr><th style="background:#F8EABA; text-align:left; padding:0px;">'''Comments:'''</th></tr>
<tr><td style="text-align:left; padding:0px; background-color:white; border:1px solid #c0c090; padding:5px; margin-top:5px;"><sup class=plainlinks><center>[{{fullurl:{{FULLPAGENAME}}/Comments|action=edit}} edit]{{·}} [{{fullurl:{{FULLPAGENAME}}/Comments|action=history}} history]{{·}} [{{fullurl:{{FULLPAGENAME}}/Comments|action=watch}} watch]{{·}} [{{fullurl:{{FULLPAGENAME}}|action=purge}} purge]</center></sup><br />{{{{FULLPAGENAME}}/Comments}}</td>
</tr></table>
FWIW I think the bottom one looks neater. [[User:PC78|PC78]] ([[User talk:PC78|talk]]) 12:58, 4 January 2009 (UTC)
:<s>I think I prefer the top one, if only because it takes up less room. You've got that orange bar doing not very much - might as well put the links in there. [[User talk:Msgj|Martin]] 13:05, 4 January 2009 (UTC)</s>
:Changing my mind. Space is not an issue because it won't be displayed unless "show" is clicked. And it ''is'' clearer. Hmm, I'm torn. [[User talk:Msgj|Martin]] 13:06, 4 January 2009 (UTC)
::For one thing I think it's more appropraite to have these links with the actual message. At a glance, with the comments section collapsed, it's not obvious what they're for. [[User:PC78|PC78]] ([[User talk:PC78|talk]]) 13:09, 4 January 2009 (UTC)
:::Okay, I support this change. Could I also suggest that the template checks not only that the /comments subpage ''exists'' but also that it ''contains something''? It's annoying when, occasionally, you go to check a comment and the comments have been blanked. [[User talk:Msgj|Martin]] 10:35, 5 January 2009 (UTC)
::::Would it be better if "purge" was "refresh" like it is on the [[:Template:Todo|Todo]] template? -- [[User:WOSlinker|WOSlinker]] ([[User talk:WOSlinker|talk]]) 20:57, 6 January 2009 (UTC)
:::::Probably. Might be an idea to add a link for "view" as well. [[User:PC78|PC78]] ([[User talk:PC78|talk]]) 21:10, 6 January 2009 (UTC)
This edit is to stop the archiving bot, as this thread is not concluded. [[User talk:Msgj|Martin]] 15:11, 15 January 2009 (UTC)
{{hidden archive bottom}}
I still think this is preferable to the current implementation, and the idea seemed to have some measure of support (from Martin at least) before it got buried in the archives. Any thoughts on revisiting this? [[User:PC78|PC78]] ([[User talk:PC78|talk]]) 13:24, 13 September 2009 (UTC)
:Incidentally, this would be consistant with {{tl|WPBannerMeta/hooks/todolist}}. [[User:PC78|PC78]] ([[User talk:PC78|talk]]) 18:36, 13 September 2009 (UTC)
::Weak support from me, as before. — Martin <small>([[User:MSGJ|MSGJ]] · [[User talk:MSGJ|talk]])</small> 12:05, 14 September 2009 (UTC)
::Feel free to add it to the todo list :) And sandboxes are available again. — Martin <small>([[User:MSGJ|MSGJ]] · [[User talk:MSGJ|talk]])</small> 09:02, 17 September 2009 (UTC)
:::Weak support from me as well, it's not exactly an earth-shattering change, but I do prefer the proposed layout. [[User:Happy-melon|<span style="color:forestgreen">'''Happy'''</span>]]‑[[User talk:Happy-melon|<span style="color:darkorange">'''melon'''</span>]] 14:26, 17 September 2009 (UTC)
Proposed code on [[Template:WPBannerMeta/comments/sandbox]]. Can you confirm that this is what you want? — Martin <small>([[User:MSGJ|MSGJ]] · [[User talk:MSGJ|talk]])</small> 11:37, 22 September 2009 (UTC)
:I've tweaked the padding a bit to sync it with {{tl|WPBannerMeta/hooks/todolist}} (though you could also go the other way and adjust the padding for the hook instead); actually, there is still an extra pixel between edit/history/watch/purge and the transcluded text, but I'm inclined to think that no-one but me will notice (and I don't know where it's coming from). :) Also, you should be able to remove "background:#F8EABA" from todolist; it doesn't appear to be necessary and I've been told before that hardcoding colours like that is bad for different skins. [[User:PC78|PC78]] ([[User talk:PC78|talk]]) 22:35, 22 September 2009 (UTC)
::Okay. It is possible that those padding settings were chosen so that the /comments section was consistent with other collapsed boxes, such as /collapsed and /bchecklist. Would you mind checking this out? Ideally the [show] buttons would all be aligned. — Martin <small>([[User:MSGJ|MSGJ]] · [[User talk:MSGJ|talk]])</small> 11:47, 24 September 2009 (UTC)
:::I've cobbled together a test banner at [[User talk:PC78/testbanner]]. I can't get "comments" to show here, though "comments" are in line with "to do". /bchecklist doesn't appear to line up with any of the others anyway. [[User:PC78|PC78]] ([[User talk:PC78|talk]]) 14:08, 24 September 2009 (UTC)
:::Right, I've reverted to your edit at {{tl|WPBannerMeta/comments/sandbox}} and tweaked the padding at {{tl|WPBannerMeta/hooks/todolist/sandbox}} instead; looks better now. [[User:PC78|PC78]] ([[User talk:PC78|talk]]) 19:55, 24 September 2009 (UTC)
I've made the changes to /comments and /todolist. — Martin <small>([[User:MSGJ|MSGJ]] · [[User talk:MSGJ|talk]])</small> 13:38, 29 September 2009 (UTC)
== [[Template:WikiProject Hazara]] ==
Bit of an odd one. I implemented a few fixes to this recently created banner in order for it to work properly. None of the relevant categories have been created, so I headed over to drop the project a line (and also about not handing out GA-Class assessments to any old article). Except the project appears to be just a single user, so I was going to contact the user directly except he's currently blocked. And so not having much of a clue what to do next, I'm leaving this note here in case anyone has any ideas. Is it worth helping this project/user set things up, or best holding off for now? [[User:PC78|PC78]] ([[User talk:PC78|talk]]) 01:46, 30 September 2009 (UTC)
:I've disabled the assessment categories for now. Maybe post at [[WT:COUNCIL]] and see what people think? Or [[WP:MfD]] if you think the project is a non-starter. — Martin <small>([[User:MSGJ|MSGJ]] · [[User talk:MSGJ|talk]])</small> 08:17, 30 September 2009 (UTC)
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