Talk:Firearms regulation in the United Kingdom
Source claim
There ought to be a sourcing for the following claim: "This is approximately double what it was fifty years ago, when gun laws were much more tolerant, and comparable with Switzerland today, where, again, gun laws are extremely tolerant."
Otherwise it should be removed. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 213.54.170.127 (talk) 22:49, 18 August 2005 (UTC)
- The homicide rate figures are from the UK Home Office, which you could check for yourself by asking for them (that's how I got them). The figure for Switzerland I can't remember the source for, but it's reliable. The facts that UK laws were much more tolerant fifty years ago, and that Switzerland has extremely tolerant laws today, are well known to anyone seriously interested in the subject. Alex Swanson 00:21, 20 August 2005 (UTC)
What relevance do the violent crime statistics have to gun politics? It is possible to be violent without a gun and 50% of violent crimes involve no injury to the victim.News — Preceding unsigned comment added by 129.31.85.54 (talk) 11:42, 22 October 2005 (UTC)
- The relevance is that you cannot separate out gun crimes in particular from crime in general. For example, it would be pointless to pass laws which reduced the number of homicides committed with firearms if the offenders simply used knives instead. Also, it is arguable that gun crime simply represents the extreme end of a general spectrum of crime which includes violent crime in general; thus, if you could make society as a whole more peaceful, then the number of gun crimes in particular would go down even without any specific action in that area. Alex Swanson 21:54, 29 November 2005 (UTC).
I've re-inserted the homicide likelihood comparison Britain-USA as circumstancial evidence for the correlation between the number of homicides and gun politics. That correlation is further substantiated by the 70% to 6% information, which supports the theory that ready availability of guns increases the likelihood of homicides in absolute numbers as well as the relative likelihood of a homicide being committed with a gun compared to any other mean. --Neil Jonsson 15:34, 28 December 2005 (UTC)
Opinion poll
"According to opinion polls, around 75% of the British public favour even stricter controls on gun ownership."
Can we verify these statistics? I suggest a reference to the opnion poll(s)is added to article or else this section should be removed.
- I went ahead and removed the opinion poll claim until it can be substantiated. 137.205.139.251
Homebrew
Reckon its worth adding a paragraph on Philip Luty? The guy who was imprisoned for building his own gun and writing a book about home gunsmithing. - FrancisTyers 15:21, 21 May 2005 (UTC)
- Never heard of that, but wouldn't that be illegal in a whole lot of places? Notinasnaid 15:59, 21 May 2005 (UTC)
- In the U.S., building a Title I gun (handgun, rifle, shotgun, not automatic nor otherwise classed as Title II) for personal use is perfectly legal. It doesn't even have to have a serial number, but BATFE has expressed a preference for homebuilt guns to have serial numbers. 208.40.64.2 14:45, 31 May 2005 (UTC)
- Dunno, check out his site: http://www.thehomegunsmith.com - FrancisTyers 16:15, 21 May 2005 (UTC)
Exports
I have removed the comment about exports on the basis such exports are typically to governments and hence the issue isn't relevant to this article, which discusses the laws relating to private individuals. Alex Swanson 00:25, 20 August 2005 (UTC)
Airgun restrictions
Britain is preparing to place heavy restrictions on airguns as well. Should we include this in the article, or wait until the bill either passes or fails? Rogue 9 20:35, 17 October 2005 (UTC)
Suggest waiting, since current intentions aren't clear. Alex Swanson 08:15, 21 October 2005 (UTC)
Homicide involving firearms figures
These come from BBC, to pre-emptively defend them. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 129.31.85.54 (talk) 19:54, 21 November 2005 (UTC)
General use of statistics
"From June 2003 to June 2004, recorded gun crime in the UK rose by 3% to 10,590 incidents. There was also a 14% rise in violent crime in the April-June period (265,800 incidents compared to 223,600 the previous year). Advocates on both sides of the gun control debate have argued how this is correctly interpreted with no consensus." This extract in particular shows a use of statistics biased towards gun liberties. 3% is not a significant change. Similarly the quote of the April-June period of 2004 is poor statistics. It implies that small samples were taken until a trend was found which fits the author's viewpoint. The British Crime Survey figures also are ignored. These, coincidentally, show that violent and gun crime has decreased since 1997. Other factors excluded are the fact that a new system of counting and several new offences were introduced by the Home Office in 1998, making it difficult to compare statistics before and after. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 129.31.85.54 (talk) 21:49, 21 November 2005 (UTC)
- While I take your general point, whether a 3% rise is significant or not is a matter of opinion. In my experience, very few people on either side of the argument dispute that gun crime has risen steadily in recent years, and is still rising. Anti-liberty campaigners argue that this shows the need for further new laws; pro-liberty groups argue that it demonstrates the ineffectiveness of past laws, which were, indisputably, justified at the time on the basis that they would improve public safety. Incidentally, wouldn't it be sociable to include your name and the date in your comment? Alex Swanson 22:00, 29 November 2005 (UTC)
USA
Why does this article have so much information about the USA, statistics etc.? How are they relevant to the UK? - FrancisTyers 15:35, 28 December 2005 (UTC)
- Nevertheless, 70% of homicides in the United States involve firearms compared to 6% in the United Kingdom.
I've removed this from the page pending a source. - FrancisTyers 15:46, 28 December 2005 (UTC)