Wikimedia Meta-Wiki

Interwiki synchronization

This is an archived version of this page, as edited by Hillgentleman (talk | contribs) at 12:35, 9 May 2009 (+{{/Radioactivity}}). It may differ significantly from the current version.

This page is intended to host discussions between representatives from individual wikis regarding interlanguage links between Wikipedia articles.

Interlanguage links can often become entangled in conflicts. For example, if the page en:Emergency medical technician links to fr:Ambulancier, but fr:Ambulancier links to en:Paramedic, then that would be a conflict. This confuses the readers of Wikipedia and usually cannot be automatically maintained by interwiki bots (such as Interwiki.py). This inability to maintain links automatically frequently leads to lack of updates, stale links etc.

The task of synchronizing these links manually is hard, but challenging and interesting. A central hub for discussing this will foster further cooperation and concord between different language Wikipedias.

Encyclopedic truth is universal, so parallel ontology between Wikipedias in different languages is usually desirable, but it is important to emphasize that no Wikipedia can force its ontology on other Wikipedias, and any significant changes of this kind must be decided by consensus.

Future directions

In the future the technology of interlanguage links may significantly change thanks to the Interlanguage Extension; see A newer look at the interlanguage link. When this happens, the discussions about interwiki synchronization may move to the wiki that will be set up for this extension.

Automated analysis

The largest connected component in the graph of interlanguage links between articles contains well over 70'000 nodes (including over 3'000 from the English edition) and over 3'000'000 links. There are 24 more connected components with over 1'000 nodes. In total, there are about 60'000 inconsistent connected components in the graph. These figures are based on an analysis of snapshots from late August 2008.

It is next to impossible for a human to untangle the largest graphs anymore. Also, it is infeasible to process all 60'000 or so components, even if most of them are quite small. For that reason, an automatic meaning detection approach, even very imperfect, might be quite useful. An example of such automated analysis can be found here (a middle-sized component with approx. 300 articles and about 25 meanings), here are some more. The results show the identified meanings, the key nodes and links leading to semantic drift, and a complete set of links to remove to guarantee consistency. A description of the graph of meanings in the DOT language used by Graphviz is also provided. A batch edition based on the above results is possible.

Personally, I am strongly in favor of such an automated correction. Note that this would be a one-time action, which apparently has never been taken before. The 70'000+ component must have been growing for years: it contained about 48'000 articles in March 2008.

I'll gladly answer any questions regarding the idea, and upload more examples of analyzed components. If the suggested course of actions is approved by the community, I'd be glad to provide generated edit recommendations for all inconsistent components in a suitable format. I don't have the bot permissions nor the necessary experience, so I'm looking forward to a cooperation with a bot owner. I've performed the analysis for the graph of category interlanguage links too, and it requires similar action too.

This is an application of methods which I have developed during my PhD research, I'm currently in the process of writing two articles documenting the topology of the graph and the methods used to identify meanings. In short, the approach used here arranges the nodes in space using the force-based graph layout algorithm with a custom potential. Then, during the reconstruction of meanings, shorter links are considered to be more trustworthy.

Thanks, Bolo1729 22:41, 29 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Update: I've opened this service which presents all of the conflicts in which two or more English articles are involved (a little bit over 30'000 cases). In each case, edit recommendations are also presented. --Bolo1729 17:01, 4 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Opening a new case

  • After creating the case page, add its name to the top of the list in the "Current discussions section".

Current discussions

Apple vs. Malus domestica

The interwiki links in hsb:Jabłuko and hsb:Zahrodna jabłučina were mixed, although the first one has the topic apple (like a fruit, not a species) and the second one has the topic Malus domestica (a species). Yesterday I manually repaired this in the upper Sorbian articles only.

I found three groups.

Group 1

They are in hsb:Jabłuko (the fruit of trees in Malus genus).

I removed all interwiki links, which now are in the second group and have to be in third group and not had to be corrected in the second group.

Subgroup 1.1

A wider botanical concept of a type of fruit (i.e. the fruit of Apple tree, pear, etc.)

Group 2

They are in hsb:Zahrodna jabłučina (the species Malus domestica)

I removed some interwiki links, which was in it and has to be in the first group:

  • cs, el, ksh, la, lb, lv, lt, mg, oc, ru, sco

I corrected some interwiki links, whose old ones are now in the first group:

And I removed some interwiki links, which has to be in the third group. I corrected one link only.

Group 3

Some interwiki links where in both pages, but they have to be in the page hsb:Jabłučina, because its topic is the genus Maluṡ. But I am not added them there yet.

Discussion

I only corrected the articles hsb:Jabłuko and hsb:Zahrodna jabłučina in the upper Sorbian wikipedia and the Uppersorbian interwiki in de:Kulturapfel (an article about the fruit is not there). I hope, that anybody can help to correct this muddle. Greetings --Tlustulimu 17:26, 22 March 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Conclusion

<rishabh> </noinclude>

Finger vs. Digit (anatomy)

English "Finger" refers to the digit of the hand only. In many languages, there is no specific one-word term for finger, and they tend to link ther articles about digit (i.e. term describing both finger and toe) to en:Finger.

Group "Finger"

These articles should refer to digits of the hand only.

Other interwikis in en:Finger must be checked by native speakers. --Maxxicum 23:10, 12 March 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Group "Digit (anatomy)"

These articles should refer to terms which cover both fingers and toes.

Some interwikis from en:Finger might need to be moved into this group. --Maxxicum 23:10, 12 March 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Disambiguation pages directing to fingers and toes

These disambiguations might need to have another entry for the term that would describe fingers and toes collectively to match many other languages. --Maxxicum 23:10, 12 March 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Discussion

Some interwiki bots keep reverting my edits of interwiki and resuming the interwiki conflict. --Maxxicum 23:10, 12 March 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I have added some languages that were correctly linked with en:Finger. I believe eo:Fingro might be wrong. Without knowing esperanto, I would guess "kvin ekstremaĵoj de la mano aŭ de la piedo" means "five extremities of the hand or of the foot" Wikijens 09:29, 17 March 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks. --Maxxicum 23:18, 18 March 2009 (UTC)[reply]
I speak Esperanto. I was surprised. I thought eo:Fingro would go to en:Finger, however according to this online Esperanto dictionary it is like "digit". If you want to talk about the toe, it's piedfingro, and finger is manfingro. -- Yekrats 09:56, 20 March 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Thank you. This confirms that eo:fingro is en:Digit (anatomy). Let's correct the interwiki. --Maxxicum 19:37, 29 March 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Conclusion

Trauma

Iw-links concerning physical and psychological trauma are mixed up.

Group 1

Disambiguation page

Group 2

Psychological

Group 3

Physical

Group 4

Wound

Ungrouped

Discussion

I have tried to group all iw-links I have found.

In the case of Norwegian and Danish, the articles no:Traume and da:Traume mentions both the physical and psychological, but are mainly about the psychological, so I have placed them in this group. This could also be the case with Polish and Czech, but I'm not sure, since I don't know the languages.

Italian it:Ferita has mostly iw-links to en:Physical Trauma and equivalent, while etymological connected es:Herida, pt:Ferida and others are mostly grouped with en:Wound. I have added it:Trauma fisico to Group 3, and suggest it:Ferita be grouped with en:Wound.

Swedish sv:Trauma should probably be grouped with the disambiguation pages, only it is lacking the formal template.

Dutch nl:Verwonding, I'm not sure if fits better with en:Wound or en:Physical trauma. I think maybe the first even if now it links to the second.

There are several links to non-existing eo:Trauxmato. These should be removed. Also ro:Trauma has been deleted, but don't know if this is only temporarily.

All the slavic Rana or similar seem to be linked with en:Wound, so I guess this is correct. Russian and Ukranian ru:Травма and uk:Травма are both linked with en:Physical Trauma, but I can not judge if this is correct.

I hope somebody can fix the languages left (and correct any mistake I made) and place {{Done}} after the language if it is correctly placed and that someone with a bot can clear up all the links when all is cleared out. Wikijens 12:19, 7 March 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Conclusion

Tax

There are different articles which refer to similar concepts as en:Tax, but with subtle differences. I have found the following different groups, but I would appreciate any help to fix some doubtful articles.

Tax / Impost

  Done

Taxa (in catalan)

  Done

Another kind of taxation. Not the same as Tax! Note that ro:Taxa corresponds to en:Tax, which is somewhat misleading.

Tribut

  Done A more general form of tax.

Tribute

  Done Wealth one party gives to another as a sign of respect or, as was often case in historical situations, of submission or loyalty. (quoted from simple:tribute)

Note that in some romance languages (eg. ca: and es: but notably not fr:) the same word are used to mean en:tribute and the most general concept including all kind of taxes.

Some articles seem to focus on history in its region (uk:, ja:, zh:, ko: ...). I can't find out if these articles deal only with specific tributes.

Unclassified

  Done - no interwikis, per discussion

  • ru:Дань It's linked to en:tribute and others, but it looks like a desambiguation page with two meanings and a long "See also" section. (This is a guess from automated translation. Please place the article in correct group if you can read Russian)

Tributum

  Done

There's not much confusion with this historical term, but note that la:Tributum is not here.

French case

  Done

Just the particular case of France, but some wikis have (\had?) this iw as if it were the french article for en:Tax.

Tribute (Yanni album)

  Done

Discussion

Following an automated translation of the russian article for tribute, it seems that it is too general (it speaks even about spiritual tribute) and does not fit properly into the group of en:tribute and others (which refer to wealth one gives to another). Hence, if no one argues against that, probably the best option is to leave it without interwikis. --Meldor 00:34, 10 March 2009 (UTC)[reply]

It seems that bs:Porez and hi:कर belongs to the group of Tax. I add it to some wikis, so that the bots may add to the rest. --Meldor 20:44, 10 March 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Conclusion

  Done


I think iw-links between Featured articles-pages are ok, but in the case of Good artickes I think some are wrong. They might be former pages of featured articles or lists of denominated articles or lists of pages shown on front page. Please write {{Done}} behind your language if it is placed in the correct group and feel free to add more groups if necessary (denominated, shown on front page, featured lists etc.).

Group 1

Level 1 quality articles

Group 2

Level 2 quality articles

Group 3

Former Level 1 quality articles

Discussion

(Optional discussion.)

Conclusion

Occultation-Eclipse

Some iw-links seem to be confused between these two (some might also be confused with solar eclipse).

Group 1

Group 2

Group 3

Ungrouped

Discussion

Please place the ungrouped articles in the correct group (and correct the ones I have already placed if they are wrong). Wikijens 12:45, 18 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

zh:日食 = zh-yue:日食 = en:Solar eclipse, zh:蝕 (zh:食 (天文現象)) = ja:食 (天文) = en:Eclipse, ja:掩蔽 = zh:掩星 = en:occultation--Shizhao 15:10, 29 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Conclusion

Antarctica

 
Antar...something

For the south polar region, some languages use two different terms for the continent Antarctica (ru:Антарктида, pl:Antarktyda, no:Antarktika) and greater the Antarctic region (ru:Антарктика, pl:Antarktyka, no:Antarktis). Where available, the category for the continent is a subcategory of the region. In other languages these are considerd to be synonymous and only one name is used (en:Antarctica, sv:Antarktis). Odd enough, the -ica/-ika/-yka spelling is used for the continent in Norwegian, but for the region in Russian/Polish.

Both the articles and the categories have completely messed up interwiki clusters.

Should the langauges with separate terms be encouraged to merge them into one? We are merging prizes+medals+other honours into the more abstract "awards" category. I think it is unlikely that languages with a single term would introduce another one.

Lang Continent Greater region
en Antarctica, Category:Antarctica
sv Antarktis, Kategori:Antarktis
no Antarktika, Kategori:Antarktika Antarktis, Kategori:Antarktis
pl Antarktyda, Kategoria:Antarktyda Antarktyka, Kategoria:Antarktyka
ru Антарктида, Категория:Антарктида Антарктика, Категория:Антарктика

Discussion

Topic started by me. --LA2 02:41, 10 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]


Conclusion

Dollar

In Chinese (I don't know if there is another language like this), 銀圓 Just discuss the coin minted from the silver, no include the paper form or other forms.

Dollar, the currency of many countries

Discuss a name of the official currency in several countries.

Disambig

Some of the pages are defined as disambiguation.

Silver coin

Just discuss the coin minted from the silver, not including the paper form or other forms.

These are unclear

Currency

Discussion

Chinese

I think the correct interwiki of "Dollar" would be "元 (貨幣)" in Chinese. And the Chinese yuan, which is "元 (貨幣)" interwiki to, must interwiki to a non-exsit article of "元 (人民币)"。--Dingar 01:41, 15 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Is zh:元 (貨幣) really about currencies named "Dollar"? I don't know Chinese, but it seems that it is a general article about currency. It mentions Yen, Euro and others and Babelfish translates its title as "Yuan (currency)". --Amir E. Aharoni 17:50, 15 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Thank you! you are right. zh:元 (貨幣) include Yen, Euro, Dollar and others.--124.72.221.76 13:04, 20 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Sorry, I am forget to login yesterday. 124.72.221.76 is me.--Dingar 00:48, 22 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks, but it is still unclear where these Chinese articles should link. en:Currency? --Amir E. Aharoni 14:02, 22 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]

ar:, fa: and ur:

The ar:, fa: and ur: all belong to the Dollar part. I am moving them there. --Amir E. Aharoni 13:18, 15 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Conclusion

Brand and trademark

The interwiki linking of articles about trademarks and brands is pretty hard. They describe two main different, but somewhat overlapping concepts - "brand" as corporate identity in discussion of marketing and "trademark" as a legal term, which is separate, but quite related.

Here's how i tried to group the existing articles in different languages:

Brand

"Name, term, design, symbol, or any other feature that identifies one seller's good or service as distinct from those of other sellers."

Trademark

"Distinctive sign or indicator, used by an individual, business organization, or other legal entity, to identify that the products or services with which the trademark appears originate from a unique source, and to distinguish its products or services from those of other entities. Often indicated with ™, ℠ or ® (depending on legal status)."

Hard to understand

Wrong

This is definitely wrong, as this is just the disambiguation for the word "Serbian", but it appears on some articles.

Discussion

Can anyone please help with moving the links from the "Hard to understand" section to their right section? Of course, checking that the current grouping is correct would also be very helpful. --Amir E. Aharoni 14:00, 22 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Please check the automated analysis of this component. --Bolo1729 10:22, 30 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]

pl:Marka producenta

In fact this article describes both Brand and Trademark as if there one thing. The first line, translated to English, goes: "Brand, also known as manufacturer mark, trademark". I suggest removing them from interwiki linking until it'll get cut in two.


nl:Merk

As a native Dutch speaker, I understand your choice for nl:Merk's classification as "hard to understand". The article discusses various aspects of dealing with brands, including marketing and legal, but not very explicitly. One could split up the article, but that could destroy the "whole picture" of how brands fit into the (capitalistic) economy and how both aspects are inseparable: without identity it cannot be protected and without protection it fails as an identity. In the English Wikipedia, it could be argued that there should be a 'glue' article "Brand", a marketing article "Branding" and a legal article "Trademark". --nl:Gebruiker:Bdijkstra as 82.169.238.67 20:10, 22 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]

sq:Marka tregtare/sq:Marka tregëtare

Yes, sq:Marka tregtare and sq:Marka tregëtare are variant spellings of the same phrase, and I believe the former is correct (based on both a dictionary and google counts). They're talking about symbols and words that are intellectual property, not broader concepts like brand, so I suppose they correspond to "trademark". Unfortunately my Albanian isn't good enough to merge them myself, though I can stick a merge stamp on them. (Also, Emërtimet Tregtare translates literally as "trade names".) --sq:Përdoruesi:Steorra as 68.252.47.196 05:03, 24 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]

fr:Marque commerciale

fr:Marque commerciale clearly is about en:Trademark and its legal implications. Based on the title and most of the content, fr:Image de marque (literally "brand image") seems to be about en:Brand, although it links to en:Brand management. --Latebird 22:42, 1 November 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Conclusion

Remembrance day

Starting from ksh:Volkstrauertag via de:Volkstrauertag we come to:

  1. en:Volkstrauertag
  2. en:Remembrance Day
  3. en:Armistice Day

These days are all on the same date but are having different meanings. Luckily, en:Halloween was not number 4.

Solution: Isolate the meanings.

Problem 1: Maybe some other languages have still other meanings in the cluster which I am currently not aware of.

Problem 2: I can only handle an incomplete set of languages/scripts, so I cannot do it alone.

Discussion

  • HE: (checked, and didn't find any articles)
  • Volkstrauertag is on a different date.Andreas 15:49, 19 November 2008 (UTC)

(check and report more languages)

Conclusion

elementary-primary-comprehensive-school-education-etc

There are several starting point in various wikipedias, all having to do with elementary/basic/secondary/comprehensive/collaborative schools/schooling/learning/education.

They connect:

  1. en:Comprehensive school
  2. en:Elementary school
  3. en:Gastropoda — (see #Group 2)
  4. en:Gymnasium (school)
  5. en:High school
  6. en:Liceum ogólnokształcące — (see also #Group 1.A)
  7. en:Lyceum — (see #Group 1)
  8. en:Primary education
  9. en:Primary school
  10. en:Secondary education
  11. en:Secondary education in France#Lycée
  12. en:Slug — (see also #Group 2.B)

One of the problems apparently is that, school systems in different countries just do not compare. Likely, most school types apply to a much smaller set of countries (and thus likely, languages, too) than current interwiki links try to make us believe. --Purodha Blissenbach 21:59, 2 November 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Group 1

Starting from en:Lyceum gives a clean group:

  1. ca:Liceu (antiga Grècia)
  2. cs:Lyceum
  3. de:Lykeion
  4. el:Λύκειο
  5. en:Lyceum
  6. eo:Liceo
  7. es:Liceo
  8. fr:Lycée
  9. he:ליקיאון - Aristotle's school near Athens, est. 335 BCE
  10. hu:Líceum
  11. it:Liceo di Aristotele
  12. ja:リュケイオン
  13. nl:Lyceum
  14. pl:Lykeion
  15. pt:Liceu
  16. ru:Лицей
  17. sk:Lykeion
  18. sr:Лицеј
  19. sv:Lykeion
  20. tr:Lykeion

thus cutting all links from the others to this group might be a helpful step. --Purodha Blissenbach 23:50, 2 November 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Group 1.A

Starting from it:Liceo, things already get messy:

  1. cs:Lyceum
  2. de:Lyzeum ← not good: disambiguation. Links ignored.
  3. el:Λύκειο
  4. en:Lyceum
  5. fr:Lycée
  6. he:ליקיאון - Aristotle's school near Athens, est. 335 BCE
  7. hu:Lyceum → hu:Líceum
  8. it:Liceo
  9. ja:リセ
  10. pl:Liceum ogólnokształcące
  11. sr:Лицеј
  12. sv:Lykeion
  13. ca:Liceu (antiga Grècia)
  14. eo:Liceo
  15. es:Liceo
  16. nl:Lyceum
  17. pt:Liceu
  18. ru:Лицей
  19. sk:Lykeion
  20. tr:Lykeion
  21. uk:Середня загальноосвітня школа

Group 2

Starting from any of the following yields no problem links either:

  1. ar:بطنيات القدم
  2. bg:Коремоноги
  3. bs:Puževi
  4. ca:Gasteròpode
  5. cs:Plži
  6. da:Snegl
  7. de:Schnecken
  8. en:Gastropoda
  9. eo:Gastropodo
  10. es:Gastropoda
  11. et:Teod
  12. fa:شکم‌پایان
  13. fi:Kotilot
  14. fr:Gastropoda
  15. he:חלזונות - Gastropoda
  16. hr:Puževi
  17. hu:Csigák
  18. io:Gasteropodo
  19. is:Sniglar
  20. it:Gastropoda
  21. ja:腹足綱
  22. ka:მუცელფეხიანები
  23. ko:복족류
  24. la:Gastropoda
  25. lt:Pilvakojai
  26. lv:Gliemeži
  27. mk:Полжав
  28. nds-nl:Slekken
  29. nl:Slakken
  30. nn:Sniglar
  31. no:Snegler
  32. pl:Ślimaki
  33. pt:Gastrópodes
  34. qu:Wiksachaki
  35. ru:Брюхоногие
  36. simple:Gastropoda
  37. sk:Ulitníky
  38. sl:Polži
  39. sq:Kërmilli
  40. sr:Пужеви
  41. sv:Snäckor
  42. tr:Karından bacaklılar
  43. uk:Черевоногі
  44. zh:腹足纲

--Purodha Blissenbach 00:26, 3 November 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Group 2.B

starting from en:Slug yields a duplicate each for almost all languages, and collects all members of the above #Group 2, too. --Purodha Blissenbach 00:39, 3 November 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Discussion

I've uploaded an automatic analysis for this area, it's here. It is based on database snapshots from late August 2008.

At least three "bottlenecks" in the graph of meanings can be identified:

removed from en:Secondary education in France and fr:Lycée en France, changed interwiki to fa:لیسه (حلزون) elswhere. Andreas 15:42, 19 November 2008 (UTC)

Meaning 12

de:Klammeraffe ("@-sign") should be isolated. It is unrelated to en:slug (disambiguation). The link is caused by homonym hu:Csiga which means both "@" and "slug" as it appears to me. (Imho linking disambiguations other than literals (abbreviations, figures, codes) works usually only between related languages having very compatible sets of homonyms) --Purodha Blissenbach 21:43, 3 November 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I removed the interwikis from these pages. Andreas 14:23, 19 November 2008 (UTC)

Conclusion

Google

Currently, we have the situation where the search engine Google and the company Google Inc. are totally mixed up in the various interwikis. These need to be cleaned up and separated.

Search engine

Company

Unsorted

Wrong

Discussion

Here's an automated analysis of this component. Indeed: there are lots of incorrent interlanguage links between the meanings containing en:Google (meaning #9) and en:Google search (meaning #1). Interwikis to/from the two Bengali articles: bn:গুগল (সংখ্যা) and bn:গুগল (কোম্পানি) seem to be one of the core reasons of inconsistencies. --Bolo1729 11:25, 17 November 2008 (UTC)[reply]


Some languages don't distinguish between different google activities: they have one article for the google company, the search engine, and all other activities (gmail, gdocs, etc'). I suggest to classify such articles under a new category or under the google-company. What do you think? TaBaZzz 18:47, 6 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Going through the unknowns, I get to the following:

(still working on it as you see) - Andre Engels 08:44, 9 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Soldier - Military personnel

These two categories are interlinked:

In German, they do not seem to make a destintion between them, or they only have:

which is "person in the military" but actually, the category seems not to contain civil personnel, and only persons.

--77.190.85.110 22:36, 17 November 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I've run an analysis for this case. The graph of meanings clearly shows that en:Category:Military personnel is the central category in this case. There is quite a lot of confusion between that and en:Category:Generals, as well as en:Category:Soldiers. --Bolo1729 10:16, 18 November 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Civilian military persons? Hmmm... Actually, de:Kategorie:Militärperson includes the following subcategories containing (at least partly) civilians and/or noncombattants:
According to the respective articles, a en:Solder is a combattant with land forces only, while a de:Soldat is is a combattant in any military force. Because of that difference in scope, matching categories are not to be expected on that level. --Latebird 22:49, 5 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Microsoft .NET vs Framework .NET

It is a three way situation in the language th, tr, eu, it and fr there are is an articles about the subject Microsoft .NET and one about Framework .NET.

In there other languages there is only one article.


Group 1

The Microsoft .NET group


Group 2

The .NET Framework group


Group 3

Group 4

Discussion

On the French wiki They say

"Je pense que ces articles pourraient être fusionnés. Qu'en pensez-vous ? --Scls19fr (d) 1 mars 2008 à 22:25 (CET)

Oui, comme c'est déjà le cas dans plusieurs wiki étranger. En tout cas, je ne voit pas de différences entre les 2. D'ailleurs, les 2 pages étaient fusionnées à l'origine et les pages de discussions sont encore communes! Romainhk (QTx10) 4 mars 2008 à 21:30 (CET)"
  • Somewhere else but also copied on the dutch wiki they say

" Hello, there is problem with two articles (Microsoft .NET and .NET Framework) on several wiki's. I think, that the best solution is to merge these articles, but it mus do people on these languages. JAn Dudík 8 sep 2008 17:01 (CEST)

I see. So we'll wait until it is changed in the other language, right? --Halvar 8 sep 2008 19:30 (CEST)"

from the danish .net talkpage

Please, choose the correct interwiki. On 8 langages are two articles, .NET Framework and Microsoft .Net. You have mixed both versions. Name and most interwiki is like Microsoft .NET, but you still revert changes. Now I make second version, so, you may choose. 77.48.45.229 2. nov 2007, 07:21 (CET)

Could you please specify which 8 languages that have two articles? On enWiki, en:Microsoft .Net is a redirect to en:.NET Framework, on svWiki, sv:Microsoft .Net redirects to sv:Dotnet, on deWiki de:Microsoft .NET redirects to de:.NET - I haven't been able to find a single of the dual versions you are referring to. If you believe that some interwiki links are incorrect, then please specify them here, along with a reason why you think they are incorrect. -- JGC 2. nov 2007, 09:30 (CET)

First set: 

bs:Microsoft .NET
ca:.NET
cs:.NET
de:.NET
es:.NET
eu:.NET
fi:.NET
fr:Microsoft .NET
he:.NET
hr:.NET
hu:Microsoft .NET
it:Microsoft .NET
nl:.NET
no:.NET
pl:.NET
pt:Microsoft .NET
ru:Microsoft .NET
sl:Microsoft .NET
sv:Dotnet
ta:மைக்ராசாஃப்ட் .நெட்
th:Microsoft .NET
tr:NoktaNet
uk:Microsoft .NET

Second set: 

ar:إطار‌عمل دوت‌نت
bg:.NET Framework
en:.NET Framework
es:.NET Framework
eu:.NET Framework
fr:Framework .NET
it:.NET Framework
ja:.NET Framework
ko:닷넷 프레임워크
lt:.NET Framework
pl:.NET Framework
ru:.NET Framework
th:ดอตเน็ตเฟรมเวิร์ก
tr:.NET Framework
zh:.NET Framework

Two artices are in: es,eu,fr,it,pl,ru,th,trTemplate:Usigneret

I have changed your lists to make them clickable. I would be glad if you tried to describe the definition of the first vs the second set - none of the 8 wikis that do distinguish, are in a language that I understand. If I guess correctly, you would like the interwikis to distinguish between .NET as a development platform and .NET as a software component. There may be some reason in doing this, however I believe that when most wikis only have one article about .NET - and many of them quite elaborate ones - it will be a mistake to split them in different sets, according to which "main focus" they might have. As far as I can see, the "one .NET article"-wikis have articles that more or less covers both aspects of .NET - and to delink some of them, because a smaller group of wikis have two different .NET articles, would - in my mind - be a mistake. -- JGC 2. nov 2007, 14:31 (CET)

I don!t understant this problematic (and from these languages only little bit pl), But I run interwiki bot and these articles are problematic. Yes, maybe the best solution would be if all languages have only one article... 77.48.45.229 9. nov 2007, 16:15 (CET) ([:cs:User:JAn Dudík]])


About the name of the articles that is answered very well on the german wiki "Sollte dieser Artikel nicht richtigerweise auf .NET Framework lauten ?"

Ich bin etwas verwirrt bezüglich der Namensgebung für diesen Artikel. Ursprünglich gab es ja mal eine Menge von Softwareprodukten aus dem Hause Microsoft, die den Namen .NET tragen sollten bzw. es sollte alles irgendwie mal .NET sein. Übrig geblieben ist davon letztendlich das .NET Framework, das in diesem Artikel ja auch (ausschließlich) beschrieben wird. Ich denke der Korrektheit halber sollte der Artikel daher auch .NET Framework und nicht .NET heißen. Insbesondere da .NET mittlerweile semantisch nur noch als Abkürzung für das .NET Framework bzw. für Technologien, die im Rahmen des .NET Frameworks realisiert wurden, verwendet wird.

--Robert Niemann 12:40, 29. Aug. 2008 (CEST)

sehe ich genauso. Was meinen die anderen? --Kurt Seebauer 09:56, 30. Aug. 2008 (CEST)
Ich ebenfalls.
Sehe ich ebenso. .NET ist die Technologie, um diese nutzen zu können, braucht man ein .NET Framework. Diese kann, muss aber (Beispiel Mono) nicht von MS sein. Das für Windows heißt bei MS gaaaanz offiziel: .NET Framework. Es verhält sich ähnlich wie bei J2EE: J2EE ist eine Spezifikation und kein Produkt, analog .NET. .NET ist die Spezifikation, das Framework die technische Umsetzung. Es scheint so als haben die Autoren dieses Artikel nie bei MS vorbeigeschaut - dort ist stets vom .NET Framework die Rede - der erste Weblink ist das beste Beispiel. PF20080901


In short my point of view

.Net is the general name and .NET Framework or Microsoft ,NET are the names you use if you are talking from one POV and that is view that there is only OS in the world. So the last four last versions that not merged need to merged and the rest needs to renamed to .NET Carsrac 08:39, 20 November 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Conclusion

Rice

en:Rice, which is concidered an important article lacks a lot of iw-links, probably due to some iw-conflict.

Group 1

Links from en:Rice

Group 2

Links from no:ris

Discussion

This is the way they are grouped at the moment, not how I suggest they should be grouped. Some languages have the same article included in both groups, while a few have different articles. English has no article in group 1, so maybe the best starting point is one of the languages with two articles (f.x. cs), and then the others can be placed where they fit better. Wikijens 18:28, 9 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Lang General Oryza Oryza sativa (asian) Oryza glaberrima (african)
en Rice Oryza Oryza sativa African rice
cs Rýže Rýže setá
ko 벼 쌀
ja 米 イネ
zh 稻属 稻
uk Рис Рис (рід) Рис посівний Рис африканський
es Oryza Oryza sativa
it Riso (alimento) Oryza sativa
is Hrísgrjón

An attempt to classify the articles. I don't understand all these languages, so it's just a guess. Please correct any mistakes. English article Oryza sativa has no iw's at the moment. Wikijens 13:06, 10 January 2009 (UTC) I have expanded the table a bit. Spanish article Oryza sativa seems to describe rice in general and might fot better in the first group. Wikijens 14:36, 10 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

It is correct that ja:イネ is about Oryza sativa. But ja:米 is about cooked rice. --Fryed-peach 17:27, 11 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Sorry, that is wrong. --Fryed-peach 05:10, 2 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Conclusion

Contre-la-montre-Time trial

There is an iw-conflict concerning the term time trial in cycling and other sports. French has an article fr:Contre-la-montre about the phenomenon in cycling (both individual and team version in same article). English has an article en:Time trial which is more general (not only cycling) and two seperate articles for cycling (en:Individual time trial and en:Team time trial.

Group 1

General (all sports)

Group 2

Cycling (individual and team)

Group 3

Cycling (individual)

Group 4

Cycling (team)

Discussion

I just added a few languages in each group. Wikijens 13:00, 21 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Conclusion

A Few Good Men

Describe the case here: what is the starting point of the problem, what causes the conflict, write a general proposal for fixing.

If it is possible, try to find out which are the groups of articles that should be fixed and list them here by language. Try giving every group a meaningful name.

a 1992 film

a play by Aaron Sorkin

Discussion

(Optional discussion.)

Conclusion

Radioactivity

en:Radioactivity redirects to en:Radioactive decay. That could be a problem:

en:radioactivity

zh:放射性 (Hillgentleman removed the interwiki links, added one pointing to en:radioactivity, and added template:nobot)

en:radioactive decay

zh:放射性衰变

Archived discussions

September 2008

October 2008


See also

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