Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Thad Ackel (2nd nomination)

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was delete. Although two editors experienced in writing about horse-related topics thought there was enough coverage to write a full article, nobody else did, and the general consensus is he is only known for one event. If somebody wants to create a redirect to Great Communicator, that can be done separately. Ritchie333 ^(talk) ^(cont) 10:48, 8 August 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Thad Ackel

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part owner of one notable horse is not notability. DGG ( talk ) 20:23, 17 July 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Louisiana-related deletion discussions. CAPTAIN RAJU^(T) 22:29, 17 July 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Businesspeople-related deletion discussions. CAPTAIN RAJU^(T) 22:29, 17 July 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Merge/redirect with the article for the horse itself, Great Communicator. He was also the trainer of the horse, and the Los Angeles Times article which was linked on the Thad Ackel page is a fine source. Other than that article, I can't find any decent sources on Ackel that aren't related to Great Communicator. Gilded Snail (talk) 23:58, 17 July 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Keep: He was the horse trainer of The Great Communicator; that's the notable bit. We are working on come "case law" for these racing articles, so to speak, and I think this is a good example of a "floor" for notability. It is true that his fame is linked to one horse, but one could say much the same of Lucien Laurin (who trained Secretariat). Under the guidlines of NHORSERACING, his wins were in Grade I races and among those was a Breeders' Cup win, which is a prestige win at the highest level, (see equibase.) so sketchy as the article is, we must note that he won in the late 1980s, which is pre-Google, so source content is a bit trickier to locate. I did see him covered in neutral third-party sources here (discussing that he had become an owner), in the LA Times as a trainer of "fleeting fame", but a pretty solid interview. The Great Communicator article is also a bit short, but both of them independently meet our guidelines for adequate notability in the SNG plus have sufficient coverage to meet the policy of WP:N. Montanabw^(talk) 04:26, 21 July 2017 (UTC)[reply]
Keep. Being the trainer of a horse like Great Communicator confers notability; being an owner really doesn't. This guy won several G1 races, including the Breeders Cup, one of the biggest races in America. The notability rule for racehorse trainers or jockeys says that one G1 win is enough but more are preferred. White Arabian Filly ^Neigh 21:19, 21 July 2017 (UTC)[reply]
Redirect to Great Communicator; not independently notable and Wikipedia does not need two articles on these closely related topics. Anything useful can be picked up from the article history. K.e.coffman (talk) 03:23, 22 July 2017 (UTC)[reply]
- Frankly, "two similar articles" isn't a notability argument (we have separate articles for a lot of teams who are notable as a team, by analogy, note that Stiller and Meara also have Jerry Stiller and Anne Meara) If consensus is for a merge (which I oppose), I'd go the other direction. The horse and the trainer/owner are of roughly equal notability. But the horse's career is finished, the human will be around a while.

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, North America¹⁰⁰⁰ 11:53, 24 July 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, North America¹⁰⁰⁰ 01:10, 31 July 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Delete. Training one marginally notable horse and then exiting the business does not confer notability. See the aptly titled LA Times article "Fame Was Fleeting for These Three Trainers". The other two don't have pages either. Clarityfiend (talk) 03:39, 3 August 2017 (UTC)[reply]
Delete. He trained one name horse, and having that connection does not confer notability. Being a trainer does not automatically convey notability, either, unless you train a once-in-a-human-lifetime horse such as Secretariat. From what I can see, there was one featured article about him, which does not meet the standard of significant coverage in multiple sources. Sorry. Bearian (talk) 15:52, 7 August 2017 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.