Talk:List of English words containing Q not followed by U
Moving to Wiktionary
I don't think this belongs on Wiktionary. If this is moved then surely almost everything else in Category:Lists_of_English_words ought to be moved too? It's also encyclopaedic in that it gives justification for the existence of Q-no-U words, and their origins. Admittedly this section needs expanding, but it is fundamentally encyclopaedic. Your thoughts please. Agentsoo 23:46, 15 July 2005 (UTC)
VfD discussion
This article was recently nominated for deletion but kept by default of no consensus being reached. See Wikipedia:Votes for deletion/List of English words containing a Q not followed by a U for the archived discussion. -- Francs2000 | Talk File:Uk flag large.png 11:38, 7 August 2005 (UTC)
Puzzled
Recently a user has added many words to the list, but in the process it has become much less user-friendly. Can we return to the lowercase format with an explanation of the meaning of each word, please? -- Visviva 06:18, 14 August 2005 (UTC)
- My thoughts on the matter:
- It was good when the words were links. That so many of them have articles disproves the argument that these are "not real words".
- I liked the definitions. Most of them are so brief or generic that we are unlikely to infringe any copyright.
- Writing them in upper case is a Scrabble convention, but this is not a Scrabble word list, it's a list of words. Same for ordering them by length.
- We should have some kind of system for indicating which dictionaries include which words. My original list was drawn from Chambers. I'd be willing to look through the ODE too.
I'm sure we can reach a concensus on this :) Soo 11:48, 15 August 2005 (UTC)
Moved from article page
DISPUTED: These are not valid words in English. These are not naturalized words, nor are they accepted loanwords. In the cases where it is only a transcription into the roman alphabet, the representation of these words in English uses "k" not "q". Nothing in this list is considered a "word" in the English language. (comment from User:Connel MacKenzie).
- They are valid words in English. Please consult a dictionary. Soo 11:48, 15 August 2005 (UTC)
- While most of these may appear in a dictionary with a "k", many do not appear with a "q". Here's a few links from dictionary.com: Tariqat, Tsaddiq, Talaq, Mbaqangas. Now, there may be more comprehensive dictionaries, but I think this is valid concern. Carbonite | Talk 11:58, 15 August 2005 (UTC)
- Dictionary.com is quite poor for recent loanwords I find. All these words can be found in at least one major dictionary published from 1900- onwards. We are working on the problem of referencing which one(s); see the discussion above. Soo 13:22, 15 August 2005 (UTC)
- I've quoted my source. If anyone wants to check the source, they're free to do so. If anyone wants to revert to a previous version, that's fine. I will however, state that I'm going to incorporate the definitions very soon. If anyone wants to prune the list down, that's fine, but I've still got work to do on it. I apologise for making this page awkward all of a sudden. Bobo192|Edits
- Dictionary.com is quite poor for recent loanwords I find. All these words can be found in at least one major dictionary published from 1900- onwards. We are working on the problem of referencing which one(s); see the discussion above. Soo 13:22, 15 August 2005 (UTC)
- While most of these may appear in a dictionary with a "k", many do not appear with a "q". Here's a few links from dictionary.com: Tariqat, Tsaddiq, Talaq, Mbaqangas. Now, there may be more comprehensive dictionaries, but I think this is valid concern. Carbonite | Talk 11:58, 15 August 2005 (UTC)
Definitions complete
I've done the definitions. I may go and see if I can root out any of these dictionaries, particularly Funk and Wagnalls, which I'm absolutely positive is one of the more obscure dictionaries I just have lying around someplace. Bobo192|Edits
Scrabble stuff
I'm sure that for the purposes of playing Scrabble there is a point in giving words in ALL-CAPS and including the plural form of each word under a separate heading. On this page, however, it is completely useless. I VfD'd this page, as I found it rather pointless as a stand-alone list. It survived but has since deteriorated with the introduction of the Scrabble word list, compared to the list compiled by the original author from real dictionaries. Tupsharru 05:05, 16 August 2005 (UTC)
Things that need doing on this page
Return to alphabetical order, with lower-case words, and plurals mentioned under the singular (not individual entries). This list is useful for Scrabble no doubt but it is not a Scrabble list.Done.Link words to their articles where possible, or at least to Wiktionary.Done.- Cite which dictionaries contain which word, to avoid disputes.
- A couple of the short definitions probably need rewording, but this is minor.
I'll get to work on this in the next few days, so comment now to avoid disappointment. Soo 18:25, 16 August 2005 (UTC)
- Agreed on most. I think the only plurals that we should perhaps note are those which are irregular, such as faqir>fuqaha. I reworded the definitions from a single source, so these are more-or-less consistent, please edit these up as you see fit. Dictionary citations would also be useful, if we can work out which ones are in which. Some good ideas. Bobo192|Edits
- Agreed on the irregular plurals, of which there are a decent number since so many of these are loanwords. By the way, talaq appears in Chambers '98 and '03, so I've restored it. Soo 18:32, 16 August 2005 (UTC)
- Thank you for restoring some much needed order to this, Soo. This is the best I've seen this page since before I messed with it. Bobo192|Edits
- Now for step 3! Soo 00:16, 17 August 2005 (UTC)
- Thank you for restoring some much needed order to this, Soo. This is the best I've seen this page since before I messed with it. Bobo192|Edits
Sourcing
I have begun the task of locating the specific dictionaries that each of these words are located in. I suggest that we search as many dictionaries as we can get our hands on. Any words that remain unsourced after that should be moved to this talk page, under a "source wanted" banner or similar. Hopefully the use of numbered references will avoid cluttering the page, although if anyone can think of a better way of doing it then I'd love to hear it.
Checking whether a dictionary supports a particular word is sometimes tricky. For example, the ODE 2nd Ed gives qwerty as an adjective, so it does not support the words qwerties or qwertys - see the page for the way I've handled this (which may not be ideal). As stated on the page itself, the word must be naturalised (many dictionaries print unnaturalised words in italics, but check each individually) and occuring on its own, not as part of a phrase; for example, the ODE gives coq au vin but not coq per se, so we cannot say that the ODE supports the word coq. For the sake of argument, we will assume that all mass nouns can be pluralised, unless your dictionary specifically states otherwise. Soo 12:00, 21 August 2005 (UTC)
Qvintins
I have removed qvintins, as it was given as the plural of qvintin, which is itself the plural of qvint. If this is just a definition error then it can be restored later. Soo 13:17, 21 August 2005 (UTC)