Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Lo Walker

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

~~The result was keep. Consensus leans towards keep on this nomination. Nakon 03:16, 4 March 2015 (UTC)~~ The results was No consensus. Nakon 22:21, 5 March 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Lo Walker

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Only claim to fame is being mayor of a 60k population town; doesn't come close to meeting WP:NPOL. OhNoitsJamie ^Talk 00:51, 10 February 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Comment Ohnoitsjamie sought to kill five Bossier City mayor articles in a period of seven minutes on Feb. 10. He moved against Lo Walker at the time .51; against Jake W. Cameron at .47, at Marvin Anding at .49, at Hoffman fuller at .46, and Burgess McCranie at .44. I suppose this means 12:51 a.m. for Mr. Walker but am not sure, maybe 12:51 p.m. How could he read and analyze five revised articles in seven minutes? Billy Hathorn (talk) 19:44, 12 February 2015 (UTC) He also moved against George Nattin at .52.Billy Hathorn (talk) 20:04, 12 February 2015 (UTC)[reply]

delete non-notable local politician per WP:POLITICIAN Deunanknute (talk) 01:52, 10 February 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Comment approximately an hour after the nominations for deletion by ohnoitsjamie, User:Deunanknute posted the line: delete non-notable local politician per WP:POLITICIAN. Several of those "delete" statements for all six Bossier City mayors being challenged were made in the same minute of time. Billy Hathorn (talk) 19:57, 12 February 2015 (UTC)[reply]

weak delete has more news coverage than most local mayors, but most of it is routine. Nwlaw63 (talk) 03:53, 10 February 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Delete per nom. Nothing that sets this small-town mayor above the crowd. Clarityfiend (talk) 23:20, 10 February 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Keep The notability rules say nothing about mayors or the size of their cities. Portland, Maine, has a population 5,000 larger than Bossier City, but it has 24 mayors all deemed notable with their own Wikipedia articles. There are ten articles on Bossier City mayors, all but two recently submitted.

Bangor, Maine, a city about half the size of Bossier City, has eight mayors on Wikipedia and twelve city council members. Many times city council members are excluded from Wikipedia unless they have held other offices. There are no articles on Bossier City Council members.

Here is a listing of certain cities, followed by population, and number of mayoral Wikipedia articles:

Scranton, Pennsylvania, 76,000, 6
Harrisburg, Pennsylvania, 50,000, 6
Burlington, Vermont, 42,000, 6
Augusta, Maine, 19,000, 7
New London, Connecticut, 28,000, 5
Terre Haute, Indiana, 61,000, 4
Wasilla, Alaska, 8,000, 5
Hoboken, New Jersey, 50,000, 23
Juneau, Alaska, 31,000, 18
Key West, Florida, 25,000, 8
Medford, Oregon, 56,000, 12
Norwalk, Connecticut, 85,600, 87
East Orange, New Jersey, 64,000, 6
Taunton, Massachusetts, 56,000, 13
Wilmington, Delaware, 70,000, 10
Santa Fe, New Mexico, 70,000, 10
Ashland, Kentucky, 22,000, 27
Melbourne, Florida, 76,000, 33
Fairbanks, Alaska, 32,000, 7
Missoula, Montana, 66,000, 16
Lancaster, Pennsylvania, 59,000, 41

So Bossier City, Louisiana, 61,000 10 is consistent with the above listing.

All these Bossier City mayors should be considered notable. There is considerable sourcing on Mr. Walker. Billy Hathorn (talk) 02:19, 22 January 2015 (UTC)[reply]

comment - Wikipedia also says notability is not determined by similar articles. See WP:WHATABOUTX.
Comment. Have you actually examined the "sources"? The only one that even edges into the same county as notability is from a local newspaper. Clarityfiend (talk) 08:30, 11 February 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Comment If you look closely at the articles about the mayors from those towns, you'll see that most of them went on to do more notable things (i.e., become a governor or member of congress). OhNoitsJamie ^Talk 15:37, 11 February 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Louisiana-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 18:19, 11 February 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Politicians-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 18:19, 11 February 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Keep - WP:POLOUTCOMES notes that "Mayors of cities of at least regional prominence have usually survived AFD, although the article should say more than just 'Jane Doe is the mayor of Cityville'." This referenced article about a mayor of a city of regional prominence does say more than that. 24.151.10.165 (talk) 18:36, 11 February 2015 (UTC)[reply]

comment- is Bossier City, Louisiana regionally prominent? And again, how is this person notable? Deunanknute (talk) 18:55, 11 February 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Note In Hoboken, New Jersey, smaller than Bossier City, seventeen of 22 mayors with Wikipedia articles served in no higher office; a few had been on the city council before becoming mayors. Five others also held other offices, mostly in the state legislature. There is nothing in the Wikipedia rules about mayors and population of their cities. Mr. Walker is well-known regionally and should qualify as the first Republican mayor of Bossier City if other grounds are insufficient.Billy Hathorn (talk) 19:35, 11 February 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Further comment. Four of the five mayors with Wikipedia articles of Scranton, Pennsylvania, about 10,000 larger than Bossier City, served in no higher position than mayor. A sixth, Terence V. Powderly was also a figure in organized labor. All the Scranton and Bossier City mayors should be declared notable. Billy Hathorn (talk) 20:10, 12 February 2015 (UTC)[reply]
comment These articles were probably all nominated at the same time for the same reason I've been commenting at the same time; for a group of very similar articles, it's sometimes easier to research them together. Also, please only add comments to the end of a discussion. Deunanknute (talk) 23:05, 12 February 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Delete Bossier City is not regionally important enough of populous enough to justify this article. Other stuff exists is not a workable argument.John Pack Lambert (talk) 04:36, 14 February 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Comment. Bossier City is either the second or third fast-growing city in the state has been for some time. The population is believed to be past 65,000. You should not demean the city because of its size. Billy Hathorn (talk) 16:10, 15 February 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Keep or redirect to the city There is never a need to delete mayor articles when they can be redirected to the city article and a list made there. --Richard Arthur Norton (1958- ) (talk) 06:24, 14 February 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Keep - Elected mayor of a city of 60,000 people should be sufficient for a WP:Politician pass as an important local figure. Here's my personal benchmark: 50,000+ for mayor, 100,000+ for city councillor. Carrite (talk) 12:47, 17 February 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so a clearer consensus may be reached.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, NORTH AMERICA¹⁰⁰⁰ 14:21, 18 February 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Keep. With all respect to the good faith of every participant here, I sense a tendency to equate "city of regional importance" with "city I've heard of". From the standpoint of Wikipedians based in East and West Coast urban centers, or outside the USA, Louisiana occupies little mind space, and "Bossier City" is a ridiculous-sounding name. To those unfamiliar with the region, it doesn't evoke a city larger than (say) Harrisburg, Pennsylvania (which it is). We should pay attention to the population numbers and avoid jumping to an impressionistic conclusion. Kestenbaum (talk) 21:50, 19 February 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so a clearer consensus may be reached.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, NORTH AMERICA¹⁰⁰⁰ 17:17, 25 February 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Delete Small-town mayors are generally not notable. I see a "region" as being an area several states in size, Shreveport would be a city of "regional prominence", Bossier City is not. WP:OTHERSTUFFEXISTS is not a useful rebuttal. Geogene (talk) 22:36, 26 February 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Comment The Wikipedia rules do not mention "small-town mayors" or population of cities. Bossier City is some 65,000 as is the ninth largest in the state. Such mayors come under "local politicians" with adequate media coverage. Mr. Walker hence qualifies. He could also qualify as the first ever Republican mayor of the city.Billy Hathorn (talk) 15:20, 27 February 2015 (UTC)[reply]

That's true, I was referring to common AfD outcomes, not the policy. The policy says: Just being an elected local official, or an unelected candidate for political office, does not guarantee notability, although such people can still be notable if they meet the primary notability criterion of "significant coverage in reliable sources that are independent of the subject of the article. (WP:GNG) We can disagree on the definition of significant there, but I don't consider that the same as saying, in effect, "If I can find some sources, then this person is notable." As for being notable for being the first Republican mayor there, wouldn't that argument imply that the first Republican (Democrat/Libertarian/Green/etc) elected mayor in any city of any size would be automatically notable for party affiliation alone? Geogene (talk) 17:58, 27 February 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Comment. First Republican in South, first black, first woman mayor quality on that basis alone. The sources are independent of the subject.Billy Hathorn (talk) 20:17, 27 February 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Just so the above remark doesn't cause confusion, Lo Walker is neither black nor a woman. But being elected as a Republican in the South is the same kind of thing? Geogene (talk) 20:39, 27 February 2015 (UTC)[reply]

By 2005, being elected as a Republican in the South was hardly surprising. You almost wonder, what took them so long? --MelanieN (talk) 02:56, 2 March 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Notice Some seven new paragraphs have been added to the article. Mr. Walker is the first Republican mayor of Bossier City. At one time this was an unusual development.Billy Hathorn (talk) 23:39, 28 February 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Weak delete He is NOT notable per WP:POLITICIAN, since he was not mayor of a city of regional prominence; Bossier City isn't even the parish seat. And population numbers are irrelevant; despite assertions that 50,000 or 100,000 or whatever population makes a mayor automatically notable, no such number has ever achieved consensus. It doesn't matter if some other mayors of some other cities have articles; WP:OTHERSTUFFEXISTS is not a valid argument. I am saying "weak delete" because there is one media story significantly about him - a human interest story about him (at age 81) dating a 79-year-old former sweetheart. Otherwise coverage is routine and local. The fact that he is the first Republican mayor of his particular town is not noteworthy; this is an international encyclopedia after all, not a chronicle of every political development in every small-to-medium-sized town in every country in the world.. --MelanieN (talk) 02:56, 2 March 2015 (UTC)[reply]

P.S. I would also be OK with Richard Arthur Norton's suggestion (above) of a redirect to the city article (which surprisingly does not have a list of its former mayors, but it could). --MelanieN (talk) 03:07, 2 March 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Comment. (1) I've read a great many Wikipedia articles on specific cities, and very, very few of them feature a complete list of past mayors. (2) It seems a bit disingenuous to complain that Bossier City isn't the parish seat, when it has the same name as the parish and contains the majority of the parish's population. (3) Cities are typically ranked and classified based on population; I know there's no precise threshold, but the more people a city has, the more important it is. If someone were to discuss the relative importance of say Phoenix and Tucson, the first thing mentioned would be their populations. Kestenbaum (talk) 01:55, 3 March 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Comment. I think population numbers count, but there are other factors that can be used to define "prominence". Cultural importance, broadly defined, is one. If hardly anyone outside of an area has heard about a particular city, that says something meaningful about that city's prominence that population comparisons don't capture. Geogene (talk) 02:15, 3 March 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Just added Washington Times source on Mr. Walker. There is a template of Bossier City mayors at the bottom of the Bossier City article. The article is too long to redirect to the Bossier City page itself.Billy Hathorn (talk) 05:03, 2 March 2015 (UTC) Also added Biz Magazine. Billy Hathorn (talk) 05:22, 2 March 2015 (UTC) and The Forum Newsweekly.Billy Hathorn (talk) 14:52, 2 March 2015 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.