Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Capture of Ninh Binh

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was redirect‎ to Garnier Expedition#Capture of Ninh Bình. Eddie891 ^Talk _Work 14:54, 19 May 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Capture of Ninh Bình

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Capture of Ninh Bình (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View log | edits since nomination)

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Fundamentally based on 19th-century French colonial primary sources with no verification from independent or Vietnamese historical accounts. A thorough search finds no mention of the “Capture of Ninh Binh” in Vietnamese historiography or modern reliable sources. The article therefore relies entirely on colonial-era narratives, which are highly prone to bias, exaggeration, and imperialist framing, one look at the article and you’ll understand. Per WP:V, WP:HISTRS, and WP:NPOV historical topics must be supported by reputable, secondary sources and not solely colonial accounts. Without independent corroboration, this article promotes a one-sided, questionable version of history that does not meet Wikipedia’s sourcing or notability standards. Therefore, deletion is the appropriate course. More detailed historical issues are explained further on the article’s Talk page — Preceding unsigned comment added by OutsidersInsight (talk • contribs) 12:01, 26 April 2025 (UTC) .[reply]

• Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Events, History, Military, Vietnam, and France. WCQuidditch ☎ ✎ 05:07, 27 April 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Keep Article is fully sourced. No issue with French colonial sources. Colonial-era narratives are reliable sources. The sources used are not primary, and independent corroboration is not required for WP:GNG. Hawkeye7 (discuss) 05:39, 27 April 2025 (UTC)[reply]

It relies almost entirely on French colonial-era sources from the 1870s–1880s (Romanet du Caillaud, Charton, d’Estampes, Société académique indochinoise). Only two modern sources (Phạm 1985 and Short 2014) are cited, and neither independently corroborates the extraordinary claim (7 men capturing 1,700 soldiers). Per WP:HISTRS and WP:RS, such extraordinary historical claims require strong independent confirmation, which is missing here. Article currently gives a misleading sense of undisputed fact. OutsidersInsight (talk) 09:36, 27 April 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, asilvering (talk) 03:43, 5 May 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, ✗plicit 06:39, 12 May 2025 (UTC)[reply]

• Keep but severely trim of Gulliver's adventures and epic poetry: "When the mist and darkness dissipated in the morning, the French could see several hundreds of soldiers looking at them on the walls" Really? --Altenmann >talk 07:18, 12 May 2025 (UTC)[reply]
• redirect to Garnier Expedition#Capture_of_Ninh_Bình from which this appears to have been copied. I'm not seeing why this needs to be taken out of that context other than to simply generate a higher article count, and issues about sourcing need to be dealt with there in any case. Mangoe (talk) 11:19, 12 May 2025 (UTC)[reply]
• Redirect to Garnier Expedition#Capture_of_Ninh_Bình. Good catch Mangoe. Its seems like there is repetition from the expediton article. Not sure why this one is seperated when it is simialr size to section it was extarcted from. Ramos1990 (talk) 06:59, 19 May 2025 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.