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Wikipedia:Requests for comment/Gzornenplatz

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This is an old revision of this page, as edited by Ugen64 (talk | contribs) at 20:42, 5 October 2004 (→Description). The present address (URL) is a permanent link to this revision, which may differ significantly from the current revision.

In order to remain listed at Wikipedia:Requests for comment, at least two people need to show that they tried to resolve a dispute with this user and have failed. This must involve the same dispute, not different disputes. The persons complaining must provide evidence of their efforts, and each of them must certify it by signing this page with ~~~~. If this does not happen within 48 hours of the creation of this dispute page (which was: 02:04, Oct 4, 2004 (UTC)), the page will be deleted. The current date and time is: 21:31, 26 August 2025 (UTC).

Statement of the dispute

This is a summary written by users who dispute this user's conduct. Users signing other sections should not edit here.

Description

Gzornenplatz has engaged in frequent edit wars on many pages, including Nagaland and George W. Bush. He has refused, on various notes, to discuss these edits with his edit war counterparts, and has therefore disrupted the Wikipedia (by forcing protection on several articles on which he edit warred). I am, therefore, most respectfully requesting your comments.

Additionally, as I added on October 5, 2004 (around 20:38, UTC), he made a personal attack on Sam Spade's request for adminship, and have therefore modified the diffs and policies involved to include that.

Evidence of disputed behavior

(provide diffs and links)

  1. (20:38, Oct 5, 2004 (UTC)) - [1] (personal attack on User:Sam Spade on his request for adminship)
  2. (20:21, Oct 4, 2004 (UTC)) - [2] (six reverts [and one de facto revert] between 09:42, 4 Oct 2004 and 15:54, 4 Oct 2004 on Pila, now protected)
  3. [3], [4], [5], [6] (four reverts between 23:32, 2 Oct 2004 and 20:40, 3 Oct 2004 on Nagaland, now protected)
  4. [7] (seven reverts between 21:18, 2 Oct 2004 and 18:19, 3 Oct 2004 on Empire of Atlantium, now protected)
  5. [8] (seven reverts between 18:17, 2 Oct 2004 and 21:33, 2 Oct 2004; two reverts [related to the previous] between 19:13, 1 Oct 2004 and 20:28, 1 Oct 2004 at [9] and [10]; six reverts between 13:32, 28 Sept 2004 and 20:40, 28 Sept 2004; at George W. Bush; protected then unprotected as a result of the first war, still protected due to the most recent war)
  6. [11] (three reverts between 22:35, 30 Sept 2004 and 01:13, 1 Oct 2004; three reverts between 05:39, 28 Sept 2004 and 08:50, 28 Sept 2004; three reverts between 00:36, 18 Sept 2004 and 03:45, 18 Sept 2004 on List of island nations)
  7. [12] (six reverts between 10:16, 27 Sept 2004 and 18:56, 28 Sept 2004; five reverts between 05:24, 23 Sept 2004 and 05:00, 24 Sept 2004; several partial and complete reverts [three, to be specific] between 04:54, 22 Sept 2004 and 10:43, 22 Sept 2004 at Template:Sep11)
  8. [13] (five reverts between 04:07, 22 Sept 2004 and 06:37, 23 Sept 2004 on Enclave, now protected)
  9. [14] (five reverts between 17:54, 1 Sept 2004 and 18:39, 1 Sept 2004 on Henry Kissinger)
  10. [15] (three reverts between 09:31, 29 Aug 2004 and 14:03, 30 Aug 2004; reversions of likely wrong removals by User:Gene Poole, so may not be applicable as "edit wars"; on Sealand)
Comment: Use of the phrase "likely wrong removals" above relating to my edits of the stated article is incorrect. I have almost completely re-written this article, and in so doing I have extensively added - not removed - valid content. Gzornenplatz has added no valid content at all, but instead has instituted edit warring by repeatedly deleting valid content or introducing prolific unneccessary instances of scare quotes. --Gene_poole 22:05, 4 Oct 2004 (UTC)

Applicable policies

{list the policies that apply to the disputed conduct}

  1. Wikipedia:Three revert rule
  2. Wikipedia:Don't disrupt Wikipedia to illustrate a point
  3. Wikipedia:Wikiquette (not really a policy, I suppose)
  4. Wikipedia:No personal attacks

Evidence of trying and failing to resolve the dispute

(provide diffs and links)

  1. [16], history edit summaries (Nagaland),
  2. [17], [18] (George W. Bush)
  3. Talk:List of island nations, various pieces of evidence that Australia is, in fact, an island nation
  4. Template_talk:Sep11
  5. Talk:Enclave

Users certifying the basis for this dispute

(sign with ~~~~)

  1. ugen64 02:04, Oct 4, 2004 (UTC)
  2. GeneralPatton 02:11, 4 Oct 2004 (UTC)
  3. VV 02:12, 4 Oct 2004 (UTC) It's only fair to add however that the 3RR still (contrary to name) merely has the status of a guideline.

Other users who endorse this summary

(sign with ~~~~)

  1. -- Grunt 🇪🇺 02:11, 2004 Oct 4 (UTC)

Response

This is a summary written by the user whose conduct is disputed, or by other users who think that the dispute is unjustified and that the above summary is biased or incomplete.

I would be all too happy to follow the three-revert rule, provided it is enforced against everyone. I did follow it for months, only to see that nothing happened to those who don't, such as VeryVerily and Gene Poole. The description above is false, it is not me who has refused to discuss things. On Template:Sep11, for example, I explained my edit, I responded to comments by others, but my opponent in the edit war, VeryVerily, did not explain his edits in the slightest. On Nagaland, Simonides, without doing the slightest to explain his edit (i.e. he didn't say what he thought was wrong about the map which he insisted on describing as inaccurate), instead asked me to prove a negative (when I said there is nothing wrong with it, he said "prove it")! Gzornenplatz 02:38, Oct 4, 2004 (UTC)

Users who endorse this summary (sign with ~~~~):

  1. VV 06:54, 4 Oct 2004 (UTC) Mostly agree. I stopped following the 3RR in April when it was not enforced against 172 while I was complying with it, and that was when we had quickpolls to enforce it! Gz's assessment of Nagaland seems sound; I don't know what the hell Simonides was on about. Of course we part on T:Sep11 (where (a) his edit was absurd and (b) I knew from experience all the discussion in the world wouldn't stop his edit warring - I guess part of this complaint), and he didn't try to defend the others.

Outside view

This is a summary written by users not directly involved with the dispute but who would like to add an outside view of the dispute.

It is never proper to engage in edit wars and Gzornenplatz shows a history of doing just that, so I do not disagree with the main complaint. That being said, other users have exacerbated the problem by themselves participating in edit wars with Gzornenplatz. Frustration is no call for exhibiting the same behaviour as what Gzornenplatz is being accused of.

Users who endorse this summary (sign with ~~~~):

  1. Netoholic @ 02:28, 2004 Oct 4 (UTC)
  2. —No-One Jones (m) 12:04, 4 Oct 2004 (UTC)
  3. Michael Snow 22:19, 4 Oct 2004 (UTC) I removed User:Davidcannon from the statement regarding Nagaland above, as it's hardly fair to lump him in based on a single revert that preceded the main edit war between Simonides and Gzornenplatz. Otherwise I agree that it generally takes two to edit war. Since some of the recurring participants say they would abide by it if it were enforced, I think it might be time to reconsider enforcing the 3-revert limit with 24-hour blocks.
    • Although I would have in the day, I would certainly oppose such a measure now. It will never be done impartially, and anyway the 3RR just gives the game to the majority (mob) with little incentive to accommodate other views (not to mention sockpuppet armies). VV 00:44, 5 Oct 2004 (UTC)
  4. Samboy 22:40, 4 Oct 2004 (UTC) As an aside, I need to point out that User:Gene Poole is undergoing arbitration against me right now; this does not excuse Gzornenplatz's behavior, of course.
  5. -- Grunt 🇪🇺 22:48, 2004 Oct 4 (UTC)
  6. [[User:Neutrality|Neutrality (talk)]] 00:37, Oct 5, 2004 (UTC)

Discussion

All signed comments and talk not related to a vote or endorsement, should be directed to this page's discussion page.

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